Re School Transport

[KrazyKurls]

I honestly don't know if I am being unreasonable over this, please give me some perspective!

We live 1.9 miles from DS1's school and he has up until now been taking the school bus at a cost of £90 per annum. We live on a 60 mph country road with no pavements, absolutely no safe way to walk to school, there is no public transport at all.

We are really struggling financially at the moment and I phoned the school transport people today to appeal payment (we have 3 DC so will soon be £300 per annum). I was told that school transport is offered as a safe route to school and that is what we should use. I did say what if we absolutely cannot afford to get DS to school? Her response was to appeal but she has never known anyone get away with not paying in 4 years.

I could have taken him in the car but DH needs this for work, he has recently had his company car and fuel car taken off him due to cut backs.

To put into context we have had to move 400 miles away, rent out or own home at a loss, take on a massive rent (but the cheapest we could find) to allow DH to stay in a job. We have cut back to the bare bones of everything, I can't think of any other way that we can economise.

I can't work as DH works erratic hours often not home till after 9 pm and most weekends. We have no childcare as so far from friends and family. I am applying to do an induction course though into childminding.

The cut off to pay is 2 miles.

I meant can they have sandwiches or is it no cheaper? I admire you taking responsibility for all this, think OP wants to too.

X-posted with a load of people there. The link marmalada has posted sounds useful -it has specific guidance on the risk assessment the council should do to assess if a route is safe for walking. If I were you I would request from the council the details of the risk assessment.

If you'd like me to fiddle about with the datasets to get you the info you need, I'd be happy to, just send me a PM. I'd need the number of the road you'd have to walk on, but no more than that. I'm on maternity leave atm anyway and I can always do with refreshing my Excel skills :)

Have extracted the following from our LA website. Does your LA have a Transport Policy which covers this OP? :-

APPLICATION FOR FREE SCHOOL TRANSPORT PROVISION ON
?EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS ROUTES? GROUNDS
Introduction
The law requires a Local Authority (LA) to provide free transport to pupils under 8 years of age, to
their nearest school where they live over 2 miles away by the shortest pedestrian route. The
distance is 3 miles for older pupils. The law also requires LA?s to consider whether a route to
school is abnormally hazardous, and to provide free transport where the LA believes this is
necessary. If parents believe the route is extremely hazardous, the LA has the duty to assess the
hazards and reach a decision whether to provide free transport.

Saying i admire you sounds a bit preachy, sorry, just trying to be supportive!

This also gives some good information and tells you which bits of the 1996 and 2006 Education Acts are relevant. The government released and then had to retract some statutory guidance earlier this year about transport as it was illegal (as not consulted on correctly) so make sure that your LA have reverted back to the correct guidance.

Soory, just thinking about it a bit more, you should appeal under the grounds that they have not appropriately applied their criteria, and use the safe walking distance info marmalada has given to base the appeal on. You can then use a) their own risk assessment of the route (if they have done one) and b) any useful info from the datasets / photos / vehicle logs to back you up.

OP I hope you won't take any notice of the sad Pratt truss dwellers experience limited, none aware of their own failing sour pointless posters.

Invite them to walk it with you and see if any turn up, and or prepared to eat their words, if you are near me south hams I'll walk it for you and give an opinion.

Most the lanes around here are 60, and you would be suicidal to attempt to walk the main road ones, I always pick up anyone attempting to do so, as over the years I have known personally quite a few of the people killed.

Invite the CEO of the county council to join you to walk the route at 8am on a school morning, the local paper will be happy to cover the event.

the invitation usually makes them reconsider,

ask for a risk assessment from the local council,

Go to all your local parish council meetings, all of them each and every week, and stay to the end each and every time, ask where the direct footpath/cycle path is going to go, future proofing for a community.

be calm persistent and relentless, point out that if you are being forced into risking walking children along the main road then so will others, and soon that will end in a tragedy, ask what the parish council is doing to avoid this,

Ask at each meeting, usually a bit at the end for doing this, they should help you to tackle the local county council.

join the parish council,

Inneed.

If your children have a unsafe route and you can prove it is unsafe then your children would also qualify for free transport to school, the same as the op's children will if she can prove it.

The LA has a statutory duty to provide transport if the route is genuinely unsafe.

Shame they rely on parents knowing this and how to challenge it instead of just doing it.because they hope they can get away without funding.

mamalda that info is fan thanks, they don't have a set appeals procedure I was told to just e-mail them but don't expect anything.

Duchess that is so kind of you and I will take you up on your lovely offer when I've waded through it all

We don't get free school meals, of we did we wouldn't have to pay.

inneed you haven't answered my earlier questions? I have worked all my life, always shift work when DH wasn't home until we moved. I am not work shy. I really don't want to explain all the reasons why at this moment I can't get a job out of home to everyone on mumsnet but if it helps you come to terms with my situation I can PM you

OP chose to have 3 kids and live where she does (to a point) but it sounds like she's had a lot if shut happen since the key decisions were made that has affected the outcome.

I would not want to walk or cycle a road like that with 3 kids 5 and under in tow. One child I might bug not with 2 younger ones as well. They would then have to go there and back twice s day!

Can you get them to let you pay m

Can you get them to let you pay monthly? I know it's still a strain each m

Gah stupid phone!

Still a strain each month but not as bad as all in one go.

Definitely appeal based on the lack of a safe walking route.

And look into free school meals, it could make all the difference to you

Best of luck

quoteunquote had much more useful advice than me, listen to them!

Page 31 of the DfE info sets out what is expected as regards appeals. It says should not must but I seem to remember one of the lawyers on MN saying that should in law means that they have to do it, or have something at least as good in place.

I am a big fan of emailing people at the council to clarify info, and copying in heads of departments. If you quote legislation and statutory guidance whilst asking why they are not following it you tend to get pretty quick responses!

Op - this is what is said by my local council about transport:-

All distances are measured by the shortest safe walking route, and if there is not a safe walking route as calculated by the Local Authority's GIS system, transport assistance may be available.

As others have said your first job is to ask for the "safe walking route". Then time yourself walking 1.9 miles with the kids. Then do some car counting for the relevant time. It is likely to be 2 or 3 thousand cars / lorries passing you on the road (assuming your 1 per second estimate is right) which doesn't sound too safe to me.

If you are entitled to free school meals but send a packed lunch why don't you apply for them? The money you save on packed lunch would surely cover the transport costs?
It sounds like you have good grounds for appeal though, my ds is 5 and there is no chance I'd be letting him walk or cycle either. Good luck.

The OP has already said that she has been told to apply for monthly payments when the £90 becomes due and they will sort it out for her.
She only has 1 child who will be going to school, her other 2 do not start for over a year for the 2nd child and later than that for the third so she has to pay £90 and it will probably be in instalments. What is her problem ?

3boys she does not get free school meals.

A household member who works prohibits the issue of fsm no matter what the household income.

Ah thanks pixie misread op's post.

If the average adult walks 4mph, the route would be over half an hour. I'm no expert but I'm pretty sure those kids won't be walking at that speed so conservative estimate of 45 mins each way (prob more like an hour!). OP and her 2 youngest children would be walking 3 hours or more per day, all weathers, along a dangerous road. Eldest will walk at least an hour and a half with a full school day in between.

What if younger kids are ill? Does DS miss school cause you can't make ill brother walk for 3 hours+? Walking ill child to a bus stop or getting a neighbour to sit with them for 5 mind while taking eldest to bus stop is much more feasible

I got the bus to high school but often chose to walk home which is prob about the same distance as OPs school but a much safer route. I walked to primary. I hate when parents loads kids into the car, drive literally round the corner and unload kids. Takes at least as long as walking would have and makes it more dangerous for those who do walk. But I do not think walking is a viable option for OP and her family. Obviously you feel the cost of the bus is not viable either. School/LEA should help.

allmycats her problem is that she is really struggling financially at the moment, and £90 may not sounds a lot to you, but to the OP it is a significant amount.

In addition, I would say that it is pretty clear from what the OP has said that the council are not acting under statutory guidelines, as there is no safe way to walk to school. It is required for LEAs to provide free transport to school where there is no safe walking route.

"Under the Education Act 1996 (as amended by the Education and
Inspections Act 2006) Local Authorities have the duty to provide travel
arrangements free of charge for certain categories of children. These
are known as ?eligible children?"

and

"Children who can?t be expected to walk because of nature of the route
These are children living within statutory walking distance of the nearest
qualifying school, but the route is not safe for walking. A parent or
carer would be expected to accompany a child if this would reduce the
risk sufficiently.

Example
"Matilda aged 10 lives 2.5 miles from school but the route is along an unlit road with no pavement
and speeding cars and is unsafe even for adults. She is likely to be eligible for transport."

And from the Department of Education guidance:

Children unable to walk in safety to school
because of the nature of the route
81. Where children live within ?statutory walking
distance? of their nearest qualifying school (or
other place where education is provided under
section 19(1)), local authorities will be under a
duty to make travel arrangements where the
nature of the route is such that a child can not
reasonably be expected to walk (accompanied
as necessary) in reasonable safety.

84 In conducting the risk assessment, local
authorities should take a range of factors
into consideration, including:
? the age of the child;
? whether any potential risks might be
mitigated if the child were accompanied
by an adult (see also para 86 below);
? the width of any roads travelled along and
the existence of pavements;
? the volume and speed of traffic travelling
along any roads;
? the existence or otherwise of street lighting;
and
? the condition of the route at different times
of the year, at the times of day that a child
would be expected to travel to and
from school.

From what the OP has said, her route to school is very similar to mine. Roads are not very wide, speeds are high (60mph), there are no pavements, (I assume) no street lighting, high volume of traffic in school rush hour. My LA has assessed the route as not safe for walking, reasonably so in my opinion. To me it sounds as though her LA has ignored the statutory guidelines they have to follow in order to cut costs. By all the OP has said, she should be eligible for free school transport and I'm shocked that so many people on here think it's ok for her LA to brush her off and dodge their responsibilities.

I think the bus fare is good value so it's how to pay for it. The only thing that would worry me is how you would get to the school in case of an emergency. Do you have an emergency taxi fund? If you are available for work at the weekend an evening of bar work/supermarket and/or babysitting would be enough to pay for the fares and maybe some extras!

I live in the country. DS2(16) works walking distance from home along roads very similar to what the OP describes. I don't let him walk , he can cycle if he wants, or one of us drives him there.

The lanes are so narrow and people drove like nutters. I would not walk with 3 little ones, tbh. No-one bimbles along country lanes, they think they are an extension of Silverstone.

Good luck OP, it sounds like you are having a hard time, ATM. I hope things turn around for you soon.

OP, sorry if this has been covered already but are there any public footpath route across the fields you could go? Have you had a good look at an OS map? I know it's not ideal in the dark and winter and with little kids but at least would be a safer option if you don't get anywhere on appeal and really can't afford the bus.

Oh for crying out loud, some of us are just poor and don't need the added pressure of being constantly told to just work, (like it's that easy).

OP ignore those posts. Does your school have family support workers attatched to it?, mine has just applied to a local charity for help with uniform costs and school supplies, a lot of small charities do this sort of thing, for instance churches sometimes have small funds.

Just to add when I have been able to afford to help others I always have, because it's the right thing to do, I really don't like the amount of people that seem to think that being anything but entirely self sufficient makes you irresponsible/bad/immoral/lazy, but I know there's really no point arguing with that type because they hardly ever listen.