To stand up and give Sinead O'Connor a round of applause

[Fifilosttheplot]

Not something that would normally happen at Maison Fifi but in this case I think it is richly deserved for her open letter to Miley Cyrus. I know Sinead is no stranger to courting publicity but with this one I think she is bang on the money www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-24382051

Actually, I'd like to print some of the comments about being worth more than your body or sex appeal out and hand them out to some of the secondary school girls going past my gate on a morning.

Why does anyone say MC will regret it later?

She hasn't done anything to be ashamed of.

Just about every song she has ever inflicted on the public - yes she should be ashamed.

I can't stand all this bubblegum pop crap with added shite. I blame the people daft enough to buy it.

Psychologically though, shame does seem to be a reaction when you are exploited for someone elses' aims.
You see that to extremes in rape victims, but also in victims of bullying, or even being treated like shit by your boss for peanuts.

I do not buy that sexual exhibitionism is such a strong innate authentic sexual urge. For a start it's only sexy young women who seem to have it. Which is convenient. that should alert you to the fact that there is another dynamic at play here

Nearly every female popstar produces music videos which are bordering pornographic and portraying themselves as nymphophiacs gang banging a dozen men and poledancing for a hundred more, which would be fine if their main audience weren't young teens and preteen children. The current fashion for hypersexualised females is very damaging in the real world, these values are being absorbed by children who then go act out what they've been told will make them popular and admired, for girls that behaviour makes them easy prey for evil men (and confused, ignorant, equally brainwashed boys who don't know any better).

Miley Cyrus is competing to be the most overly sexualised of them all (or a 'dirty bitch' according to her) and is selling that as aspirational to an incredibly young fanbase. For that reason, Sinead was right to make her letter public, it wasn't just to her but to all females in the industry and to all young women who don't realise they are degrading and endangering themselves by behaving like that.

Predicting an inevitable breakdown is weird too. No one really knows if she will be fine or not and it's wrong to assume she won't be IMO

In fairness, the odds of a former child star making it through young adulthood with no issues are pretty slim. No matter if she makes the transition to adult performer and maintains a level of success that satisfies her ego, she'll be the exception rather than the rule if she avoids addiction problems, mental health problems or being used/abused/discarded by the 'machine' she's small cog in. It's not being 'weird' to suggest she will crash and burn at some point - just realistic given the high percentage of former child stars who end up going down that path. And more reason to call her on her nasty tweet mocking those who have suffered mental health problems in similar situations to where she is now.

Terry Richardson is an odious creature, quite a danger to the young women he works with. I read a blog post by a girl who had more or less been forced by him to perform a sex act on him, with his entourage of flunkies all standing round goading her. Surely he should be facing charges somehow?! But the fashion world LOVE him, so he just carries on. He looks like a pervy geography teacher. Abhorrent.

Right. So Sinead O'Connor advertising asking for men to fuck her up the arse is 'discussing her own sexuality' and 'not exploitative' yet Miley Cyrus doing things which are titillating is 'exploitative'.

I think what some posters actually mean is the fact that Sinead O'Connor is old, portly and unattractive and it's not really sexually arousing but more 'ew' to hear her talking about anal sex.

Whereas when Miley does something it is sexually arousing for quite a few people. Therefore it's exploitative.

It is a matter of slut shaming. How can there be nodding approval of her discussing her sexuality when Miley expressing hers is somehow 'dirty' and 'exploitative'.

I really cannot see any other reason other than the fact that Miley is young, attractive and it's likely that a lot of people find her sexuality arousing when Sinead O'Connor's sexuality is not really unless you're a bit 'specialist'.

And I remember when she posted that anal sex rant. She was deadly serious despite the later back tracking.

Has anyone read that blog >>>>>> over there>>>>>>
about talking to your DCs about porn?

Link here in case the Blog of the Day box changes or is different for you.

To me somehow the two issues are irrevocably linked but I can't quite express why, I'm a bit too tipsy. It's to do with the prevalence and accessibility of porn and the hyper-sexualisation of girls and young women these days.

Hopefully someone who has not been to the pub can help me express this better...

Zatyaballerina good post there.

If Sinead is so motherly and concerned why did she play all this out in public?

So let's hope Terry Richardson will be next n the dock. It sounds as though his sex crimes are open secrets. He sounds utterly vile, and I hope he dies in jail, very soon.

Again, SeaSickSal and SinisterSal are not the same person.

just to be clear

Sinead is right.

Sinistersal will you just fuck off, people can read that for themselves, you're being pathetic and schoolyardy.

Right. So Sinead O'Connor advertising asking for men to fuck her up the arse is 'discussing her own sexuality' and 'not exploitative' yet Miley Cyrus doing things which are titillating is 'exploitative

Yep. Not sure what bit of that you're struggling with to be honest.

HeartsTrumpsDiamonds can you please explain to me why it's okay for Sinead O'Connor to write explicitly about her own sex life on her website but Miley Cyrus's sexuality and what she wishes to do with it is somehow different?

I'm not a fan of Miley Cyrus and find a lot of her hyper sexualised act desperate and embarassing. But I don't see why Sinead O'Connor finds her own sexuality as something for public consumption yet objects to other women doing the same?

Ehric, that's an absolute non-answer. You're not saying why one is 'empowering' and the other exploitative. You're just repeating that's what you think without giving a valid reason why.

It makes me suspect that you couldn't actually give a convincing argument why.

I'll ask again. Why is Sinead O'Connor expressing her sexuality acceptable, but Miley Cyrus's expression of her sexuality is not?

Nobody was exploiting sinead. She was an experienced adult talking about her sexual preferences online with her followers. Miley Cyrus is being persuaded/led/encouraged into performing and posing in a pretty sexually explicit manner as a means to make money for the industry that surrounds her. She is using her sexuality to make money, which sinead was not doing, and her young age and the people she's associating with suggest that this is not an entirely informed choice.

I may be wrong about this, but I think it's because Sinead was seeking to gratify her own desire to for anal sex, while Miley is allowing herself to be portrayed for the gratification of others.

There are definately aspects of the letter that should have been better written. There are aspects of slut-shaming in the letter, and I think this section:

We don’t encourage our daughters to walk around naked in it because it makes them prey for animals and less than animals does have victim blaming connotations (not for Miley Cyrus, but for rape/sexual assult victims in general, which is worse).

Your body is for you and your boyfriend is awful on so many levels. A person's body belongs to them alone, but they can chose to share it with anyone they want to.

I think it's just the way the letter reads- that no woman could ever chose to use her sexuality in her own right- doesn't sit well with me. Surely women have the right to chose how they dress. You shouldn't be barred from dressing a certain way or behaving a certain way that isn't directly hurting anyone just because some people might leer at you.

It's not really about Miley Cyrus. It's about other young women who might read that letter, and feel like they have to behave a certain way, or they deserve to face harassment and worse from men.

Either she should write a more direct attack on those she feels are directly responsible for exploiting Miley Cyrus, or she should acknowledge that it is possible for a young woman to feel positive about being attractive and possitive about her sexuality, and that doesn't have to be a bad thing.

To be honest, she just sounds very pearl-clutchy, middle class and out of touch.

I don't want to be associated with your asinine views SeaSickSal or your ignorant way of putting them across

it's MN etiquette to take the hint that maybe a namechange is in order - I have had this one for years and it's usually the newcomer that changes. But if you won't do that I'll have to keep making the sure the people that matter know not to think I've had a personality and brain transplant. You may find it annoying

there you go Ehric. Sinead is an experienced adult so it is okay.

In other words because she is an older woman it's fine for her to express her sexuality. But because Miley is a young woman it's not okay for her to do it. Miley is also an an adult, not a child.

Sinead O'Connor is expressing her sexuality by writing online about anal sex to her fans. Miley Cyrus is expressing her sexuality whilst on stage at the MTV awards to her fans. Sinead O'Connor's discussion of anal sex was on her website which is also a commercial enterprise and it generated her publicity and hits on a site which market her material. It's not that much different from Miley Cyrus going out in skimpy outfits to sell records.

Essentially Ehric you are arguing that it is not acceptable for Miley Cyrus to express her sexuality because she is a young adult. When does it become okay to you? When will she be 'experienced' enough for you? When she's 30? When she's married? Will it be okay for her to advertise for anal sex partners then?

And FuzzyPickle, think about what you're saying there. When Sinead O'Connor talks about anal sex you think that it doesn't gratify others? Yet when Miley Cyrus does something sexual it does.

The 'gratifying others' part comes about because Miley Cyrus is young and sexually attractive. I'm sure if she discussed a desire for anal sex that would 'gratify others' too.

And why doesn't Sinead O'Connor's discussion of sex 'gratify others'. Probably because she is a portly mother of four who is knocking on 50 and not a nubile 20 year old.

Underneath all the 'motherliness' guff O'Connor was essentially calling her a whore.

Look - you do not have the monopoly on the name Sal. The names are clearly different to someone with a reading age of six. You may not have noticed it but lots of people are called Sally. And I like SeaSickSid. You following me round posting 'We are not the same people' all the time is pathetic.

Bollocks to you love, if you're incapable of reading the difference between two completely different names it's not my fucking problem.

It's about expressing one's own authentic sexuality.

that is the distinction. Most people don't buy that a twenty year old girl's natural sexual exploration really involves exhibitionism on this level that will hang around for ever. But there are plenty of other people who really really do like it. It's not hard to discern the dynamic.

Are you quite well? that seems a rather bizarre overreaction.

I'll have to continue as I see fit, really. Because similar sounding name changes are how we do things here and I'd hate people to think i'm you. For obvious reasons.

Continue to rant and rave about if you like - it'll underscore the differences. And provide entertainment