DH says everybody keeps track of their finances by logging receipts

[shewhowines]

After another long night of DH huffing and puffing "doing the finances", we had the age old discussion of him saying he needs to, because that is the only way and most people do it like that (his mum does), and me saying 90% of people don't do it his way.

He makes me keep every receipt and he logs every single item we buy, on a complicated spreadsheet. He uses this to forecast our expenses so that he can transfer money if necessary. Can I just add, he is not controlling as to what I spend. It's just if I spend it, or get money out, I must keep the receipt. The system obviously works, but it is sooo time consuming. I wouldn't mind, but then I have to put up with him moaning.

I say that most people work retrospectively. They scan through their credit card bill to make sure there are no errors, and correlate this with their bank statement. Money can be transferred if necessary, at that point.

I am right aren't I? Nobody keeps their receipts and meticulously logs every bloody transaction.

DH read the thread last night. Was very interested in everyone's different methods. His main concern is that looking at online banking shows your current balance, but does not take into account transactions done, but not yet showing.

As 95% of the receipts are mine, we agreed that, each month, he would transfer a set amount of roughly what I would normally spend with a buffer in place. I would then tell him the total at the end of each month for him to reconcile with our other outgoings, thus he doesn't need to do anything with the bloody receipts! Then he started getting cold feet... So now he's going to think of the best way to lose the receipts control freak . My mission in life is now to make him do so, preferably without any extra work for me

yoko interestingly he answered yes to a lot of the questions regarding OCPD. He didn't fit the profile of the medical definition of OCPD, but he definitely has traits of it.

The bugger liked the fact that so many of you account for every mars bar. He suggested that we do that instead of just logging the ATM withdrawals as cash I think he was joking . So now I may have made things worse for myself he'd better be bloody joking, or there will definitely be divorce. Thanks people!

I don't know about 'everyone' but I certainly keep track of every single transaction, direct debit, receipt and cash withdrawal. I went through some very tough times financially once and what started as a necessity is now just a good habit.

OP, my recent transactions all show when I look at my bank account, apart from cheques. Purchases via switch and cash point withdrawals seem to show up almost straight away even if the money hasn't gone out of our account yet. I think your DH just likes obsessively looking at all the receipts and working everything out. This is fine as long as he doesn't treat it like a necessary job that he can moan about.

While on holiday a couple of years ago, I bought something with a credit card - the transaction was done manually on one of those old-fashioned sliding machines.

When I got home, I downloaded my credit card bill, and the transaction amount had changed - from hundreds to thousands of pounds. I queried this with my credit card company. Their stance was that due to the international nature of the transaction, there was nothing they could do unless I had the original credit card receipt showing the correct amount.

Fortunately (and abnormally, according to this thread), I did.

Earning a good salary is one part of building financial independence and security - the other part is ensuring that you're not pissing cash away. My car has a petrol gauge and a speedometer so I can judge how my journey is going; maintaining accounts provides a similar benefit to my finances.

It is possible to download the bank's accounts, but this means that I have to do the rounds of several bank websites, and doesn't show pending transactions, such as uncleared cheques etc. They also typically keep only six months/a year of transactions available online, which is no good for answering questions like 'how much did I pay for building insurance last year?'.

Setting up a system to manage your finances is painful and takes ages, but maintaining it should be quick and easy. There are several software packages designed to do this - I use moneydance - and most will sync with your phone, so you can log when you make the transaction.

OP - with my lovely accounting package your DH could scan his receipts in and store them online... getting tempted yet?

Oh, and while debit card transactions do generally turn up quickly in your account, this isn't always the case. I had a weekly grocery shop in Sainsbury not turn up for six weeks; similarly a transaction in Tesco has never appeared (woo! free shopping!). Amazon don't charge until they dispatch - if it's not in stock, then that's more money in your bank account that's earmarked.

If you're working on the basis of 'if it's in my account, I can spend it', then a delayed weekly shop arriving at the end of the month could easily push you into overdraft.

evilkitten I don't think it's unusual to hang on to receipts, especially for large or unusual purchases. It's just reconciling them on a regular basis that's a bit crazy. I have receipts either in my purse for recent transactions or in an envelope for older ones and could lay my hands on them easily if something arose like needing to return an item. I don't do anything with them in the meantime though and just shred when I think they are no longer needed.

Evelkitten- I think most people keep their receipts. There's just no point going through them unless something doesn't seem right . I write very few cheques nowadays (about four a year, maybe) so it's not difficult to remember if there is an uncleared one that may come out at any moment.

You can ensure that you are "not pissing cash away" just by looking at your bank account every now and then and working out roughly what you spend money on. It doesn't have to be a constant time consuming process.

Regarding only being able to see six months/a year of transactions... Have you checked whether this is the case recently. I can now download statements from 2006 with my bank.

We definitely don't log every cash purchase - only ones on the cards. When we withdraw cash, it is listed under whatever budget it comes under (usually personal allowance), and that's it.

I think it works well as a system, and as dh does it all, it is almost faff-free for me!

The same thing happened to me, kitten, on a hol abroad. The sales assistant had included a detailed list of clothes and cosmetics to bump up my bill by adding a 0. As I had the receipt I was able to challenge that transaction and I was reimbursed.

Im an unusual sort, judging by this thread, in that I keep most receipts and log most spends in a book. Largely because Ive been so poor and have had to watch - literally - every penny. Also so I can take things back, return things. Id probably use an app if I cba but a book does it for me. I can see what I spend on what, add up in columns each month to see whats been going on. I can get a bit addictive about things - being horribly poor for years can make me spendthrift at times - and its only by looking at what I'm spending that I can detect when Ive gone a bit mad on something, spent too much.

I like being organised and in control of my money so that it does what I want, not the other way around. I also spot when Ive been overcharged. If I hadn't been so poor I doubt I would have developed this skill but Im very glad I have.

Exactly. I keep receipts in my bag for a while, in case I need to return something. And I file big receipts (washing machine etc).

But fgs - keeping a receipt for a newspaper? For a Costa Coffee?

As someone said upthread, all this Scrooge-like penny pinching will come home to roost. Pil were like this. Were mean their whole lives. They ended up with hundreds of thousands of pounds of savings. The whole lot has gone into the coffers of care homes. The whole lot. House sold. They could have done some good with that money but if they are like others on this thread then I suppose it pleased them to write in a book every time they spent 62p.

The question you / he haven't answered OP is WHY he needs to keep track of the 'actual' balance of your bank account, at every moment.

What does he do with this information? How does it help him (other than feeding a mental fixation, which is actually a burden)?

If you were living very close to your overdraft limit and a small transaction could push you over the edge, or, if you were a crazed spendthrift, prone to making major and unaffordable purchases on a whim, I could see the point. But you've said that's not the case.

Here's a suggestion - agree all major purchases, or those that fall outside 'standard and expected' categories in advance (your definition will depend on your means, for us it's anything other than groceries, insurance - or anything else that is expected, over about £100).

Check regular bills and expenses periodically, maybe every six months or a year, so you can see if you're spending more on fuel, insurance and groceries etc. and can decide what to do about it.

That way - given that you're not on the edge of solvency - there really cannot be any unpleasant surprises, so no need to worry about the difference between your balance now and in a few days time. Simple!

That's how I budget, in three categories:

• dd into household account, checked and adjusted annually.
• budget for personal spending, checked and adjusted annually.
• Amount budgeted for 'major purchases', discussed and agreed individually.

Obviously, if you're running one joint account, the first two would be combined. The essential thing is that you've budgeted realistically, and are aware enough of your budget not to overspend massively. Voila!

The only reason I check totals monthly is because we are living very close to our overdraft limit, which is a cashflow issue, not a budgeting one.

It's good budgeting that keeps costs down, not observing cash flow passively, as your DH seems to be doing.

Keeping receipts for major or unusual purchases, checking receipts for mistakes, or even holding onto all receipts for a couple of weeks before chucking the small ones, is totally normal evilkitten and others, and utterly different from what the OP is talking about.

If you have a budget and don't have a very tight cashflow, then a supermarket taking six weeks to take payment doesn't matter at all. You're still going to do the same amount of supermarket shopping, you're just in credit for longer.

Yes, a few large items coinciding could test a normally healthy cashflow and push you into / over your overdraft, so checking for buffering around large purchases can be sensible but you won't actually have spent more.

People who view money in their account as 'money available to spend', in a way that could be a problem, are people without any sense of budgeting. That is the problem and logging past spending without looking at patterns, drawing conclusions and adjusting future spending, is completely pointless.

online banking shows your current balance, but does not take into account transactions done, but not yet showing.

Yes, it does. The 'available balance' shown on online banking systems takes into account pending transactions; it is the amount you could go and withdraw right now at a cashpoint.

Looking at the OP, it seems that her husband is using the receipts to record transactions in a spreadsheet which is then reconciled with the bank's accounts. That seems to be a perfectly reasonable thing to do to me - the bank is not infallible, and it's certainly not on your side.

I do this - either at point of purchase or later on. I record date, person paid, amount and categorise it into what it is (e.g. groceries, fuel, childcare, mortgage etc.). I do this for all banking transactions, not for cash.

This should not take long to do.

If it is taking a long time, then it would suggest that either you're spending far too much (i.e. too many transactions), or the spreadsheet isn't up to the job. Consider moving to a proper software package.

Once you have this sort of financial organisation, then it really does start to become useful. For example, my tax return takes about an hour to complete, I know exactly what direct debits are in place (they aren't all monthly), I have a history of insurance premiums, so I can spot if it's being jacked up, I know when introductory rates on savings etc. are coming to an end, I am alerted to any major changes in share portfolio etc.

I don't obsess over it, but it allows me to get on with life in the knowledge that everything is under control. I really wouldn't consider it to be a personality disorder.

evilkitten- it's obviously fine to check all your receipts if you like doing it but I'd be really surprised if it saves you much money in your lifetime because of all the mistakes you pick up. If you really are findings lots of mistakes you should switch banks. I am certain that I would pick up an errors my bank makes, particularly large ones straight away just by looking at my bank balance online every couple of days. Going through all receipts seems unnecessary and time consuming in the 21st century.

YANBU

I used to do it the way your DH does it when I was young and single and had time to do it. DH used to do it in the early days of our marriage (we have been married 20 yrs) but since the advent of on-line banking and the proliferation of cash point machines and different methods of paying for stuff we just don't bother any more. Life is too short.

DH does look at the bank account almost daily but he is an accountant and he has a system for drawing money from his business and putting it into the joint account. However, we don't keep receipts or list everything we have bought. There is no need and anyway, sometimes it is difficult to have a receipt if you buy on-line for instance (a waste of paper to print off every on-line order notification surely?) and tbh, if I had to explain every receipt to DH these days it would really piss me off. I would feel like I was being held to account for what I spent even if I really wasn't. We both have a rough idea of what there is to spend and we have a pattern of spending that we understand so there aren't any surprises.

it works for us but if your DH's way is not working for you as well has him then it might be time for a chat. It is all very well being on top of things but if it feels a bit controlling, even if it isn't and if it is causing him to moan then is it really worth it?

The 'available balance' shown on online banking systems takes into account pending transactions; it is the amount you could go and withdraw right now at a cashpoint.

Good luck with that.

The 'pending transactions' in the bank's eyes are things like BACS transfers which are in the system, but not yet executed. They don't include cheques which you've just written to the school, or the direct debit for the TV licence which comes out of the account annually, but you've forgotten about. Or a debit card transaction which has been taken in a shop, but not yet processed by the back office systems.

Is he an accountant? If not, get him to retrain as one so his anal habits can earn him good money. The treasury good do with a number cruncher like your dh.

Once something is in the spreadsheet/financial software and reconciled, there is no need to keep the receipt unless you need it for business or guarantee purposes. There's certainly no need to print out online order notifications - not sure why you would think there is?

The "pending transactions" in my bank account does include direct debits. I put most other purchases on credit card so I get about three weeks advance warning before that goes out of my account. I don't forget about cheques as I write so few.

whatever - the mistakes I pick up are incidental to the reason I record it, but they're certainly significant. Changing banks doesn't help - I have accounts with HSBC, NatWest, LLoyds, Virgin, Tesco and First Direct. Most of those have made at least one error - not always significant, but usually in their favour. Typically this is pennies, but was £300 on one occasion last year.

The benefit of recording transactions etc. really comes from having the information available to make your money work for you readily available.

I can spot mistakes just by glancing over my online accounts every couple of weeks.

And yes, they happen - not the bank itself but, in the last week, a fuel company over-charging on a dd that they should have stopped and a company running the same transaction through twice (then, after I'd spent half an hour online with them, 'dealing with it' by cancelling both, so my account, not just the 'extra' one. Truly Skype and not just for this, you are the most customer-unfriendly, clunkily-run bunch of twits I've ever encountered. Outside a fuel or water company of course). Grr and double grrr.

I also know which receipts are worth checking e.g. Asda, not so keen on the overcharging e.g. for 4x4 samosas instead of 4 but, thanks for the free gin!

whatever - Which bank is that? I know I've got a direct debit to E.ON on 22 Nov (amongst others), but there's nothing showing at all in the 'pending transactions' section of HSBC online banking. If I could make it show that, it would be useful, as I'm not paid until 25th.

Evilkitten- I only see the direct debits that will be coming out in the next day. It's not really an issue with monthly direct debits though anyway as almost exactly the same amount goes out every month. I never sign up for annual or sporadic direct debits. I wouldn't dream of having loads of different current accounts. That also seems unnecessarily complicated.

Lottiegarbanzo- I know what you mean about checking supermarket receipts, particularly the so called "meal deals."