to tell xp that his finances are not my problem

[thatisall]

Where to start?
XP and separated almost 7 years ago on weird terms (he was a cheat and a manipulative one) we remained uncomfortable friends if that makes sense. After several months of 'friendship' for dd sake but no maintenance/support at all, I contacted the CSA.

He was incensed that he had to pay 200 towards her every month. His payments have not been reassessed since then.

A few weeks ago whilst speaking to the CSA about a missing payment (he had paid, they had not passed it on) they suggested we check a few details were still correct as it had been so long. The fact that he changed jobs a few years ago was logged as a change.
When I say he changed jobs, he went from working in a call centre to something with what would now appear to be much better pay. I am confident, CONFIDENT that he told me he had already told the CSA.

Anyway today xp arrives to collect dd and 'wants a word'. It seems his pay has gone up dramatically and the CSA feel he may need to pay more and that as he is responsible for updating them he may have to pay the difference for the last 3 years.

XP asked me to tell them to stop the reassessment and agree to him paying an extra few quid per month (20 was his suggestion) directly to me without CSA involvement and to forget any debt that may have been accrued. He then implied that if I allowed the CSA to properly reassess him then the debt may be so large that he would struggle to be able to afford to see dd and then she would suffer and all because 'i want his money'.

This tells me that he knows he has been underpaying and quite dramatically by the sound of it. I'm bit that XP is still trying to manipulate me or that he thinks he still can! For years he could get his way by saying 'just think of what that would do to dd' or 'for dd's sake' but really it would be for his sake.

I don't want dd to suffer or miss seeing her df but i refuse to believe that times would be so tough that he couldn't afford to see his child!? Or that the CSA would enforce payments that would cause that??

Anyway in a shock move even to me, I remained cool as a cucumber and said 'with all due respect, this isn't my problem'

Honestly this is so unlike me that he was visibly taken aback. He picked up the CSA letter, announced that he would speak to a legal person and left with dd.

I'm struggling to sleep now wondering if i am being cold, spiteful or even cruel. Am i causing problems where there don't need to be any? We could definitely use that extra money however much it is.
The fact that I can't sleep also makes me wonder whether I am once again being manipulated

Am I being unreasonable?

[ChocHobNob]

Obviously YANBU to expect the extra child maintenance if his income has risen. But I'm slightly confused OP. Did he notify the CSA that he had changed jobs when he did and they just didn't do anything with that information (they are notorious for doing that and "forgetting" to reassess) or did he not notify the CSA when he changed jobs?

If the former then yes, the CSA will now do the reassessment and will backdate it to the date he provided the change of circumstances, encurring him a
large amount of arrears due to the CSA not recalculating and they can take arrears up to 40% of his wages a month which could leave him struggling financially. (Yes he should have questioned further why his payments didn't increase but he may have thought as the CSA did nothing with the information, then nothing was to be done)

If it is the latter and he never notified them of his change in employment, they wouldn't backdate the change in child support to when he changed jobs, only to when they suggested a reassessment when you rang about the missed payment.

[TheDoctrineOfPositivityYes]

YANBU. You handled it fine.

And if he was going to say something like that to DD, he'd say it anyway, whatever the facts. You know that, right?

[carabos]

My ex told me that if I "insisted" on pursuing him for maintenance that he claimed I didn't need because I could manage without it, he would stop seeing DS. This being on the grounds that I couldn't expect "to have it both ways".

He was true to his word and hasn't seen DS for 20 years. Oh, and he only paid up in dribs and drabs, usually on the courtroom steps. Cunt.

[christinarossetti]

The problem (or one of them) with giving into his threat about not seeing dd is that he will then use this at every opportunity to manipulate you into submission.

You are simply using the correct channels to do rift by your dd. I can't see how ant decent parent would expect you to do anything else. If the CSA have messed up or whether he has is, ad you succinctly put it, not your concern.

Hope that it goes well.

[WitchOfEndor]

Say to him "so you are telling me that you have knowingly underpaid money for your daughter for three years and now you are being asked to pay the amount you should you are threatening not to see her? Our daughter would be devastated to know that you appeared to care so little for her that you would do this". Puts the responsibility for his actions firmly back with him.

Arsewipe.

[HappyMummyOfOne]

Cant you speak like adults about money and come to an agreement?

Work out the costs of childcare, food, clothes and school costs for the month, deduct his £200, your £200 plus CB and any CTC and if there is still a deficit then share it between you. Both parties should pay equal and there is less room for animosity if that is the case.

[jammiedonut]

Please don't back down over his threats. As a child who suffered through this sort of thing fom age 8, believe me you soon start to see how manipulative your nr parent can be. Fwiw my dad lied to csa for years about his income and managed to avoid paying anything. During the week with mum we would struggle to avoid enough food, any heating and the electricity meter was always a struggle to keep running. Every other weekend at dads I was taken out, showered with new clothes/ gifts and told how 'evil' my mother was. As soon as I could stop visits to my dad, I did. I couldn't care less about 'stuff' because my mother loved me and would do anything for me, whilst dad moved two hours away and expected me to get the train to see him (age11) and wouldn't even drive to get me from the station.

The csa caught up with him eventually and he received a letter this year (i m now 25) notifying him that the claim has been backdated and £120 a month is taken out of his wages until the debt clears. Even now, he is adamant that is all he can afford, but I know the contrary!. He had the cheek to call me and complain, and used all the excuses you listed in your op as why he hadn't paid then, and as it was all in the past my mum should forget. I told her to keep the money nd treat herself!

[ChippingInNeedsSleepAndCoffee]

YANBU not even a tiny bit.

I am very impressed at how cool and in control you were. He's a manipulative bastard, they don't stop being like that just because you aren't together.

The money is to 'raise' your DD, not to 'treat' your DD. Poor old Disney Dad might have to downgrade the Rollercoaster weekends (but I doubt it, CSA is a pittance as a percentage of what they earn) but it is not going to be enough (even considering the back payment) to stop him being able to put petrol in the car.

The fuckwit is manipulating you - or rather trying to - don't let him!

[ChippingInNeedsSleepAndCoffee]

HappyMummOfOne - nope. Not with a controlling arsewipe like this you can't. For at least 3 years he has been in a position to make his daughters life more comfortable and he has chosen not to. You can't speak like adults with a man like this nor expect them to honour the agreement.

[TheBleedinObvious]

Yanbu

He knows he is in the wrong and he is now trying to manipulate you.

He should have declared the change years ago. He didnt and you deserve all the unpaid money.

They should also fine him for not declaring a change in income.

Don't discuss it with him, if he bring it up tell him you don't want to be involved and that is why CAS is involved, to simplify the money issues for separated parents.

[FoxyRoxy]

YADNBU!

My ex still pays the same as he did 10 years ago, although he has changed jobs and earns significantly more now than he did then. I can't go through the CSA as I now live abroad but if I could I damn well would! Stand your ground, he is being manipulative and emotionally blackmailing you.

[IneedAsockamnesty]

Happymummy,

You are obsessed with CB and CTC but you never appear to understand that it is normal for a child's costs to fall in line with the parents income,lifestyle costs increase with higher incomes.

[Sunnysummer]

YANBU at all - well done for being calm, and it's great that the CSA can manage all of this, so that you can stay cool as a cucumber throughout and entirely abide with the decisions of an impartial third party.

He's already benefited from three years of extra cash, if you feel guilty or worry that he might use this information to manipulate your
DD, perhaps you could use the money for something clearly for her - like starting a university savings fund, or even just redoing her room if its a bit less? If she asks where the money is from, you can tell her that there was an official mixup and there was extra money for her (rather than it being dad giving her extra cash, or a battle between mum and dad that she might see a need to take sides on).

[Amibambini]

This is one of the few AIBU that made me shout "O.M.G" out loud.
This bloke is a total bullshitter, and is trying to manipulate you to get out of his responsibities as a parent.

Stand your ground. If he comes wriggling like the worm he sounds like, look him in the eye and ask "Is your daughter's financial security not a priority to you, you worm?".

Let CSA do their thing. You are definitely, definitely NBU.

[hermioneweasley]

CSA contribution is pathetic. If he's not even paying the minimum then he's got plenty to live on.

I LOVED your response!

Do not back down! This is for your DD. if it leaves you with extra you can put it aside in savings for her. If he tries to emotionally blackmail through her, then that is his issue. As much as it might hurt your Dd, you are not responsible for his behaviour or choices.

[IneedAsockamnesty]

Op.

Yanbu,

The csa calculates a very minimal % of the nrp's income it is the minimum he is required to pay and the maximum you can enforce payment of.it also takes into account his family circumstances.

He was legally obliged to inform them of the change in his circumstances he chose not to.

His arrears (if he is employed as opposed to self employed) will be clawed back at another % of his available income. This would not have happened if he had done what he was obliged to do.

If his contact related travel is really an issue for him he can apply for a variation to have his petrol costs deducted from his payments with a cost formula used by the csa.

You do not have to do anything like take him to court or fill out any forms its down to the csa.

[littlemisssarcastic]

YANBU.

Not sure CSA should take into account family circumstances tbh, since the % are affordable anyway imo but that's another bug bear of mine.

[IneedAsockamnesty]

Its one of mine as well, but they do.

[littlemisssarcastic]

Now if that doesn't tell you that the CSA are not out to get the NRP, and actually want to make sure the NRP is able to afford the maintenance the CSA sets, I don't know how else they can show they are not the NRP's enemy.

[Beckamaw]

He is clearly living in Twatland.
If your income increased, you would be able to give your DD an enhanced standard of living:- nicer clothes, holidays etc.
he believes that it is perfectly acceptable to reap the benefits of his own enhanced standard of living, without passing a bean of it onto his own child. Then he attempts to start a pity party when he is expected to pass some of that extra cash onto his child.
Boo fucking hoo. The CSA are doing their job to ensure that your child is looked after. End of.
Poor diddums should have been honest in the first place. He wasn't. It isn't your problem.

[ChocHobNob]

All those saying he has chose not to tell the CSA he changed jobs ... have you read the OP?

"The fact that he changed jobs a few years ago was logged as a change."

" I am confident, CONFIDENT that he told me he had already told the CSA."

The Ex TOLD the csa he had a new job. It would appear, the CSA in their completely incompetent wisdom didn't bother recalculating the child maintenance the ex should pay when he correctly notified them he had changed jobs!

The anger should be aimed at the CSA, not solely the ex. The CSA's incompetence has meant the OP has received less money than she should for 3 years. The CSA'S incompetence has meant that the ex has now been lumbered with 3 yrs worth of arrears which could well cause him financial difficulty if they insist on reclaiming it at 40% of his wages every month. Not to mentioned the CSA'S incompetence has now caused more animosity between the OP and her ex which in turn affects the child.

[ChocHobNob]

"Boo fucking hoo. The CSA are doing their job to ensure that your child is looked after. End of."

No, the CSA haven't done their job. It would appear the CSA have monumentally cocked up causing problems for the OP and her ex.

[DontmindifIdo]

YANBU - Stuntgirl is right with: People often say "I can't afford it" when what they really mean is "I can't afford it AND keep doing things exactly how I currently doing them". Well, that's life!

So your ExP will have to make a choice to give something up in his lifestyle, if he loves his DD, seeing her won't be the thing he gives up. Think about it, think about all the things in your life, is there anything you wouldn't give up in order to see your DD? Is there anything that you rate higher? Would you pick a bigger car, posher holiday, meals out, nicer food, nicer house if getting that meant you didn't get to see your DD again? Of course not! There's nothing I'd not sacrifice in order to see my DCs. If he loves your DD, he'll be the same, he'll cut back elsewhere in order to see her. If that means the nice house in the country has to go, or the car, or the social life, or new clothes. If he doesn't do that, then he's not really worth worrying about because anyone who can drop their DC so easily will do it eventually anyway.

If you don't need the money now, take it anyway and stick it in a savings account for DD for the future. I bet he's not been saving money for her uni or first house deposit with the money he's withheld from her.

He's been funding his lifestyle by stealing from his child. Don't feel sorry for him.

[RalphGnu]

He could end up paying a significant amount if they find he is in arrears. A few years back, due to a 'misunderstanding' between DP's ex and the CSA, DP had approx 45% of his salary taken through an attachment of earnings, for three months, as he was perceived to be in arrears. It was sorted out eventually and he got the money back, but the CSA (when they pull their finger out) will come down on the side of your daughter rather than your ex. It's what is fair and what is right.

The only way he can avoid paying is by giving up his job.