To think that if your answer to complaining about Bedroom Tax is "get a smaller house", you are a bit thick?

[MarmaladeTwatkins]

Where IS this glut of smaller properties, just waiting to be filled by people being stung by the bedroom tax?

TWICE today I have heard supposedly intelligent people say "Well if they don't want to pay the bedroom tax, they need to move to a smaller house."

Fucking depressing. I think it earmarks you as being a bit hard of thinking if that is your solution. :(

What would your plan entail, filee?

I think filee is getting a hard time for just putting down her honest opinion. Of course nobody expects only rich people to be able to have children or for only those who can afford private bathrooms or swimming pools to be able to procreate and there is no point to that level of sarcasm.
Filee is merely pointing out the sense of entitlement that people feel they have; that they deserve a bigger council house because they have decided to have more children.
Having children is a choice. Fair enough if you are happy to have 4 children in the one bedroom council flat that you already live in then go ahead and make those babies, but there is something uncomfortable about people EXPECTING to be rehoused because they have had more children than they feel they can cater for in the space that they have available. Surely people should consider how many children they can manage either space wise, time wise, or financially before they create them and surely they should consider what will happen if the child is a certain sex or if they have a multiple birth.
It's all part of the family planning process.

runningchick many single people start off in a one bed council place.....they have kids then yes,its their right to upgrade! do you fully understand how social housing works?

it works the other way too....a family in a 3 bed also have the right to downsize to a one bed.....as life changes,then so does peoples housing needs.....once you have the much coveted social housing tenancy,you can move around as you please with it!!

I think filee makes a good point.

People have to take respondibility for their own children. I just get so irritated by the learned helplessness and utter dependence on the state.

Of course families should be helped if they've been made redundant, become ill, had triplets etc. But the grasping, entitled attitude that I've seen just makes me so sad. (I've seen this through work. Not referring to anyone on here)

It's the children I feel sorry for, where are their rights exactly? Not even afforded a tiny bit of personal space, it's awful.

My plan would be ANYTHING that prevented my children from growing up in cramped unsuitable conditions, and sterilisation.

you can say that filee but you,same as others,are only one step (redundancy,divorce etc) from being homeless and winding up in bed and breakfast temporary accomadation....it happens

also,hawkmoom,how exactly are people in HA relying on the state? can you explain please?

Anyone who is receiving benefits and who choses to have more children. People in HA homes are reliant on the state to subsidise these homes, no?

Am I alone or unreasonable to think that benefits OF ANY KIND should be a safety net and not a lifestyle?

Something has to be done and I agree with the bedroom tax in principle but the implementation is wrong. I don't think people who are in properties that are too big but can't find a swap should be penalised.

I wonder if a waiting list system could be implemented, where people go on a waiting list to downsize. Whilst on the list they wouldn't pay the bedroom tax, but if they refuse a suitable property (certain parameters would need to be decided e.g. close to current school) they would then be forced to pay the tax.

lol hawkmoon no they are not....where did you get that from??

Sorry, terrible grammar.

I just feel frustrated with the system. I'd like to see more help for the very vulnerable. And a lot less help for the very lazy.

What the hell has having loads of kids in a one bed flat got to do with being in temp accommodation? Or is that just a generic answer you dish out when your argument is lost?

Fact is there are people who consider their children's right to space when breeding and people who don't. It's got nothing to do with falling on hard times or not.

YANBU Op.

All reliable figures show that there IS a shortage of smaller properties for folks to move to if they want to, plus you have to factor in the cost of removals, charges for cancelling utilities, possibly needing different furniture for a smaller property because your old stuff won't fit, let alone all the things to do with commuting to work or school, proximity to family and care responsibilities, uprooting children and swapping schools, you know, all the things that come with moving that can be distressing and stressful at the best of times.

Does it really matter if the "popular name" isn't an accurate one? The Community Charge was NOT a genuine Poll Tax, but it still got called that. I cringed at the term "Credit Crunch" but it gained traction as a means of describing a complex economic phenomenon. Dismissing a "thing" because you don't like what it's called is bu.

HSS my understanding is that people who can't afford up buy or privately rent a home are given a council house - which is subsidised by the state. Through housing benefit and/or cheap rent. Am I wrong? Happy to be told I am!

Hawk.

Social housing is funded via rents they are a self supporting thing.

Plus I have been in temp accommodation and I have a two bed council house which I will make sure I don't have six kids in so that I get 'bumped up the list' so before imagining you are the only one who 'knows what it's like' think again.

Disclaimer - I only know 2 families who live in council houses. Both claim housing benefit and could not afford a similar sized property if they were renting privately.

sock but aren't those rents very low? In comparison to the market rate?

Sorry, really do want to understand. One of the families I know has fallen on very tough times due to severe illness. That's why they're on benefits and in a council flat. The other family planned a second child to get a larger place and completely play the system and it makes my blood boil.

Hawkmoon have you or any of your relatives ever bought their own council house? Of so then shocking though it is, they have had a huge subsidy from the state.

HA homes - once they paid for and maintainence is covered are in profit. Buy to let landlords buy places because they know that once the mortgage is paid then the profit is theirs. Same with HA but in their case they will actively USE the profit to build more homes. Also if a landlord lets to. Tenant on HB can you explain how exactly they are not benefiting from the State?

We have a LL locally who advertises in the paper with "Housing Benefit accepted...deposits available from the job centre". He actively seeks out HB clients.

well if you're newly pregnant ....like the poster upthread who you accused of 'apalling parenting' then do you expect her to abort?? she asked you the same thing,not sure if you answered her....

jake No. None of my relatives have ever lived in a council house.

hawk you can work and occupy a social housing home you know.....where,shock,horror,nobody in that household receives a single benefit payment....you do know that right??

I think at one time families were actually advised to "have another child" to strengthen their case for bigger housing......madness IMHO.

We have very few houses bigger than three bedroom available locally, very few two bed houses....two bedrooms usually means a flat. I am in one of the very few two bedroom houses in my town....and only have one child so won't ever need anything bigger.....only smaller.

I have done the lot....had the mortgage, privately rented too and am now in a HA home....not something I planned twenty years ago but life changes.

I have been a ll. I'm not sure I'd see renting a property to a ha tenant as getting a state benefit thought

Anyway.... If anyone else can enlighten me, I'd be delighted. Honestly, really interested to understand more.

HSS yes, but in that scenario you're getting cheaper rent aren't you? Than if you rented privately? So it is a "benefit" from the state isn't it? Or do I have that all wrong...