To wonder why some men feel the need to insult women?

[dontcallmehon]

I used to get a lot of male attention when I was younger - both 'positive' (if intimidating - catcalls etc and also negative, hostile reactions. Simply for existing, I think. I don't get it so much, now - I dress quite casually and have a few years experience of life, so don't come across as quite so vulnerable.

However, today I was walking past a group of lads who I could see were out to insult passers by. One of them laughed and said: 'pretty ugly' as I walked past. Now I am not ugly (not that it matters!) but I am an attractive, nicely dressed woman who clearly takes care of her appearance. Even if I didn't - what makes these men think that the way a woman looks has anything at all to do with them?

AIBU to wonder why you would want to insult and intimidate someone who is simply going about their daily life? Luckily I have high self esteem and I am very confident about the way I look - but I could imagine some women being really upset by this kind of thing .

[stickingattwo]

Do it - put it on the everyday sexism thingy! I have andi felt so much better, rather than just being ranty I felt like I was doing something proactive

[northlight]

Hollaback and Everyday Sexism are bringing this to people's attention more and more. Why has no one ever made a documentary about this? With hidden, mini or disguised cameras and a few women of all ages and degrees of, conventional, attractiveness it wouldn't take long to gather hundreds of examples.
There was a thread in the Guardian the other day and in the BTL comments large numbers of men were dismissing the idea that it is prevalent or common behaviour.

[mercury7]

it's an easy way to score points, it doesnt happen to me alot but there have been a few occasions where a man has said or done something to intimidate me.
I never react, I'm not stupid enough to pick a fight with someone who's bigger than me, but my first thought is usually 'you'd never have done that to a man'

I suppose men who do that must be severely lacking in status and esteem, so intimidating someone who is unlikely to punch them (ie soft target & not much of a challenge) is enough to give them a boost

[OctopusPete8]

I'm quite fat so sort of invisible to men, dunno if thats good or bad tbh

I'm married so I can't be overly horrendous,

but I do strangely get a lot of inebriated women mid conversation going 'you have a gorgeous face' you have such a gorgeous face' and if they ask a bloke like,
'Doesn't she have such a gorgeous face?' they just go quiet and change the subject, I'm obviously man repellent.

[MagicHouse]

I remember (years ago!) getting all sorts of positive/ negative attention like you're saying. I remember going into a bar in my early twenties with two friends and some lad saying "rank, rank and ranker" and like you're saying about yourself, we were all pretty nice looking really. My friend retorted "wank, wank and wanker"

I think they do it more for their friends than anything to do with the women they're insulting. I think people like that are all completely lacking in self esteem, probably had loads of knock backs, maybe they've been severely bullied in the past.... so they get their confidence through their equally insecure mates, who in that situation will probably laugh/ make them feel like they've said something very witty. Blokes like that operate in packs, they'd never say stuff like that if they were on their own. It's all about getting a confidence boost from somewhere.

[dontcallmehon]

Just as I suspected, this sort of behaviour is incredibly common. It's as if, as a woman, you're public property in some way.

[OctopusPete8]

Yeah even the loudest,most obnoxious bloke I couldn't imagine saying that on their own.

[CuChullain]

Sadly much of this kind of behaviour is showing off in front of their mates and trying to be ?the jack the lad big man?, irritating though it is more often than not it is all puff and bluster and they crumble when directly challenged. Most teenagers know what they are doing is wrong but peer group pressure insists they keep up with the ring leader, most grow out of it. Some, unfortunately go on to be white van man, utter Neanderthal pricks who don?t have the folly of youth as an excuse. Ironically these are the same hypocritical morons who would not hesitate to take offence if they heard someone talking to their girlfriend/wife in that manner. I do get a guilty pleasure in making these tossers buckle in front of their mates and lose all respect and credibility.

[Flobbadobs]

I had the last laugh on the builders that tried it with me..
Walking past them on the way to school when they were supposed to be working on a local sports building. They were drinking beer for a start and being loud and obnoxious to everyone. Utter bastards started barking at the women, including me, following me up the road doing it in my ear until I turned round and told them exactly what to do and how to do it. In great detail, very politely.
I then, in front of them phoned the man who had hired the company to do the work and told him. The man was my DH...They were off site within an hour and lost any business with the sports club they could have had. It would have made the company thousands.

[grumpyoldbat]

That's brilliant flob takes me all my strength to avoid giving them the satisfaction of crying in front of them. The best I've managed is s screaming at one 'stop looking then and you'll stop feeling sick'

[happyreindeer]

I think most people feel more cocky when they have their friends around them. Get them by themselves they might be completely different but still...wankers.

[Flobbadobs]

Tbh I'm usually very quiet and unassuming but after a few years of working bars in nightclubs and rather rough pubs I can still channel the inner tough woman and put people in their places!

[CuChullain]

Good for you flob!! Sweet revenge indeed!

I remember when I was out running with Mrs CuChullain and she wanted to do a sprint finish so dashed off ahead for the last 500 meters or so while I just jogged on behind. She finished her sprint and started to stretch her self down, she was so far ahead of me that it looked like she was on her own which is why a couple of twats on a nearby bench drinking cans of beer thought they could be abusive. She ignored it which then prompted one of the blokes to get up and invade her personal space, asking her name, making comments about her tits, he eventually grabbed his nuts, and start giving it the "I bet you want some of this...." banter. By this stage I was not far away, I could see and hear what was happening, the obvious discomfort of Mrs CuChullain and was furious, I also thought it would be a great opportunity for a bit of impromptu rugby training so basically sprinted at him full tilt and shoulder charged him into the river, the tide was out so he just got covered in slime and mud. I asked his mate if he had anything he wished to add to the conversation and he just shook his head. Yes I know violence is not the answer to everything, but sometimes its the only language these knobs understand, I was a little bit in the dog house afterwards.

[mercury7]

Flobbadobs presumably working in bars & clubs means that you know how to handle thes sorts of situations and have good instincts for who can be safely challenged and who might turn nasty?

I think alot of women would be reluctant to retaliate in case a man turned aggressive..whether or not this is the best approach I have no idea

[mercury7]

'Ironically these are the same hypocritical morons who would not hesitate to take offence if they heard someone talking to their girlfriend/wife in that manner'
CuChullain isnt this essentially because the moron regards his wife/gf as his property and so if someone insults her they are taking liberties with his property.

It's not that he (hypocritically) respects his wife but doesnt respect other women, rather that, in defending 'his' women he is defending his own honour

[Flobbadobs]

mercury7 kind of, certainly being sober when other people have been drinking gives you an awareness that they lack, but to be honest on that occasion I just saw red. There were loads of small children around, it was hot and I just gave it back. I was probably lucky in that they were shocked and presumably they realised that they were in serious trouble when I pointed out that the hi vis jackets they were wearing had the company name all over them. Mentioning that DH was the man who hired them was probably a smart move too..

[Spikeytree]

Did anybody listen to Laura from the Every Day Sexism project on Jeremy Vine's show today?

This is a link to the Radio 2 facebook page, if you have an account, scroll down a bit and you can see some of the charming comments left by listeners. I despair.

[Allthingspretty]

I reckon people who do this see it as a case of "The best form of defense is to attack" attitude. People decide to get it in there first so that othera dont attack them.

[grumpyoldbat]

My theory is that as a society we measure success by how many people are beneath us rather than what we have actually done. Therefore people have an incentive to put others down to ensure they're successful. The best people to choose are those who are easily identifiable as different from you. So men often choose women to humiliate.

[JustinBsMum]

Wastes of space. The lot of them. Bullying, as that is the only way they can feel big.

[MonkeyGoneToHeaven]

Walking through town a few years ago with my mate, a couple of blokes passed us and one looked at me and said 'if you lost 10lb you'd be alright, love'. My mate shouted at the top of her voice, 'I'd rather have a fat arse than a fat head, you wanker!' She was trying to help but I didn't really think I had a terribly fat arse, I was a size 12! Best intentions though!

[StepAwayFromTheEcclesCakes]

I seem to remember a thread that said something along the lines of ' I already have one arsehole in my knickers, why would I want another' as a response to some crass proposition from a random on the street, seem to remember giggling at the time and hoping to remember it if ever the need arose.

[ParsleyTheLioness]

Next time. And there will be a next time...I shall respond with one of the following:
'Bless you, you're not very bright are you?'
'Your mother must be so proud'.

[Splitheadgirl]

My DH says he doesn't like a lot of other men because of how so many of them treat women. Thank God for him, because otherwise I do think I would believe all men are devolving, thick little shits.

[dontcallmehon]

Odd that a lout on the street would think I was beneath him.