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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to ask for your help in writing an objection to Operation Christmas Child?

692 replies

autumnwinds · 02/11/2013 12:57

Our local primary is supporting OCC and has published a piece in the village magazine explaining how wonderful it is and how much the local children enjoy it, what a difference it makes to needy children, and inviting local residents to donate too. The piece omits any reference to the evangelical christian literature that is distributed with the parcels and the way that the gifts are used as a tool to agressively convert recipients to christianity.

I would like to write a reply for publishing in next month's issue trying to give the full picture so that people can make an informed choice about whether to donate to this charity, and to suggest some alternatives that don't come with the religious baggage.

As I don't have a child at the primary yet I'm not sure about tackling the school itself about it (they are not a faith school, so not sure they should be supporting this). DC will be starting next year so I might save that fight for next xmas!

Anyway does anyone have any ideas about a few lines I could write, something succinct and unemotional? I feel quite cross about it but don't want to come across as an equally fundamentalist atheist. I've been looking for some evidence on the web for people who want to know more but most of it is not well referenced...

OP posts:
exexpat · 08/11/2013 13:00

Brian - schools may not be setting out to deceive, because half the time they don't know about OCC's evangelical aims either, because - as you have admitted yourself in the past - the materials and presentations OCC makes to schools have not been making it clear. That was why you wrote the new leaflet for schools, remember? Shame you haven't been doing enough to promote it. Any intention to deceive/mislead comes from rather higher up the chain, I think.

This is what one parent on another thread said: "We got a very basic leaflet telling us what to put in the box. No mention of the evangelising."

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 13:16

Exexpat, as you know, I have recognised the disparity between what schools were being told about Operation Christmas Child and what churches were being told, in their respective 'guides'. Both guides have been removed and I wrote a new parent/teacher guide which has been active on the website since the end of September.

Most schools order or download resources for Operation Christmas Child in October. Since May 2013, ANYONE going to the Operation Christmas Child website lands on a page which has the following statement:

Since 1990, more than 100 million boys and girls in over 130 countries have experienced God’s love through the power of simple shoe box gifts from Operation Christmas Child. Samaritan’s Purse works with local churches and ministry partners to deliver the gifts and share the life-changing Good News of Jesus Christ.

We always give shoeboxes to children based on need, regardless of their background or religious beliefs. It’s an unconditional gift of love.

Where appropriate, with each shoebox, our church partners will offer a little booklet of Bible stories. They may also invite children receiving shoeboxes to join a discipleship course called The Greatest Journey. This is a “no strings attached” programme and participation is with the consent of their parent or guardian.

I think your concern that schools are still 'not in the know' is misplaced.

exexpat · 08/11/2013 13:22

So how come you still get so many people on these threads whose schools are getting involved, but who had no idea about the evangelism?

And what about the press releases for local newspapers?

puntasticusername · 08/11/2013 13:26

Operation Christmas Child has been advertised at my workplace, this month, with no mention whatsoever of the evangelical angle. Purely as a "nice thing to do" for deprived children at Christmas.

So, sorry Brian, but I think it may be your optimism that is misplaced.

MyDogEatsPoop · 08/11/2013 13:36

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

HorryIsUpduffed · 08/11/2013 13:39

I'm not suggesting schools are deliberately misleading children and parents, but somewhere between your organisation and bookbags the full implications are being lost. There are examples on this thread of schools which have withdrawn from the scheme, or transferred to similar projects through other organisations, once school management have fully realised your mission.

Your intention to be more open and clear about the evangelical side of the project is laudable - perhaps in next year's promotional material to schools you could push that even more and encourage the schools to make more of it in their letters home? I can see that for many/most denominational/maintained schools that would be a real positive that they'd be glad to promote; schools which are nominally non-denominational* would have a clearer idea of whether that was appropriate for their families/catchment.

  • try saying that fast twice without your teeth in Grin Wink
autumnwinds · 08/11/2013 13:42

Brian

Thanks for coming on this thread.

I started this thread because the school were asking local people to donate shoeboxes without passing on the information about the evangelical nature of your charity.

It is pretty clear that even if you are trying to be more open about your organisation (and your website is a good start compared to many others), the message isn't getting through to the people 'on the ground'. Which is what this thread is all about - making sure people make an informed choice.

Many people don't agree with evangelical missions of any type, Christian or otherwise. Other people do support your aims. I didn't intend to start an anti-evangelical or pro-evangelical argument. I just want people to make an informed choice when they choose what charities to donate to.

I hope you have more success next year in passing the message on, and then hopefully you will have no more of these threads to join in on Mumsnet! (Although maybe you'll become hooked on AIBU like the rest of us?!)

OP posts:
conkercon · 08/11/2013 13:52

Having visited my Ds's secondary school yesterday there were leaflets for OCC up all over the place. Nothing had come home though. My son said that his form tutor had asked every child to bring in something. I hope the OP doesn't mind me plagiarising some of her letter to send to the organiser at my DS's school.

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 14:54

autumnwinds I would much rather that I didn't need to be here, as I fear my workload is suffering! I am fully committed to making sure that there is no disparity, no 'grey areas', in what we communicate and doing all that we can reasonably be expected to do to ensure everyone s made aware.

I'd like to think that such informed choice, as you put it, would silence our critics, but I am not that naive! They will simply 'move the goalposts' ... so I'm sure I'll be back!

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:05

Horryisupduffed What's sad here is that Operation Christmas Child is being 'condemned' by a minority of people mostly because of local church involvement in distributing shoeboxes and their desire to share Jesus with their own children who is, after all, the 'reason for the season'.

There is such compassion in the hearts of children here for disadvantaged children overseas. They get it. They recognise how blessed they are to have so much and their natural response is to give something back. That's the beauty of this amazing programme. And as someone who has worked at both ends, it's a joy to behold.

I still have my own teeth!

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:16

Gotta go, be back later.

Have a nice afternoon, hope it's nicer where you are than where I am right now!

Brian

fromparistoberlin · 08/11/2013 15:18

everyone in entitled to an opinjuion

but of all the things to hate???? a box of gifts for a kid?

Its like your hatred for organised religion is so strong that it overshadows any benefit the children will get

anyway they wont even fucking read the leaflet!!!

badtime · 08/11/2013 15:23

Brian, If OCC is completely altruistic, surely it makes no difference to you if people give Christmas gifts through other charities and schemes?

If the aim is to give gifts, surely it doesn't matter where they come from.

exexpat · 08/11/2013 15:34

fromparistoberlin - if you read the thread, you would see it is not the box of gifts people are objecting to, it is the use of a box of gifts to evangelise, and also the promotion of the scheme in the UK without being clear about its aims. And it's not just a leaflet, it's a way in to a 12-step discipleship programme.

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:36

Just nipped back and saw a few more posts!

Dawndonnagain, it's a bit complicated. We have two websites, one that is exclusively Operation Christmas Child (OCC) and one that is Samaritan's Purse (SP); within the month, we hope to launch one website that encompasses both. Things like ordering resources, making donations, etc. are handled on the SP website; we link to the Resources page on there from the OCC website. Ostensibly you can't get to the Resources page on the SP website without going through the OCC website.

HorryIsUpduffed · 08/11/2013 15:39

There is such compassion in the hearts of children here for disadvantaged children overseas. They get it. They recognise how blessed they are to have so much and their natural response is to give something back. That's the beauty of this amazing programme. And as someone who has worked at both ends, it's a joy to behold.

Nobody "hates gifts for children" (although a pp does mention being in receipt of one in a previous year, despite her children and the rest of the class being not remotely in need).

The thread has repeatedly emphasised that Giving Generously To Those In Need is capturing the true spirit of Christmas - the greatest gift of all, "for God so loved the world that He gave His only Son, that those who believe in Him shall not perish, but have everlasting life" (Jn 3:16) which knocks an engraved iPad into a cocked hat.

But OCC is not the only way to Give Generously To Those In Need, and many of us believe it isn't the best way either.

Saying "You don't want poor children to have presents at Christmas" is a bit like Bounty saying "You don't want women to have their newborns' photos taken". Missing. The. Point.

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:40

Badtime I'm not sure if I'm 'hearing' you right, but we certainly don't claim exclusivity on giving gifts to needy children, the more people involved in doing this the better!

jellyboatsandpirates · 08/11/2013 15:41

but of all the things to hate???? a box of gifts for a kid?
Its like your hatred for organised religion is so strong that it overshadows any benefit the children will get
anyway they wont even fucking read the leaflet!!!

Well said, fromparistoberlin. Smile

HorryIsUpduffed · 08/11/2013 15:42

Badtime I'm not sure if I'm 'hearing' you right, but we certainly don't claim exclusivity on giving gifts to needy children, the more people involved in doing this the better!

In that case you should be agreeing with this thread, no?

jellyboatsandpirates · 08/11/2013 15:43

But OCC is not the only way to Give Generously To Those In Need

Nobody said it was. But people should be allowed to donate to if they want without people trying to take the choice away from them.

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:48

Exexpat, you are so naughty!

Let's be very clear about what Operation Christmas Child is! Here's the text, once again, for the Operation Christmas Child Parent/Teacher Guide which is on the Operation Christmas Child website:

Introduction

Since 1990, more than 100 million boys and girls in over 130 countries have experienced God’s love through the power of simple shoe box gifts from Operation Christmas Child. Samaritan’s Purse works with local churches and ministry partners to deliver the gifts and share the life-changing Good News of Jesus Christ.

We always give shoeboxes to children based on need, regardless of their background or religious beliefs; each gift-filled shoebox is an unconditional gift of love.

Where appropriate, with each shoebox, our church partners on the ground may offer a little book of Bible stories; The Greatest Gift.

They may also give children receiving gift-filled shoeboxes the opportunity to participate in The Greatest Journey discipleship programme, subject to the consent of their parents, carers or guardians, with ‘no strings attached’.

Good News, Great Joy
Operation Christmas Child: A Guide for Parents and Teachers

The mission of Operation Christmas Child is to demonstrate God’s love in a tangible way to children around the world and, together with the local Church worldwide, to share the Good News of Jesus Christ.

Since 1990, Operation Christmas Child – an initiative of the Christian relief and development agency Samaritan’s Purse – has been blessing underprivileged children around the world with gift-filled shoeboxes wrapped and packed by children and adults in the UK.

It’s a campaign that thousands of schools, churches and other organisations from across the UK get involved with between the September and November each year. In fact, it is now the UK’s largest children’s Christmas appeal.

The idea is simple. Children and adults wrap and pack shoeboxes with a range of gifts and take to a convenient ‘drop-off point’. We collect these gift-filled shoeboxes and, after processing for export purposes, we send them overseas where local churches distribute them to children, on the basis of need alone. Each shoebox is an unconditional gift, given to a child with nothing asked for, or expected in return; no pledges, no obligation to go to church or attend classes; ‘no strings attached’

These shoebox gifts are an expression of God’s love to us, and the gift of His Son Jesus at Christmas. They give local churches the opportunity to show God’s love to children in a tangible way and, during the distribution event, to share the Good News of Jesus Christ, perhaps through age-appropriate music, dance and puppet shows, or through a little book of Bible stories distributed with their shoebox, not inside it: The Greatest Gift.

A Life Touched

Thembani is 11 years old. His mother and father passed away some years ago, so Thembani now lives with his eight brothers and sisters high up in the hills of rural Swaziland, near South Africa.

When Operation Christmas Child came to his village, Thembani and each of his brothers and sisters received a shoebox filled with presents. “I really enjoyed opening the box,” said Thembani. “I’ve never received anything like this before.”

Thembani’s favourite gifts were his notebook, pens, and socks. “I love the notebook,” he said. “I am going to write in it all the time.”

An hour after the shoebox distribution, Thembani sat in the doorway of his home avidly drawing and writing in his new notebook. When asked how he felt about the gifts, he said, “I’m so happy, I’m tongue-tied!”

The gift that Thembani received was more than just a shoebox. It was the gift of education, and toys so he could be a child again. It was also a gift of love at Christmas, and the gift of hope for the future.

The hope is there because the same church that gave Thembani his shoebox has also been supported by Samaritan’s Purse to care for him and his siblings – providing them with food, clothing and ongoing loving care.

That’s the power of a shoebox gift – a gift that enabled an adult or child in the UK (who created it) and a local church in Swaziland (who distributed it) to touch the life of a child in need.

The Greatest Journey

The Greatest Journey is a voluntary follow-up course for children who have received shoeboxes through Operation Christmas Child, enabling them to interact with the Gospel, through Bible stories and Bible teaching.

The mission of The Greatest Journey is to help local churches overseas reach children with the Gospel, to establish them in their faith in Jesus Christ and to equip them to pray for and share the Gospel with their family and friends.

The Greatest Journey is a series of 12 lessons containing exciting Biblical content exclusively delivered and presented by trained volunteers from local churches, with training and all resources needed provided free of charge, at their request. Through this programme local believers are being empowered and enabled to share the Good News of Jesus Christ with children in their own communities.

Children completing The Greatest Journey are awarded a personal certificate and many will receive a special copy of the New Testament in their own language, which also contains Old Testament stories, colourful illustrations, memory verses and other learning aids. In many countries around the world, Bibles are rare, or hard to obtain; these Bibles become instant treasures, not only to the children receiving them but to their friends and families as well.

Not all children receiving shoeboxes will want, or be able to participate in The Greatest Journey, either by reason of their own free will, because there are no trained teachers in their locality to take the classes, or because resources for the children are not yet available - either in their local language or in sufficient quantities.

Why we Speak of Hope

In accordance with Article 18 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights by the UN, and Article 9 of the European Convention on Human Rights, we are committed to religious freedom as a fundamental human right. Thus, every person has the right to form their own religious convictions or ideological commitment - free and undisturbed - and to exercise their religion or belief and act according to its laws, including advertising it.

As a Christian organisation, our work is motivated by our Christian convictions and allows for the direct or indirect explanation of the foundations of our faith. However, and vitally, we reject any form of coercion, manipulation or exploitation of an emergency or a person’s situation in order to share our faith.

In accordance with Article 14 of the UN Children's Convention we "respect the child's right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion".

As Christians, as part of the worldwide Church of God, we believe that charity and love are entwined together and therefore we encounter people in need in both word and deed.

Our Commitment to Share our Faith Appropriately, with Respect

We are committed to the code of conduct, jointly produced by the World Council of Churches and the World Evangelical Alliance, for 'Christian witness in a multi-religious world' on 29th June, 2011.

This is introduced with these words: "Mission belongs to the very being of the church. Proclaiming the word of God and witnessing to the world is essential for every Christian. At the same time, it is necessary to do so according to Gospel principles, with full respect and love for all human beings.”

Why we Talk about our Faith

The desire for vibrant, healthy relationships unites all people. However our reality is often shaped by the hopelessness of disturbed and disrupted relationships. Sustainable, reliable relationships therefore need to be restored.

This begins with our relationship with God, who introduces himself to us in the Bible - and Jesus Christ. By conquering death, Jesus offers renewal and the hope of life beyond death to anyone who wants it.

For us, if we fail to carry this message of hope, which is firmly established in the Bible, would be like depriving people of the opportunity to hear how their relationship with their Creator can be restored and how they can have hope.

Without this message of hope we can only offer short term help; with it we can offer long term hope. For Samaritan’s Purse help and hope go together. That is why we speak of faith.

badtime · 08/11/2013 15:48

No-one is trying to remove peoples choices. All anyone is trying to do is to ensure that people have the opportunity to make informed choices.

gooner1956 · 08/11/2013 15:49

I'm really going now!

fromparistoberlin · 08/11/2013 15:49

exexe

I am sure alot of children cant even read the leaflet, and are a completely different religion!

hand on heart how many children become evangelised gay hating people due to this? very little I suspect

anyway, lets agree to disagree hey