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Original poster

OMG. Are these 'penalty notices' for taking children out of school in term time legally enforceable?

767 replies

Utterlyastoundedmum · 22/07/2013 14:53

Not interested in having a debate about whether it is 'right' to take a child out of schol, in term time for holidays etc. just wanting to know whether they can be enforced from a legal perspective.

I have just read the latest school newsletter and am to be honest, very annoyed indeed to find that as of September the school are changing its policy on authorising absences. Until now it's always been on a case by case basis but now they are saying no absence will be authorised whatsoever no matter what, except for one day for weddings ( with proof!)

The penalty is £60 or £120.

Not very fair on any parents such as myself who booked a holiday for a week in October as we really CANNOT get away in half term this year.

I will not be paying unless this is legally enforcible!!

OP posts:
motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:04

Why do you feel sorry for teachers Crashdoll going to school in NZ when kids left out of term to go to HK, UK or China - it was fantastic.

The parents who did take their children out during term time and travelled made it seem exotic and wonderful.

I remember postcards, stories, gifts and learning a great deal about different cultures and I did not go overseas my class mates did.

I don't know these people who just plonk their children in class while they are not in Ibiza!

Oh and 2 of my class mates who had to travel to see family ended up being Head Girl and Dux so I don't think it harmed them or the teacher or the children left behind.

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:07

Actually because of my DH job it is extremely difficult to get time off at Easter or Xmas. I have trouble getting time off in August hols too!

And we seldom go because of cost! I am sure it is ok for some people here to throw away 2+K to travel on a plane but I think if they were in my position they would think differently!

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:07

motown I feel sorry because parents seem to have no respect. You know when you send your children to school that they are there for 38 weeks a year. Some people feel they are above the rules. Also, anecdote does not equal data.

TabithaStephens · 22/07/2013 20:07

"It's not about holidays being CHEAP. It's about them being AFFORDABLE."

There's no right to affordable holidays either. If you can't afford them, don't go. Too many people seem to think they are entitled to a holiday or several holidays a year. This is not the case.

Whereisegg · 22/07/2013 20:10

My dd goes away for 5 days on pgl in September.

I wonder if the LEA will be paying her df and I our £60 each per day, in cash or by cheque??

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:11

Tabitha and others spouting this crap have you ever had it where you have not had a holiday! Not even had the same time off together of say a week as a family... now be honest I'd love to hear.

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:14

motown What planet do you live on?! I cannot afford a holiday right now, it sucks but it's one of those things.

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:17

Crashdoll I fully realise anecdote does not equal data. I mean again it is only my experience but there were some days during my schooling which were wasted and not always educational and I had really fab teachers who thankfully supported people opening their horizons and being with their family but I guess that is also to do with the geographical position of NZ and because my school had also overseas boarders. I guess the teachers I had were just really intune when it came to dealing with a wide range of families and cultures.

The very fact that children have 38 weeks a year at school should surely mean if they are taught well that they can take time off and still be ok?

I really think people have no idea just how hard many families have it.

MadeOfStarDust · 22/07/2013 20:17

mowtownmover Yep - had the first 7 years of the kids lives where we did not have a week off together - the demands of work and childcare meant we were stretched as it was - so no holiday - or even week off as a family- we did not self-destruct, we just got on with life..

ooooooh sorry we had the time between Christmas and new year together at home or at MIL 25 miles away ...... that is about a week... including public holidays...

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:18

Crashdoll so please explain why you begrudge others a holiday then?

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:21

I don't begrudge anyone a holiday as long as they don't pretend it's more educational than school because that makes them a big fat hypocrite if they actually send their children for the rest of the year.

HorryIsUpduffed · 22/07/2013 20:21

My friend certainly begrudges others' holidays. If a child in her DD's class fucks off to the Costa del Sol for a week, it's her DD's 1-to-1 who has to catch the child up, or take the class while the teacher does the catch up. Meanwhile DD (profoundly deaf) misses out.

One child's absence can affect the whole class - in the case of holiday it is completely avoidable.

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:22

"I really think people have no idea just how hard many families have it."

Oh the irony. I work with some very desperate families in extreme poverty. Not getting a holiday does not make it 'hard' FFS.

jacks365 · 22/07/2013 20:22

Motownmover I haven't had more than a weekend away for 4 years because of time constraints, nothing to do with costs but because between us and the dc we have not had even a single week when we've all been free but I'm not taking the dc out of school to get that time we just make the most of the free time we get.

geeandfeesmum · 22/07/2013 20:23

crashdoll, perhaps you should stop pretending that school is the only place a child can learn. Perhaps you should stop pretending that every parent that wishes to take a holiday during term time is raising a delinquent who will never amount to anything purely based on the fact that they missed two weeks of school to go on holiday!!

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:24

Wow MadeofStardust you must have a really strong family unit. I guess that the real problem is that the rigid 38 week year only seems to work for schools and teachers and not families, unless there is a SAHP.

I find it hard as do my DC I really wish other family (other than DH and DC) were 25 miles rather than 11,000 miles away.

Anyway it doesn't surprise me that LEA's are going to bring this in. The whole school year only works for the very few and no doubt holidays will only be enjoyed by the very entitled.

MadeOfStarDust · 22/07/2013 20:24

Horry - totally agree - this happens at our school too - the TA (who is shared between classes) is used to catch kids up instead of to help the 4 whole classes...

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:25

Crashdoll really - you work with desperate families? I don't really get what that has got to do with the rigid school year and holidays.

Don't you think really really desperate families deserve a break too? Respite care or holidays!

MarmaladeTwatkins · 22/07/2013 20:26

Yabyum, you talk shit.

DS has always been taken out for a week term time. He is one of the top readers in his class, constantly has his work on the school website and just got 39/40 in his phonics assessment.

There is no downward spiral. Allowing a bit of downtime for 1% of the time and applying yourself for the other 99% doesn't make you destined to fail.

FFS, my dad took me out of school for a MONTH, in third year secondary, to go to America (no theme parks before you all start clutching your pearls) My mum went into school to speak to the head about granting me the time off and he practically leapt out of his chair to sign the consent form for the LEA. He said that a month travelling America wasn't to be passed up. Sadly, common sense seems to have gone out of the window now with the prevailing nanny state telling us when we can and can't take our annual leave/what we can pack in our kid's lucnhbags. I can see a very strong case for home educating emerging. A lot of the pompous teachers/ex-teachers on here are doing a good job of seeing to that.

motownmover · 22/07/2013 20:30

marmalade you say it much better than me.

I so agree.

I am so glad I had cool teachers.

chicaguapa · 22/07/2013 20:32

I was all indignant about this until I remembered that DH doesn't get time off in term time either, so it doesn't make any difference to us. I can see why it's galling to have to pay a fine, but overall if it's still cheaper than going in the school holidays, you're still better off overall.

MarmaladeTwatkins · 22/07/2013 20:33

And if a week out of school for a break is the devil's work, how do they explain a week in Corchevel (at our school!) doing little more than skiing? I'm pretty sure that they don't have to do a skiing practical when they get back...

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:34

"crashdoll, perhaps you should stop pretending that school is the only place a child can learn. Perhaps you should stop pretending that every parent that wishes to take a holiday during term time is raising a delinquent who will never amount to anything purely based on the fact that they missed two weeks of school to go on holiday!!"

I don't think school is the only place a child can learn but some people are excusing their holidays by implying they can educate their children better. Maybe they can and good on them but then why send to school? I am criticising the parents for being hypocritical, I never made a comment on the children. You are making things up! Grin

crashdoll · 22/07/2013 20:35

motown I made that comment because you said I didn't realise how hard some people have it. Confused I do!

MarmaladeTwatkins · 22/07/2013 20:35

I will pay the fine. I will have my holiday in June. LEA can fuck off. Gove can fuck off. I will put £1 each from DH and I in a jar a week and then when I get invoiced, I will take it down to the council offices and tip my sack of quids into their little tray.

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