to not want to speak to this person again despite him being my hisband's best friend?

[catlady123]

Have namechanged for this, I usually post in a different part of MN. I wanted people’s views on something that has upset me terribly and whether I am being unreasonable, as my husband thinks.

My husband has a best friend who is/was also a good friend of mine. He was over for dinner last night. I mentioned to him in the course of conversation that I am struggling emotionally with the fact that my fragile, old cat has become quite incontinent and I am wondering whether she should be put down at some point as she is soiling the house several times a day and I have a toddler. I have had this cat for over 17 years, through thick and thin in my life and this would be huge thing for me. I mentioned that I had thought of possible asking the vet to come to the house to do the deed without distressing her in any way, but also that I am far from coming to a decision on this yet.

His comment was that I should not do that but should take her a few hours drive away from home and then just let her out into the wild and “let nature take its course”. I was so shocked by this that I could not speak for a while, I then became very upset and refused to have dinner with him, going upstairs to bed instead. I later told my husband that I do not want anything to do with this friend again and that animal cruelty is something I cannot tolerate. I was absolutely shocked that the friend could think that I would take my beloved old cat and do this to her.

My husband’s view was that I was very rude to his friend, that I am being ridiculous, and that “everyone is entitled to their opinion”, although he himself would not actually do this to the cat. This caused a huge fight which has gone on much of the night. I don’t know what to say now. My husband tells me his friend will apologise for what he said. I can’t see that an apology would make any difference, he still thought that such cruelty was OK and that I would do something like this, how can apology for having expressed the opinion change that?

[LessMissAbs]

YeahWhat OP needs to apologise to friend for massive over reaction

Why? The guest was rude at their dinner table. He should be grovelling to be included in the friendship again. In saying this, I'm assuming that the OP isn't some serf at the call of both of these men but can choose how to react and behave herself...

To put this in perspective, theres been two recent articles in my local newspaper about abandoned pets in need of veterinary attention being found by a national charity, and the matter having been reported to the police to try and trace the owners with a view to charging them.

[comingalongnicely]

Don't invite me to dinner then - I'd have joked about doing the deed with half a brick in a sock at a reduced rate.

@ LesMis - Hmm, I don't think he'll be grovelling to come back at all - more likely telling all his mates down the pub about the "mad cat lady"...

Sorry OP but I think you had a massive overreaction and YABU...

[HangingGardenofBabbysBum]

Blimey. I love my animals, but I love my DH more and if a friend of his expressed such an opinion, I hope that I would have the perspective and maturity not to take it so ridiculously personally.

You really stormed off to bed and wouldn't come down? Did you sneak back later for Monster Munch and an energy drink?

You sound like a teenager. I think you should consider chucking a few apologies around yourself too.

So sorry about your poor cat though, that's a horrible thing.

[Liara]

I adore my cats and would not do what your friend suggested, but your reaction was very very unreasonable.

IMO, so would putting a cat to sleep over incontinence. I do feel your pain, as our previous cat became increasingly incontinent until he died, though.

Is there any way you could restrict her to only the easier to clean parts of the house?

[TheBigJessie]

powerof3 I'm not sure anyone is comparing. But I'm sorry if it's offending you.

Another poster, can't remember whom, pointed out that abandoning one cat is nothing like genocide. Which is true. But it led on to other questions, and I felt it might be permissible to ask how she would react if someone was justifying genocide, given the subject had already been raised.

You see, I think that if I did a survey, which specifically asked "is it okay to object to a guest justifying genocide?" almost everyone would tick YES! If I couched a very general question along the lines of "if a guest says something offensive, should you object at the risk of creating an unpleasant atmosphere, or should you laugh it off", some people would say, "Well, it depends what it is. 'I fancy David Cameron' isn't really on the same scale as 'I'm voting BNP'".

Other people would circle "laugh it off" without even considering the multitude of dodgy things such a short and sweet sentence can accept, if you don't put footnotes on it.

Others would think that "except when it's bloody obvious you shouldn't" should simply go as read.

I accept that I can't universialise my own experiences, and I expect that works for many other people, including you, who are simply more competent at life than me. But when I followed the "laugh it off, except when it's bloody obvious you shouldn't", I found that not sweating the small stuff (although I do not consider abandonment of domestic animals "small stuff") meant that when the Bloody Obvious came along, I didn't know how to deal with it. If you feel obliged to laugh things off, and Not Make Any Kind of Scene, magical presence of mind and ability to calmly express displeasure or offendedness does not suddenly manifest itself out of thin air when the BIG social boundaries are crossed.

For example, when your friend's new boyfriend turns out to be a BNP councillor... That happened when I was 18. I still feel guilty for being unable to object to his views that night, or when my friend kept repeating them. (And I happen to believe I bloody well should feel guilty!)

[Nanny0gg]

One of my cats became poorly and before I could get him to a vet he went missing. Searched high and low and no sign.

I went out one night and got a call from youngest DC who had found the cat curled up, dead, in my garden.

So he'd taken himself off, then come back home (but outside) to die.

I do think you over-reacted.

[Thepowerof3]

I think it is subject matter for a whole other thread and I dont believe it follows that not bringing someone to task over their cat comment would lead to letting extreme comments about genocide slide

[Crowler]

Jessie, I think most people do interpret comments on a spectrum rather than in black and white. If you take a hard-line stance against people saying offensive things, it's your loss.

If you just talk to a BNP member, for example, you may find yourself having an interesting conversation. I would find it pretty amusing to be sat next to one at a dinner party (not likely); it would be more interesting than another fool banging on about the 11+.

[kerstina]

Abandoning a cat in the woods does not seem to me to be kinder than putting it down. You would just be worrying about the cat and its fate. Although I do know that cats can take themselves off to die
If your cat is not in pain or distress I would not put it down. Are there any other solutions. Could you confine it to one room with access to garden?

[LessMissAbs]

I think I must move in different circles to mumsnetters then. Advocating animal cruelty at the dinner table is not something I'd find amusing. And I don't consider myself to my DH's servant to such an extent that I have to continue serving his friends food and eating with them when they offend me. We're all quite practical not particularly sentimental people who mostly have animals or have had pets as children too.

I can't even think of any of my friends who would speak about animals in this way. If someone did, there would be a clanging silence then a change of subject. But they always run the risk of someone taking offence.

It is the sort of thing my FIL would say, but then he has been out of the workplace for years and has kind of lost his social skills, and his sense of humour seems rooted in racism and Benny Hill type jokes.

[Thepowerof3]

Thank fuck for that

[Thepowerof3]

Argh accepting racist humour is NOT the same thing, does he even have a bloody cat that he is planning to euthanise?? He made a stupid suggestion you should have simply said 'that's illegal/ cruel' and get on with your blooming evening.

[catlady123]

Thanks everyone for all the thought provoking comments and debate. I absolutely do agree I behaved inappropriately, while still reserving the opinion that what he said was very wrong and very thoughtless. (I did not however leave the dinner table in a strop, we had not started dinner and DH and his friend were standing smoking in the garden when the remark was made).

On the other issue, regarding the actual cat, she is in fact already confined to one room (kitchen/dining room) and the garden, and at night confined to just her heated box and the garden. We talked a lot about all this last night. She is not being put to sleep. I got up this morning and cleaned her box out and then a few minutes later cleaned up the wee in the kitchen, as always. But at least now I have clarified to myself and everyone else that i would far rather have to do that than put her down when she is still able to have some quality of life.

[YellowDinosaur]

Ignoring the initial AIBU as that's been pretty fully debated, but do you have a litter tray for your cat?

We've been having problems with our 2 cats pissing in the house and having a litter tray has drastically reduced this. We didn't want to have one but actually it's much better than the former situation. Plus with flushable cat litter it's easy to keep clean and doesn't smell too much. Worth a try?

[YellowDinosaur]

And my youngest son is 5 so not much older than your DC and he knows to leave it alone.

[kali110]

Op thats lovely!!

Awomansworth There are some people who would take on cats like ops actually!my third stray is constantly pissing in odd places, but i would rather clean it up than having him put down.

[lottiegarbanzo]

I know this thread has been done to death but, I just wondered about the rather throwaway line 'it's normal where he is from'. That could explain a lot.

There are plenty of people who, for religious reasons, don't seek or accept life-saving medical treatment for people, because God wills whether it's their time or not. Similarly, there can be a cultural taboo on killing, even a suffering animal that is clearly dying, because it's up to God exactly when its time will come. In that case, 'allowing nature to take its course', however brutal, may be the closest thing to euthanasia available, for a suffering animal.

Could that be any part of the explanation? In which case an explanation of different cultural norms here might have proven enlightening (though I guess your DH offered that).

[lottiegarbanzo]

OMG, no pun intended there!

[catlady123]

Oh I can definitely say that it was not religious reasons! He is an atheist as are we.

On the litter tray issue, we had thought of that but I am not really convinced that she would use it (I know her so well after 17 years, I am almost completely sure she would do her business next to it rather than in it!). Also, my son has special needs and would be quite likely to get intimately involved with the litter tray at some point. I am just going down the cleaning up route at this stage, have some good disinfectants etc.

My Dh seems to have now given this quite a lot of thought. He has decided to use a behavioural approach and when the cat is let out of her sleeping box in the morning she is being put outside for ten minutes, encouraged to do her thing outside and then given treats if she then comes in and does not pee on the floor etc. We shall see how it goes! Thanks again for all the comments, both on the friend/my unreasonability issue and the cat issue.

We also wondered if she is not wanting to go outside because she is cold and so have ordered her some fleece jerseys. (Yes I am that crazy cat lady...). Thanks again all....