Am I being unreasonable to suggest that scooters should be banned on pavements?

[Morgause]

An hour ago I went up the lane to pay the papers. The pavement isn't particularly wide but not very narrow either. A little girl aged 3 -4 scooted past me quite quickly which made me jump a bit as I hadn't heard her coming. I looked round to see her mother with a buggy quite a way back down the lane. She shouted the little girl's name and told her to wait.

I walked past her and into the shop round the corner and paid the bill. As I came back around the corner the mother had caught up with the little girl and she had begun to scoot on again. Unfortunately she scooted straight into an elderly lady just leaving her gate and they both went flying. I called an ambulance and other neighbours came out to see what could be done to help. It looks like the little girl has broken her arm and the old lady may have broken her hip or her leg - maybe both.

The ambulance man said that scooters are a "bloody nuisance" and if kids aren't falling off them they are ploughing into people on them. He thinks they should be banned anywhere but gardens and parks. The local bobby, also present, agreed.

I think the same after what I saw today. M (the old lady) is the sole carer for her elderly husband who is very disabled following a stroke. Goodness knows what will happen to him now. A neighbour is with him for now and is hoping to contact someone from social services for some emergency care.

Like Fourgates, our world would be smaller without the scooter. My OH uses the car for work so we rely on a mixture of walking, scooting and public transport. Scooting is particularly helpful for longer distances.

The issue is control / safety. My approach is to use a scooter strap and say no scooting in busy areas. This works for the good of my 3 year old and those around us.

Morgause there are a family today waiting to hear about their relatives care as the OAP was hit on the pavement by a car her husband will have to go into care - shall we ban cars?

You would be better placed looking at a real solution and that could be education in primary school of what to do and what not to do when using a scooter. Getting someone into the school with photographs of the old lady and her story and how when riding a scootter children must not be close to doorways and must be aware that there are others on the pavement they could hurt and injure.

The people responding here are those responsible parents who make sure their children scoot in safety for other pavement users.

We'd have no need for traffic laws if all drivers drove in safety. Because people don't then we have laws of the road. And because some parents don't control their children I think we need to enforce rules of the pavement.

According to earlier posters it is actually illegal to allow children to use scooters on the pavement. If that's the case then do those who allow it also disregard the law on roads?

Can you pick and choose which laws to keep?

I'm not sure of the legal position but, if it is illegal now, will those of you who allow scooting continue to allow it, knowing you are breaking the law?

'However for most people bike riding is a part of childhood - not learning til adulthood would be a great pity for many/ most children.'

MrT, why can't a child learn in the same sequence I did? I wasn't proposing that children don't learn asap, just that they do so in situations that increase in difficulty according to the level of skill possessed.
I agree that what stopped me cycling as much as I used to was moving from a bike friendly city to an area that wasn't. Proper cycle lanes and paths are essential IMO.

Rufus43 unpowered scooters or powered scooters? as when searching for scooters it brings up a whole wealth of powered scooters accidents. Also out of the 2200 people hurt how many where actually on the scooter and how many were pedestrians on a pavement?

Morgause the legal aspect sounds like a grey area from the quotations people have cited so far.

Of course people pick and choose what laws to obey in real life! If you've never driven at 75mph on a British motorway then you are in the minority of UK driving licence holders I very strongly suspect! Where we live there are actual laws about not mowing your lawn on a Sunday nor using public playgrounds between 12noon and 2pm - we break the playground one almost daily (our house is the only one that actually boarders on the playground in our village ;) )

The same thing very nearly happened to me when I was coming out of my gate carrying my daughter. We live on a hill, so if a child is scooting near to the front walls/fences we can't see them and they're going fast by the time they get to us. Parents are so aware of the need to stop at roads but they don't think about people coming out of their gates.

ivykatie44 no idea I'm afraid! I was looking for laws on scooter use and came across that

A friend of mine broke her ankle cos she thought it was a good idea to scoot her child's scooter home after drop off

I don't think many people are calling for an outright ban on bikes and scooters (ridden by children) on the pavement, just more consideration, more parental control and more safety advice possibly through schools

I agree with the OP . Another thing that annoys me is children on those turbo skates in busy shopping areas . . .

I don't agree with an outright ban as I don't think it's the scooter that's the problem- it's the reckless children who are badly supervised that causes the problem.

My DD was mown into by a 5 year old scooting far too fast round a corner when she was only just 3 years old. She went flying and I was really concerned about her but luckily she escaped with just a few bruises and a grazed leg and hip.

The child's parent was walking quite far behind and he ran up to ask if my daughter was alright and I said "not really, considering she's just been knocked for six by your child!"

His response? " Sorry but he's not been using one for long and is not very good on them!"

I told him that he should perhaps be supervising him more closely if that's the case!

I do look left and right now, yes. Otherwise, why would you? You don't expect anyone to be moving above walking pace, and you can see adults above the fence/hedge.

Zola if you don't look / didn't previously surely you are always walking out into people? The whole concept of right of way if going straight ahead on the main carriageway and giving way if entering traffic from a side road or drive way may not legally apply to pedestrians the way it does on the road, but it makes a lot of sense and is a little crazy to barrel/ wander out of your drive onto a pavement without looking!

People (children or adults) using any kind of wheeled "fun" (rather than necessary for mobility) conveyance inside are hugely antisocial though - we were on a ferry recently and there was a girl of about 9 using those wheely trainers in the bar that was clearly insane - her parents were glowing proudly at her and nobody said anything, but she was a menace. I've not come across scooters in shops/ indoor shopping centres but clearly that is antisocial just as an adult cycling through the place would be, and a whole different deal to the public pavement.

argh missed the crucial word indoors* from my last post!!!!

OK. From what I've read some of you have been upset by children on scooters. I take that on board. But my children will continue to scoot to school - and will continue to take care when other people are around.

If I were queen (and this is a game we play a lot at home) - I'd give the priority in suburban areas back to people and not cars. Narrower lanes for cars - slower speed limits - with more space for scooters and safe bike riding for children and slower adult riders.

I'm sorry your friend was hurt OP. I hope she makes a good recovery. But I still think

....scooter bans are bonkers.

(Sorry - pushed send too early )

Even if you look right/left when exiting your driveway/garden you can't always see small children until it's too late.

Parents need to be made to be more responsible for their children's actions when scooting/on bikes. Now call me cynical but people seem to take more notice of rules/laws when there is the danger that they will be hit where it hurts, eg, in the pocket. So possibly fines for those who do not control their children who are involved in an accident such as the one in the OP.

Children are really dangerous and I think we should ban them, if this child hadn't been alive this accident would never have happened.

(Sorry, no offence this was obviously a devastating accident, but why does everyone always try to ban something after an accident instead of everyone learning to do it better?)

Most people on here have said don't ban but get children to do it better

I find it depressing so many people think taking legal action is appropriate. It was an accident. One with tragic and unforeseen results, but an accident. Why the need to blame someone all the time?

Agree that parents need to keep scooting children under control, but I do not want to live in a culture where it is normal for parents to be sued when their children are involved in accidents.

I hope the lady involved recovers well op.

It has taken many generations worth of planning to get cars and pedestrians sharing (and even then, not harmoniously). Very slowly, cyclists are being factored into the equation but more often than not, architecture, finance and lack of space mean that it will be many decades before we get anywhere near the level of some built for purpose cities and towns (if ever). Ramming scooters into people's knees and ankles and knocking over old ladies is not helping anyone in the meantime, whether you are queen or not.

I'm not normally litigious but I think in this case maybe I am. M & A own their own little home and live on pensions. They don't have the money for expensive care homes, I know they use their savings to supplement their pensions because it worries M. Their son has a DC at university and another in sixth form and he doesn't have much spare cash.

If the law think someone else could be made to pay then so be it. Son will be seeing a lawyer in the next day or so and has our statements, I guess he'll be told if it's worth chasing.

How about in built speed controls on scooters or surfacing unsuitable pavements which coatings that prevent or deter use (bit like trolleys at supermarkets). Today, I saw an 8 yr old DC classmate on a scooter and you can see the school gate from her house and she was early - it just made my blood boil