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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to ask what 'black culture' is because apparently I should know

82 replies

flaquark · 11/10/2013 18:09

I was out today and bumped into someone I went to school with. We did all the 'what you up to?' and all that.
Anyway she said that I must be looking forward to having a kid that I can share "our black culture with"
I just nodded and we said bye and that was it

But seriously what the hell in 'Black Culture' because I have no idea and obviously according to her I should know what it is.

Obviously that one skipped me by

OP posts:
nicename · 11/10/2013 20:25

It must be one hell of a wide topic. DH was invited to join the 'Black XX's Union'. He's from the ME.

Bazoo23 · 11/10/2013 20:45

lol kirjava that made me laugh :-) imagining your flustered health visitor.
OP YANBU. Next time you see her ask if her kids are embracing "white culture".

LouiseAderyn · 11/10/2013 20:54

Isn't culture about where you grow up? So a child raised in Britain will be culturally British and colour doesn't come into it.

Presumably everyone then has the additional influences of parents/grandparents nationalities and traditions?

LondonMan · 11/10/2013 21:02

I sometimes read stories about adoption where either parents or social worker are talking about keeping children in touch with "their" culture. Fine if they were 10 when they were adopted, not if they were 1. A one-year old doesn't have a culture.

Genetic inheritance is irrelevant, culture is what you get from the people who happen to be around when you're growing up. Language is the main example of culture.

ForrinForrinerFromForrinLand · 11/10/2013 21:04

For me personally I think it involves knowing your heritage, where you're from, tradtions, customs, language etc.

Dp is white british, Dd is mixed race, I'm from Kenya. I'd like Dc to at the very least speak a Swahili and understand a bit of luhya, my mother tongue.

revels the whole Africa as a country thing.

Dorris83 · 11/10/2013 21:15

LondonMan my niece was adopted. She is mixed race, her birth mother is black, father white. She was adopted from birth by my BIL and SIL.

As part of the adoption BIL and SIL have to ensure that DNiece is in touch with her culture... So they have a few pictures of Nigeria around the house... Bizarre!

They are both white British and have never visited Nigeria so there's no reason for those pictures to be there!

SeaSickSal · 11/10/2013 21:25

She was trying to be politically correct.

I am very much looking forward to sharing Shakespeare, Toni Morrison, James Joyce, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Sufi, Alice Walker, Thomas Hardy and George Eliot with my children.

I'm sure you feel the same about the writers and historians you are interested in.

But I think she was being ignorant and misguided rather than unkind. You could re-educate her if you saw her again by talking about how you have a common history.

MrsDeVere · 11/10/2013 21:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Dayshiftdoris · 11/10/2013 21:40

Bloody hell no one ever checked if I had taken my son up North to experience his heritage first hand yet it was very very important to me that he knew where his family came from as our immediately family is now all down south after many, many generations of being in the North West.

Luckily for him I have and he is firm lover of chips & gravy and meat & potato pie... You can take the boy out of the North but you can't take the North out of the boy Wink

Heritage is very important but it is absolutely what parents perceive it to be not what others perceive that it should be...

breatheslowly · 11/10/2013 21:41

Oh MrsDeVere, I don't know whether to laugh or cry at your example.

AmberLeaf · 11/10/2013 23:19

I sometimes read stories about adoption where either parents or social worker are talking about keeping children in touch with "their" culture. Fine if they were 10 when they were adopted, not if they were 1. A one-year old doesn't have a culture

But they do have a heritage which a knowledge of for various possible reasons may be important later in life.

manicinsomniac · 12/10/2013 00:29

I don't know about black culture but I do think that, if a child is from a different culture, then it is important to keep them in touch with it.

My children are half Brazilian and, although they have never met their dad and never ever will if i have anything to do with it, I still feel it is very important for them to grow up knowing and feeling connecting to their Brazilian side. I'm bringing them upas bilingual as I can and we spend most holidays over there.

But i agree that ethnicity is irrelevant. My children are hispanic but my actions would be the same if my children were white brazilian or black brazilian

MistressDeeCee · 12/10/2013 01:29

But OP - your friend didnt say you "obviously should know" what black culture is, did she? Youve intimated that yourself in your post. She made a comment that she probably thought was fine. Thats all.

Not that I believe this is a real situation, given the type of 'black' posts that have been on here lately. & now..here's another one. How..unusual. Im inclined to believe its just a way to get a list of disparaging comments regarding people who say 'black culture'. (As if 'black culture' is somehow an offensive phrase?!)

Although we may come from different islands, countries etc and are all different, we all share similarities in food, customs, traditions etc - albeit we may call them by different names - and yes there is a very clear reason for that.

SavoyCabbage · 12/10/2013 03:07

My nephew, who is mixed race Chinese/British had on his receptionnreport that he had been

'Sharing stories of activities from his culture' and when my sister questioned the teacher about it she found that it was going for a picnic to a national trust property.Grin

2blessed · 12/10/2013 03:55

I'm Black British and for me having an understanding of my black culture includes being able to cook food from the specific islands where my family are from; knowledge of the language, politics, history and current socio economic lamdscape. In addition I have an understanding of the history, successes and struggles of black people in this country. This probably sounds like an essay but its the best way I can articulate it. I.am sure most of my black friends would agree. We don't talk about what our culture is we just know it and live. My parents are of the Windrush generation.

2blessed · 12/10/2013 03:56

*landscape

2blessed · 12/10/2013 04:02

DP and I are raising DS to know his culture.
Eg in some west indian islands its the norm to cook soup on a saturday. So today im cooking mutton soup with yam, green banana, pumpkin, christophene and dumplings.
I will also be canerowing DS' hair because where my family are from you don't cut boy's hair until they're 3 if I can manage that long

sashh · 12/10/2013 07:35

DH is mixed African British and he has no idea either. Is it something that doesn't really exist?!

It does exist, but like all cultures is it is like a bit of fog, you can't really say where it starts and ends, patches of it apply to everyone, patches to only a few. One of my friends will ask me 'Am I being black?' and we both get what she means.

For the majority of cultures there is a shared history, for many (not all) black people there is a shared history of parents or grandparents as immigrants (and in Britain it is not uncommon for a black person to have both African and Caribbean grandparents), of them not being able to buy the food they were used to, difficulty getting a landlord to rent from. But these experiences are also common to Irish immigrants to Britain.

There is also the thing that you do not realise you are part of a culture until someone points out it doesn't happen elsewhere or to other groups.

eg a friend who is born and bread in the south went with his father to Yorkshire to visit relatives. He found it strange that a) they were offered tea at every house and b) when his dad agreed not just dad but everyone was given tea.

Now I was brought up in Yorkshire and to me if a group are visiting and I offer tea I am offering it to the group and if someone doesn't want any it is up to them to say so.

Some examples of things that I identify as black culture (please do not be offended, as stated above these do not apply to everyone and maybe they are actually 'British Black culture') are:

Church clothes - beautiful clothes, and for ladies hats, worn for church on Sunday (or Saturday), sometimes this is traditional African Dress (yes I know it could be from many different countries). I once read a book that phrased it as, "the kind of clothes black people wear every Sunday and white people only wear to weddings"

Washing meat before you cook it - although this maybe more a Caribbean thing.

Sugar in plants - the 'fact' that the amount of sugar in a plant is different whether it was grown below or above ground. Again this might be a Caribbean thing.

Hair. Borrowing from Zadie Smith's 'white teeth', black women expect a trip to the hair dressers to hurt. If I have a perm I leave the the hairdressers with curls, a black woman with a perm leaves with straight hair. If I go swimming I m not scared my hair will break off afterwards

The friend with the 'am I being black', the kind of things she does (and I have not noticed it with other people so maybe it is just her) is if we go to a restaurant she will pick up the cutlery and rub it on her napkin to make sure it is clean, I assume it is clean and if it isn't will ask for it to be changed.

Dayshiftdoris the same friend with the tea has also been taken to Lancashire where he was also highly amused at the thought of a pub quiz with a 'pie and pea supper' and could not believe his ears when someone in a chip shop asked for a 'potato pie butty' and could not believe his eyes when it was made and handed over without question.

My parents don't really trust me because I like chips and gravy - well they should not have moved me across the pennines at an impressionable age.

mummybearah · 12/10/2013 08:07

Sashh! Thank you for sharing your idea of what 'black culture' could mean.

I don't think using this term is wrong. I'm sure when hearing this phrase it means something different to everyone, which is why I wouldn't use it. Don't think it's politically incorrect or anything though.

To OP- I think your old school mate was a bit ignorant tbh. Why she would imply that you should or would want to share your 'black culture' with your child is beyond me. Perhaps if she'd thought about that before saying she wouldn't have said it! Benefit of the doubt.

By the way I'm Nigerian British and would struggle to correctly define black culture. The phrase does mean something to me, but I shan't try and define it because I know I can't give a comprehensive answer! Hope that makes sense :/

WednesdayRebel · 12/10/2013 08:16

Sashh, can you please advise how your suggestion of church clothes being representative of black culture would fit if I were both black and a Muslim or black and agnostic?

YANBU OP - referring to all black people sharing a homogenous culture based on their skin colour is ignorant

LouiseAderyn · 12/10/2013 08:30

My grandparents always dressed up for church and I wash meat before I cook it and we are white, so it is hard to define.

coldwinter · 12/10/2013 08:47

Yes there is no such thing as one black culture. But in reference to a comment up thread, the word black was coined by black people as a political statement. It includes Asian people too. It was basically about recognising that all black people experience racism and about black people coming together to fight it

KirjavaTheCorpse · 12/10/2013 08:52

I also find it Hmm that it in a mixed couple where the mother is white, they are often the one targeted by these concerned individuals

It is strange isn't it. I wouldn't have the first clue, and actually DP is third generation and grew up in London, and only very loosely identifies with his family's heritage. Best people to ask would be his grandparents!

MrsDeVere · 12/10/2013 09:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

flaquark · 12/10/2013 10:48

Thanks
Well if all that is true I know nothing about 'black culture' (which I refuse to believe exists)
My 'black-ness' is from Greneda and somewhere else and I would have to google to find out anything about that culture there.

OP posts: