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AIBU?

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To speak to the school?

1002 replies

Orchwoid · 17/09/2013 17:47

I've just been to collect my son from his school and he's told me that he won't be cast in his school Christmas play but all the other children will.

I am fumming. I am going to go and speak to his teacher first thing tomorrow morning but I am so angry that I can't work out whether I'm being reasonable or not.

OP posts:
exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:17

Yes, she is.

FamiliesShareGerms · 19/09/2013 07:17

Good grief!

Apart from the fact that it is frankly to too early to be thinking about Christmas in any shape or form, I think a few posters here have been harsh on the OP. Eg withdrawing your child from "collective worship" should not mean that they miss out on the whole assembly every morning. So they should still get to do the award stuff.

Given that the numbers of children who are withdrawn from collective worship are likely to be small, it wouldn't have hurt for the teacher to have quickly checked whether the OP would have been content for her son to be involved in the play in some way eg props and scenery. Just telling a seven year old boy "no, you can't be in the play because your mum says so" (or words that would be re-told like that) is not really the best way to handle it.

Though I also think OP has a leeeetle bit of a chip on her shoulder about not being religious, and frankly my life is not enriched by knowing what "fuming" actually means.....

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:18

And the school arranged for him to be withdrawn- she has that right.

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:19

What she didn't do was explain that he was withdrawn unless she perceived it as fun.

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:22

As a teacher I don't think that I would want to upset an atheist mum by suggesting props, scenery didn't count. As it is OP is quite aggressive on the suggestion that he should be in the background doing curtains etc. she wants a front row seat with him centre stage is my estimation.

sparkle12mar08 · 19/09/2013 07:23

Squeeee! It's still here! I was terrified I'd go to bed only to get up and find it had gone poof! in the night! IAmNotLouise I agree - 1000 posts and Classics, absolutely!

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:24

Any other parent that I have known withdraw from assembly has been consistent- e.g. the child has not even been able to glue tiles onto the stable.

filee777 · 19/09/2013 07:25

families at last a voice of reason!

At no point did I suggest a child should be 'cast anyway' yet people seemed to run with that. At no point did I say people should be 'questioned' but again, that was cited as part of my 'argument'

It would have been very simple for the school to clarify what level of participation the parents were comfortable with their child having in the school play. If there are lots of children not included in religious activities then a letter could be sent out.

If some of the people on this thread actually work in schools I am not surprised at the amount of threads upset about treatment of children. Some people act like they couldn't give a shit about including a child in some way, or feel they are just 'too busy and important' to behave in a sensitive fashion.

YouTheCat · 19/09/2013 07:25

Well I did suggest she went and asked for the part of Joseph... or Mary. Grin

Jaynebxl · 19/09/2013 07:27

What a funny thread. Imagine if it were true!

Butwilliseeyouagain · 19/09/2013 07:30

rosepettel/op

you are either insane or a wind-up merchant par excellence.

either way, i like you

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:31

There are not lots of children not included in religious activities. As a supply teacher, in all sorts of primary schools, I have never come across more than one or two. You assume that parents are comfortable unless they say otherwise. OP was very plain in her intentions. If a parent was describing it as 'shit' I don't think that I would risk asking them if they really meant it for Christmas.

filee777 · 19/09/2013 07:34

You have no idea how she described it to the school, you are making assumptions, you have no idea how many children are not involved, again making assumptions (either way actually depending on what you've decided to be outraged by) if there are few children not included then a quick phone call isn't going to hurt, dealing with the matter sensitively isn't going to hurt.

FamiliesShareGerms · 19/09/2013 07:35

exotic - I can't see how it could be offensive to say "OP, given your DS is withdrawn from collective worship, can I just check whether you would be happy for him to be involved backstage or if you would prefer that he spent time with another class while we are practicing and preparing for the nativity play". Which would allow OP to say what she was comfortable with.

I don't know any non-Christian parents who would be "offended" by a quick informal chat along these lines.

filee777 · 19/09/2013 07:39

It's just an excuse families to be lazy with a child's feelings.

I can't see how it is anything else, I honestly thought we had moved past a point where children were excluded from large events based upon their religious beliefs but obviously not.

Lots of people working in schools just don't care.

YouTheCat · 19/09/2013 07:41

I don't think the OP knows what she wants tbh.

Whether school could have called and asked about the Nativity is irrelevant given that it's only September, so plenty of time for sorting things out.

The level of fuming from her is disproportionate. She could easily have just called and clarified instead of getting angry. And now he's been offered a 'shepherd' but that doesn't suit. What more does she want... blood? Well if she wants blood she'll have to wait until Easter. Grin

YouTheCat · 19/09/2013 07:42

Filee - she excluded him herself.

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:44

I don't know any non Christian parents who would be offended - but then I don't know any like OP.
I may be making assumptions but I would bet money on not many being withdrawn from assembly- there never are many.

MidniteScribbler · 19/09/2013 07:46

::head desk::

SilverApples · 19/09/2013 07:46

filee, what you are proposing is disrespectful to many parents' beliefs.
The child is not being excluded, they are withdrawn from certain activities their parents have asked that they not be exposed to, as is their legal right.
To constantly pester the parent with 'Well, what about?' and ' Perhaps he could if we...' and ' But this isn't very religious...' is belittling their faith, whatever that is. If you ask for your child to be withdrawn from any religious Godshit, then that is what will happen. However irritating and disruptive and ridiculous it seems to the teacher and the school, it is what the family is entitled to.
The fact that some parents are a bit thick about the consequences, and don't like their children asking them 'Why?' is also a consequence.

LookingThroughTheFog · 19/09/2013 07:49

I totally agree with Families (though oddly, not so much with filee, who is being a touch disingenuous. To say the most important religious event in the Christian calendar isn't about God is a little bit silly. If the school wanted to have a Winter Celebration, or a Spring Celebration, perhaps alongside Christmas and Easter, then fair enough. But if they're talking about Christmas and Easter, I would expect the children to hear the religious stories relating to those events, similar to when they learned about Eid and Chanukah. If the school don't want to do that, then rebrand.)

Aside from that, I wonder how easy it is to avoid hearing any religious references in everyday life? I don't know, because I am religious, my children go to religious school and to church and so it's hard for me to work out how much would be left if those things weren't there. I just take it all for granted.

A massive amount of the content of the National Gallery has a religious content, for example. There are crucifixes for sale in most shops. You might be watching TV when a funeral or church wedding or baptism are shown. They sing about God before each England Football game (and my word that's a depressing hymn on a number of different levels). If Wales are playing too, then you often get Bread of Heaven (sung gloriously).

So anyway, I'm just trying to imagine a completely religion-less world. I wonder if anyone here has managed it, because I'd find it fascinating how you deal with it all. I have many non-religious friends, who usually just tell the story, but present it as myth, and discuss it in terms of 'this is what Christians believe'. To me that makes perfect sense, but is there anyone out there who attempts to avoid the references completely?

filee777 · 19/09/2013 07:49

It is not disrespectful to many beliefs for a child to be involved in a play but not have a religious/singing part. Or to help out behind the scenes.

This is something the school should have communicated about with the parents.

exoticfruits · 19/09/2013 07:52

OP does not want behind the scenes!
She is quite specific.
To quote: it is a new school, the Christmas play is supposed to be good and although she doesn't believe in 'God and all that shit' she was looking forward to watching!

SoupDragon · 19/09/2013 07:53

FIlee
She doesn't want him backstage.
The school respected her, clearly vehement, wishes wrt religion.
Did you read the post from a teacher setting out the likely response from parents if they asked about this sort of thing?

FamiliesShareGerms · 19/09/2013 07:55

YoutheCat - but surely now is the time to talk to OP about it, given that mow is the time that the school have decided to allocate parts and - presumably - ask children to start learning lines and making costumes. It's at least two months early, IMHO, to be doing Xmas, but if the school is starting early I think saying that it can all be sorted out later is missing my point. Which is that the school don't seem to have handled this very well by relying on a 7yo to communicate what is going on.

Given the school is sorting the Nativity out so early, it's not unreasonable to assume that the play is a Big Deal at school this term. It's hard to think about any other events that aren't exactly acts of collective worship but are religious, so I don't buy the argument that the school shouldn't be pestering parents about whether X or Y is OK. Eg the Harvest Festival assembly in the local church? Act of collective worship. Visit to the gudwara next door? Wider religious education.

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