Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

... to have an argument with SIL over her post about controlled crying?

361 replies

katykuns · 12/07/2013 11:45

Post: 'Dear mommy,

I am confused.
I am used to falling asleep in your soft, warm arms. Each night I lay snuggled close to you; close enough to hear your heartbeat, close enough to smell your sweet fragrance. I gaze at your beautiful face as I gently drift off to sleep, safe and secure in your loving embrace. When I awaken with a growling stomach, cold feet or because I need a cuddle, you attend to me quickly and before long I am sound asleep once again.
But this last week has been different.

Gentle, Tear-Free Sleep Solution
Each night this week has gone like this. You tucked me up into my cot and kissed me goodnight, turned out the light and left. At first I was confused, wondering where you?d gone. Soon I became scared, and called for you. I called and called for you mummy, but you wouldn?t come! I was so sad, mummy. I wanted you so badly. I?ve never felt feelings that strong before. Where did you go?
Eventually you came back! Oh, how happy and relieved I was that you came back! I thought you had left me forever! I reached up to you but you wouldn?t pick me up. You wouldn?t even look me in the eye. You lay me back down with those soft warm arms, said ?shh, it?s night time now? and left again.
This happened again, over and over. I screamed for you and after a while, longer each time, you would return but you wouldn?t hold me.
After I had screamed a while, I had to stop. My throat hurt so badly. My head was pounding and my tiny tummy was growling. My heart hurt the most, though. I just couldn?t understand why you wouldn?t come.
After what felt like a lifetime of nights like this, I gave up. You don?t come when I scream, and when you do finally come you won?t even look me in the eye, let alone hold my shaking, sobbing little body. The screaming hurt too much to carry on for very long.
I just don?t understand, mummy. In the daytime when I fall and bump my head, you pick me up and kiss it better. If I am hungry, you feed me. If I crawl over to you for a cuddle, you read my mind and scoop me up, covering my tiny face with kisses and telling me how special I am and how much you love me. If I need you, you respond to me straight away.
But at night time, when it?s dark and quiet and my night-light casts strange shadows on my wall, you disappear. I can see that you?re tired, mummy, but I love you so much. I just want to be near to you, that?s all.
Now, at night time, I am quiet. But I still miss you.'

She doesn't understand why it's angered me. In my opinion, it's emotional blackmail and utterly manipulative. I did controlled crying with DD1, but she was naturally a good sleeper so it wasn't really a challenging experience. DD2 isn't a great sleeper, and we do try for a few minutes to see if she will settle, but get her back up when she doesn't.
As I see it, this is written by an adult projecting her own feelings about CC onto others through the form of a poor vulnerable baby, it really doesn't sit right with me at all.
I don't really agree with co-sleeping, but I never would post stuff like this to upset people doing co-sleeping.

OP posts:
TarkaTheOtter · 12/07/2013 16:43

Sorry ninaI think cc did teach my dd to sleep by herself. I DO go to her in the night, because she wakes when she is ill/teething. This hasn't undone the sleep training because its not just about knowing no one will come.

When we were sleep training she didn't cry for hours then finally fall asleep out of exhaustion. She cried on and off for 15mins (with us going in every 5 mins), then played for a bit, then went to sleep. I very much doubt her cortisol levels were higher from that than from screaming in my arms for 30mins whilst I paced around the room often crying myself.

BlingLoving · 12/07/2013 16:44

Posts or comments about CC like this annoy me because of some of the basic assumptions. It assumes that if the baby gets a little cuddle from mum he/she will immediately go back to sleep. It assumes that the baby is crying because he/she wants mummy and/or is scared. It assumes that the parent is doing it randomly or with no prior thinking.

That's why I choose to ignore people who are completely anti CC because they clearly don't get it. Most people I know who've done it have done so because either they're getting up 10 times a night or they're spending literally hours up with the baby in the middle of the night. Which is bad for everyone. ALso, when it's done correctly, you don't leave a scared child to cry. You leave a child who is crying from over stimulation/over tiredness to cry or a child who wants to play rather than sleep. It's a very different thing to leaving a child who's scared or hungry or cold. And in almost every case, a parent who does cc does so only have trying everything else and giving it a LOT of thought.

Having said all that, so many people put things on FB that they don't really think about. The repost button has a LOT to answer for. Ditto copy and paste.

Wheresmycaffeinedrip · 12/07/2013 16:45

:o catgirl

TarkaTheOtter · 12/07/2013 16:45

catgirl Grin

HaroldLloyd · 12/07/2013 16:48

Hurrah for cat girl.
Grin

JackieTheFart · 12/07/2013 16:49

Ummm.....babies often don't need anything other than their parents unwavering attention do they?

You know what, I slept in my own cot from birth. I'm fine. Don't remember it at all actually - I was a frigging BABY!

My twins were self-settlers from a very early age indeed, and I count my lucky stars. I would put them to bed, give them a kiss, and they'd drop off and sleep through. At four, they don't remember this.

My youngest co-slept until 15 months, then I took a week off intending to get him into his own cot, in his own room. It took 3 nights of crying (first night - cried for two hours, I went in a 5 mins, 10 mins, etc. Second night, he was asleep in 20 mins. Third night, asleep in 5). He now goes to bed by himself, every night, sleeps through, is happy and awake in the mornings not grumpy as he has been disturbing me and me him. He's only 20 months old, he's never once indicated it's been a problem, he's great a bedtime.

My choice was great for my family, I couldn't give a shit what you do. If you prefer to sleep for 6 hours, partially standing up at half hour stretches then go for it. I didn't.

How did you get your kids to sleep by themselves, and did it rely on bribes and lying by their side and the occasional tantrum (from them)?

I didn't do it as a last resort either. I resent the comments that I must have been at the end of my rope to do this method when this was not the case. The case was, it fit for us.

catgirl1976 · 12/07/2013 16:49

Why thank you ;)

JackieTheFart · 12/07/2013 16:50

Arf at a mammoth cross-post!

DontWannaBeObamasElf · 12/07/2013 16:52

I think I love you, Catgirl.

HaroldLloyd · 12/07/2013 16:52

If anything gets my cortisol levels a rising its shite like this on Facebook.

Sod the babies, what about ME???

LadyBeagleEyes · 12/07/2013 16:56

Brilliantly funny Catgirl Grin

Damnautocorrect · 12/07/2013 16:59

Catgirl amazing!

NinaJade666 · 12/07/2013 17:03

rowtunda

These days people can find and post links to all sorts of facts and studies which can back up anything they are saying at the time.
I could provide a link to a study that proves that cortisol levels are not raised in a crying baby that is held at the time, compared to one which is alone, it's the stress factor too not just the crying.

It doesn't bother me if someone decides to use CC/CIO at all, I think a lot of mums are subject to pressure to do so from others though.

Tarka

You mentioned about the sleep training not being undone. Most find that they do need to retrain after bouts of illness/teething etc. It's not usually a 'one off thing.'

catgirl1976 · 12/07/2013 17:08
Grin

You've all made my day Blush

tobiasfunke · 12/07/2013 17:10

Just hide her news feed. I did this recently for a couple of people and it is totally liberating. No more endless drivel, no more passive aggressive nonsense. She's being a total bitch.

bumbleymummy · 12/07/2013 17:14

'Mummy martyrs' Hmm

rowtunda · 12/07/2013 17:14

Yes Nina but did you actually read my link? Or are you so transfixed on your view you can't admit to being wrong?

I'll explain it to you - the authors of study that you are quoting( to try and scare & guilt trip parents about CC with) actually state that the small & brief rise in cortisol levels is not significant to conclude that there would be any long term consequences.

If you are going to make such statements please at least back it up with some evidence.

rowtunda · 12/07/2013 17:16

I love it catgirl!

TarkaTheOtter · 12/07/2013 17:21

Fortunately most people I know in rl exist in the vast space between "rod for your own back" and "leaving a baby to cry for 10mins is going to irreparably damage your poor baby".

I do have the odd friend with some obnoxious opinions. Generally they are nice people though. I wish there was a way to just selectively hide people on fb and mumsnet when they are being a knob.

OwlinaTree · 12/07/2013 17:21

I haven't read the whole thread but what she's written is vomit inducing.

NinaJade666 · 12/07/2013 17:21

rowtunda I have already read the link before when researching CC/CIO methods.

When I said about the cortisol levels and baby's learning that no one comes, it was in reference to the CIO/CC standard method and not a million variations in between that some parents use.

thebody · 12/07/2013 17:22

Catgirl,😀😀 funniest post on mumsnet.

Cc saved my sanity and turned me from a sleep deprived danger to myself and my children into a healthy happy mother.

Oldest 23 now and youngest 12 and they are fine.

Pitmountainpony · 12/07/2013 17:27

I guess theses posts are designed to change people,s minds, so you would not do controlled crying.
I personally have not been able to do cc because it feels natural to respond to a crying baby but I can really understand people doing it if it means they get well rested because the sleep deprivation is crazy making.
Same with ff, if it is what needs to be done to resolve a bigger issue then so be it....I guess everyone thinks their way is best. I co sleep and lots of UK friends really judged me when I said I did it, safely of course. Human nature.
Cc is hardly abuse and if it Is helping you stay happy and sane as a mother then just ignore. Your child may well be amenable to training and the crying will not last too long.
People have the freedom to express their opinions and you have the freedom to ignore them!!

thebody · 12/07/2013 17:27

Oh and your sil sounds a humongous pain in the arse.

It's not the law for mothers to sacrifice their sanity and health just in case some research twat bangs on about cortisol levels.

Trust me all so called experts will say anything to sell a book/ get a research grant.

rowtunda · 12/07/2013 17:29

Well Nina seen as you have done so much research into this you should be able to provide a link to peer reviewed scientific evidence that backs up your claim that 'leaving small babies to cry leads to a large increase in cortisol in the baby brain which affects how the babies brain grows and develops'.

Otherwise your just spouting shit to guilt trip and scare other parents - non?