Is it ever physically impossible to breast feed?

[ThePowerof3]

I know that there can be a lot of mental barriers to breastfeeding but what are the physical ones? Is it ever possible for someone's milk not to come in?

My dd was born very prem at 29 weeks and I didn't get any milk.

Why the fuss about bf? I just don't get it...

There is the common statistic of 2 percent cannot breastfeed - referring to mother's issue physically. Which equates to a lot of women, nearly 50 per day in uk. Add to this babies that can't/won't feed and it would be hundred or so, at least.

But as a future counsellor you don't need to know how many or why other women don't bf, it is up to you to help someone who wants to bf do all they can to successfully bf. Giving them confidence they are doing the right things, checking baby is content and hydrated rather than focus on weight alone etc. Giving them ammunition to blast those close to them who tell them to give up - being supportuve when noone else is.

Focussing on those who can't or didn't bf might lead you off the supportive role, IYKWIM.

thepowerof3

They are not allowed to say that breast feeding may fail as they have to promote breast feeding. Which is fair enough.

I can't argue with that.

Trouble is, that didn't help me.

I genuinely didn't know that breast feeding could fail. Had to send a bewildered husband out for formula, bottles & steriliser. Back then the hospital did give formula so she was able to have a feed in hospital.

Reading some ofte responses is quite releaving, and makes me feel so much better about not being able to bf. lie any other part of t body they can wrk inefficiently or fail, it's not fully perfect. Yes rather like some people having 20/20 vision and some not! In poorer countries, if the mother is not able to bf, female friends or relatives take over

"I found all the consultants/BF consellors, while very nice, worked on the assumption that I was having latch or confidence problems"

This is something I found in a lot of professionals too: if x% (rather high percentage) has problems because of y, then it follows that your problems must also be caused by y.

I wonder why they don't transfer this logic to the rest of the medical profession: 75% of the patients who came in tonight had a headache because of incipient stroke, it is therefore most likely that your headache is also caused by a stroke (frantic relative: "but he fell off the roof!").

"Focussing on those who can't or didn't bf might lead you off the supportive role, IYKWIM."

I think the only safe way is to focus on the individual mother you have in front of you. And try to find out what kind of support she most needs.

Cory, but I did say that in my post of 9.20 and you ignored it and came back criticising the idea of 'genuine' physical issues.

I'm sorry to have to say this, but it is coming across a bit as if you have an axe to grind and it's not really going to matter what I say, you're just going to jump in with 'well, that wasn't the case for me' and ignore the fact that it might be the case for most people. Maybe it isn't intentional but you are coming across like that a bit.

It just seems very unhelpful, my DS was 10 pounds at birth and screamed literally all night through hunger bit I was paranoid that one FF would make it impossible to BF. I just think people like to know that they aren't alone in their experience

Google tubular hypoplastic breasts and make sure you a familiar with the way they look (some are more extreme than others) as not one professional ever identified mine when I was failing to breastfeed. It would have been such an incredible relief if someone had just told me what was wrong with my breasts and reassured me that I wasn't doing anything wrong. The failure to produce enough milk, despite doing everything right on paper, was awful and if I had understood why I would have gone on to formula much sooner and avoided DS failing to gain even a single ounce for the first six weeks of his life.

cory, they totally do! It is one of the most infuriating things about GPs that they do exactly that!

Dd1 never latched on properly (despite 3 days in hospital and the midwives telling us how well we were both doing) so milk never came in. 5days in i was told she must drink in the next 6 hours or she would be hospitalised. Formula saved her from that and possibly worse. She was that ill.

I'm sure physically it is is possible to restart milk supply. But my daughter would have been on a drip in hospital. Biologically possible is a nebulous concept

I have Poland's Syndrome and have milk ducts missing from one of my breasts.

I will do that, thanks EhricLoves

WireCat Your experience sounds similar to mine. I genuinely didn't know that it was possible to just not produce milk. I would express for 40 minutes to get a couple of mls of milk. One HCP told me I just wasn't trying hard enough - thanks for that! I was confused, really guilty, had bleeding sore nipples and was incapable to feeding my hungry child.

"I'm sorry to have to say this, but it is coming across a bit as if you have an axe to grind and it's not really going to matter what I say, you're just going to jump in with 'well, that wasn't the case for me' and ignore the fact that it might be the case for most people. Maybe it isn't intentional but you are coming across like that a bit."

I am sorry if that is how I come across bumbleymummy. What I am trying to say is, every individual has to be treated as a new case to some extent, with all possibilities open. No one individual is "most people".

Statistics work like that. When I toss the coin there is a 50% chance it will come down heads. But the fact that it came down tails last down does not mean I can predict that it will come down heads this time. Statistics work for populations, not for individuals.

When dh came down with Reyes syndrome his GP had never seen a case before. Statistically, it was very unlikely. But it still needed treating for what it was: a firm understanding of the statistic unlikeliness would not have saved dh's life.

Statistically, it is unlikely that a woman PowerOf3 encounters in her antenatal classes will have had 80% of her breast tissue removed, but I bet Bogeyface's antenatal teacher wished she had been open to the possibility. Because by definition, the statistically unlikely will sometimes happen- and if you hadn't allowed for it you may make a prat of yourself. Or do real harm to the self esteem of some vulnerable woman you are supposed to be supporting.

I think, pre/historically speaking, if breastfeeding failure was anything like the rates suggested on this thread, the human race would probably have died out.

Imagine living 500, 1000, 2000+ years ago, and watching your baby fade away because you couldn't feed it. It must've been the most horrific thing.

I honestly think it is amazing that millions of years of evolution hasn't made 1). giving birth, and b). breastfeeding much, much easier and more efficient.

Why are both of these perfectly natural things so painful and, often, traumatic? I mean, a few 100 years ago, you were lucky to even survive childbirth.

Thank goodness for human intelligence, so that childbirth is relatively risk-free these days, and formula is available for those who need/want it.

I tried for a week with dd1 no milk came in I didnt even try with dd2 it was too distraught with my first attempts i couldnt put myself through that again and dd2 was in babycare I had other things to worry about

"I just think people like to know that they aren't alone in their experience"

Given that the majority of breastfeeding mums are using formula within 2 weeks of birth, and most have stopped breastfeeding altogether by 8 weeks, do you really think women DON'T know that other women find breastfeeding?

"And what's wrong with those car driving responses, Minifingers?"

Well there's nothing wrong with those responses IF the DH in question and his partner had chosen not to drive, and were happy about not driving and genuinely couldn't be taught to drive!

"The only difference is that there isn't the same emotional intensity, not the same suggestion that I am letting down the statistics and that my non-driving is an issue of national importance."

No - because non-driving doesn't impact on the health of babies. Not breastfeeding does. It's as basic as that. It's about the health of babies as well as being about the well-being and lifestyle choices of adults. That's what makes it such a fraught subject. Obviously when we are talking about counselling and individual support with problematic feeding this doesn't need to be referred to - but when we having a wider discussion of the issue outside of an individual counselling or support context, it shouldn't be ignored.

You only have to read this thread to see that a lot of people do find it helpful to know they're not alone Minifingers

DonDrapersAltrEgoBigglesDraper Tue 30-Jul-13 10:29:28
"I think, pre/historically speaking, if breastfeeding failure was anything like the rates suggested on this thread, the human race would probably have died out."

If you are looking at it from a Darwinian perspective, evolution does not require all individuals to survive. If you give birth to 10 children and 2 survive, that will be enough to keep the population going. Or if one woman does really well and keeps all her 8 alive, that will be enough to cancel out the fact that some other woman didn't manage to keep a single one.

Then there is wet nursing. Plenty of historical evidence, and evidence from modern hunters and gatherers that women shared breastfeeding duties and that a child that could not be suckled by one woman would feed from another. In fact, in the Renaissance it was so rare for upper class women to feed their own babies that books were written to try to rekindle the idea.

I am autistic and have hypersensitivity. Basically the pain signals to the brain are routed incorrectly. Some things which should be extremely painful don't even register and other things which should be painless are agony. I wanted to breastfeed and gave it a try but it was excruciating, worse than labour pains.

Someone on another thread told me that this wasn't a physical reason for not breastfeeding, that with proper counselling and trying harder I could have done it. Yep, apparently counselling can correct defective neuro-pathways in the brain.

Yes. But not nearly as often as people will tell you.

I think that person was trying to upset you for want of something better to do westiemama

Incidentally I was sp traumatised with breast feeding dd when ds was born I wanted to express as well sp I could see milk getting in. Hospital refused to help me saying it would stop me breastfeeding properly

We did breastfeed but I was convinced ds wasn't getting enough. even i was unsure whether it was past trauma or real. He took hours to feed and. breast pump was producing next to nothing, I was told baby was more efficient than the breast pump. years later he was diagnosed with low muscle tone and sn, the breast pump was probably more efficient.

Minifingers Tue 30-Jul-13 10:32:43
"Obviously when we are talking about counselling and individual support with problematic feeding this doesn't need to be referred to - but when we having a wider discussion of the issue outside of an individual counselling or support context, it shouldn't be ignored."

You are right of course, and this thread is a good place for it. But it does seem to make its way into many threads on this subject where the OP is obviously a vulnerable person asking for individual support, which is where I am less convinced it's helpful.