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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to sleep-deprive my toddler?

60 replies

pookamoo · 14/08/2013 20:53

Since Christmas, DD2 has been staying up until 10pm or later. No amount of any of the usual bedtime things has made a difference. She won't settle for DH and I am a zombie.

She is 2 next month and I am experimenting this week with keeping her awake all day (i.e. forcing her to drop her afternoon nap). Every day = out like a light at 7.

She is having a horrible time of it though and I do feel bad. She's mopey and crying and clingy all afternoon, she even asked to go to sleep today! Sad I've been letting her have quiet time with TV so she can just zone out before teatime.

Am I actually being unfair to her? The benefit is to me, because DH and I get our evenings back, even though it's hard going in the afternoons. Is it just a transitional phase? DD1 was nothing like this.

OP posts:
HPsauceonbaconbuttiesmmm · 14/08/2013 20:57

Yes i think you're being unfair. Let her nap, just keep it short and early. Even my 3yr old can go to bed on time if he has half an hour before 3pm. Forcing her to stay awake isn't a good plan imho.

girliefriend · 14/08/2013 20:59

I would allow a power nap of about 10mins and only before 2pm.

mumofweeboys · 14/08/2013 21:01

Hi

One of mine just turned 2 and I've been cutting down the naps due to lots of screaming and crying at bedtime (7pm) and getting up at 5am - I have a gate on his room so he can't get out so its lots of banging about his room until he goes to sleep which disturbs my other boys.

If been trying different lengths of nap - he has to have one otherwise he just curls up on the floor and goes to sleep around 5pm. I've found if he has about 30 mins to maximum of an hour he still goes down to bed ok.

Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 21:01

It does feel really unfair.

Any tips on how to get her to nap earlier?

I had thought a couple of months ago that trying to get a morning sleep instead would help, but she just wouldn't go down until about 12 and then she usually only napped for 20 minutes anyway. (bearing in mind this has been a 7 month pattern now)

In the hot weather she started sleeping for 2 hours 11-1 (right over lunch time Hmm) and in both instances she's exactly the same at bedtime - no sleep before 10pm. e v e r...

OP posts:
ThePosterBelowMeSucks · 14/08/2013 21:04

I'd let her nap, half hour and make sure she's up by 1pm latest.

ChunkyPickle · 14/08/2013 21:04

I don't know, but am in a similar position.

DS is knackered after playgroup, and often falls asleep in the car on the way home. He wants to sleep for 2-3 hours, but if he does then he doesn't want to go to bed at 8:30. If he doesn't, or if I wake him up early then he's an absolute brat until he goes to bed at 8 or 8:30.

I'm very pregnant, and knackered myself, so I'm afraid I let him sleep, then let DP deal with him in the evening Blush. It's not a long term solution though, so I'm hoping he'll start dropping the nap come winter.

Edendance · 14/08/2013 21:05

How long was the napping for and at what time? Going without a nap will get her back into the habit of going down to sleep nicely and at a decent time so maybe re-introduce an hour long sleep maybe at 1ish and hopefully it'll continue. She needs to get enough sleep for her brain and body to do enough growing, it's just about finding a balance!

roslet · 14/08/2013 21:11

DD dropping her aftern

Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 21:15

edendance Her nap pattern just changed in the hot weather (but not her bedtime pattern). She did about 20 - 40 minutes maximum at about 12 /1pmish (straight after lunch). Recently she wants 2 hours from about the same time.

I did think I might give it a few more days and see what happens if she does have a nap. If we go anywhere in the car after lunch she would almost certainly drop off.

There were times she wouldn't want to sleep in the day anyway, and weirdly, she seemed to get a second wind after bathtime.

OP posts:
roslet · 14/08/2013 21:18

Sorry, posted too soon. DD dropping her 2h afternoon nap aged 2 was much easier than when her older brother dropped his, as she then had a 20 min power nap in the buggy during the afternoon school run. She seems to wake up less groggy from a nap in the buggy, probably cause its hard to go into a deep sleep. Maybe you could try boring her into a mini nap on a little buggy trip mid afternoon each day.

OHforDUCKScake · 14/08/2013 21:30

I have a 2.3 year old.

Hes in between naps. I.e needing ti drop them.

So I let him have 10 minutes. Not a minute more or a minute less.

He goes to bed at 6.30-7pm.

However, if he was to have a 15 minute nap he'd be up til 9pm, dont even want to think about him having a half an hour nap!

So yes, I think YABU. Let the baby nap, she desperately needs it. Just cut it short. I have a stock of tiny ice lollies in the freezer, so when its hard to wake him from his nap I wave one of them at him and he soon perks up.

OHforDUCKScake · 14/08/2013 21:32

Im confused by people saying "they want to sleep for 2 hours"

So you let them? No wonder they go to bed late!

I thought it answer was pretty simple, dont let them nap for 2 hours?

runningonwillpower · 14/08/2013 21:37

Over-tired children do not sleep well.

They just learn to get by on not-enough sleep. Albeit in a grumpy bad-tempered way.

Catsize · 14/08/2013 21:46

As my dear old mum says... 'Sleep begets sleep'. My son sometimes sleeps for two hours in the afternoon, sometimes waking at, say, 17:00, but still goes to bed okay most of the time. Have always just let him sleep whenever he wants and for however long he wants.
They are doing a lot of growing and brain developing I guess, so sleep is essential.
Keeping someone awake as an adult is a recognised torture method! Not suggesting you are torturing your child OP, but shows the point a bit! Wink
Sadly, your evenings may be sacrificed for now, but it won't be forever. Do not despair. Brew

OHforDUCKScake · 14/08/2013 21:50

Cat size, if I let my children sleep when they liked, I wouldnt have had an evening for the last 6 years.

For my own sanity, I need my evenings.

I wonder though, if your child (who has naps when he likes yet still goes to bed at 'bed time' despite the nap) wouldnt sleep until 10pm each night because of his marathon nap, you would be giving out that advise with such ease?

I dont think you would be Wink.

Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 21:56

Thanks everyone.

I think she's been "overtired" for so long now that she doesn't even notice it! Certainly her sleep has been far, far better at night this week without the naps. She has never slept through yet in her life, so I am hoping for a miracle! She has also been waking up happier in the mornings, at the same time (about 6).

So just thinking aloud (for those still with me!):

Nap in day = she sleeps from about 10pm til 6am with 3 or 4 wakings in the night. Waking up grumpy.

No nap in day = she sleeps from about 7pm til 6am with 2 to 3 wakings in the night. Waking up happier ("Hello Mummy!" instead of "grrrrr waahhhh!")

I don't think it's the length of the nap that makes a difference. As I've said a couple of times, she was the same on a 20 minute nap as she is on a 2 hour nap (or even when she occasionally decided she wasn't going to nap at all - on her own terms!).

I'll do one more day with no nap, and then the coming weekend is all over the place anyway as we're staying at PIL which adds excitement into the mix so she may or may not get a daytime sleep depending on what's going on.

Next week maybe I'll try a timed nap to see if we can still get her down to bed at 7.

Poor DD1 is being very patient through all this. :(

(maybe I should get MNHQ to move this to Sleep, although I am pretty sure IABU to the poor baby)

OP posts:
Lonecatwithkitten · 14/08/2013 21:58

I think that different children have very different sleep patterns and only by experimentation can you find what works.
My DD was an excellent sleeper at night, but drop day naps long before I was ready. That is until she turned 4 and then who knows what happened, but 5am was the new time to wake. I tried everything going o be earlier, later, return to bed, join me in my bed nothing worked. By the time she was 5.5 and could switch on the TV herself I was on my knees with sleep deprivation (I work nights on call so have raspy sleep patterns anyway).
At 8.5 she suddenly stopped waking up so early and now I have to wake her in the mornings. Again I tried making he bed time earlier or later no difference.

OHforDUCKScake · 14/08/2013 22:01

Id honestly try 10 minutes. If my 2yo had a 20 minute nap be'd not sleep until 10pm either. 10 mins makes a huge difference.

He too wakes at 6 and 6 trillion times inbetween whether he has napped or not.

He wakes up smiling no matter what though I dont.

Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 22:02

Ohforducksake I will try it after the weekend and see what happens I think!

OP posts:
Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 22:03

lonecat I think your DD IBVU! Wink

OP posts:
Catsize · 14/08/2013 22:04

ducks, to be honest, I probably would. He only started to sleep through at 18mths or so, and often still wakes in the night, so all not perfect. And he has never been the 'put in bed awake and shut the door type', so we have had different struggles. However, we feel the sacrifice, such as it may be, is relatively short-lived. Also not ideal as we both have to work in the evenings. Sometimes frustrating, and dinner can be very late, but tonight, for example, was fine. Just means that when he is awake, he is a happy little fruit and not grizzly and tired. That is the 'reward' I guess.

pommedechocolat · 14/08/2013 22:07

Dd1 dropped her nap at 19-20 months.

She wouldn't get tired until 4pm ish which was obviously a no no!

I did two teas really, main one at 4pm and then a large snack with milk before bath and bed.

Early tea perked her up and kept her going, worked pretty well.

auntmargaret · 14/08/2013 22:12

Are you vipers really so rigid on naps? I have a 2 year old, sometimes she doesn't nap, sometimes 2-3hrs. Doesn't affect bedtime, or sleep length at all. Go with the flow. Be kind. If sleep is needed, let her nap. Overtired children stay up way longer, and sleep way less. (I speak from experienceGrin )

EST0106 · 14/08/2013 22:15

My dd would kill me if I woke her up after 10 mins! She is asleep for 7.15 pm, I get her up at 7.30am mon-thurs for work/nursery and let her sleep in at weekends til 8/8.30, she has 1 hr nap at nursery but 2 plus at weekends, 12.30-2.30 pm ish. She is the most miserable child when she's tired, and fortunately she takes after me and loves her bed, fingers crossed the next ones the same. She's 2.2. Apparently DH napped until he started school!

Original poster
pookamoo · 14/08/2013 22:16

catsize the DDs have been applying sleep deprivation torture to me and DH for 5 years now! Wink

It's just the loss of evenings has actually sent me into crazytown mode. The doctor told me if we didn't sort the sleep out it would be affecting my marriage and after 7 months of me not seeing DH in the evenings as he gets home from work after I have started "bedtime", she was probably right. DD2 would not settle for DH at all, so it was down to me, and 7pm til 10pm in a darkened room from Feb to August has really taken its toll. I have become a pretty shouty mummy towards DD1, poor thing. :(

Early tea good idea, pommeI have been giving snacks until 5pm, when they have their tea.

OP posts:
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