To feel sad to see 5 year old girl in hijab

[INeedSomeSun]

Probably will get flamed for this & iabu as its not my business.
I am not racist in any way. I am Asian myself and have many Muslim friends.

Growing up, I never saw any muslim girls with hijabs. This is a trend which has been growing since the late 90s.

I know that the meaning behind the hijab is to protect modesty and show committment to Islam. It is supposed to be the girls/womans decision after much thought and dedication.

At 5 years old they are still getting changed in the classroom for PE and she won't be able to do this now with boys around. How will she play and do PE freely? She has been singled out by the views of her parents.
Also, she will barely know what religion means, so she has not made an informed decision for herself.

Normally she is chasing about with my DS and other kids before school.Today she was just stood there, perhaps embarrassed or told not to?
I felt very sad

ttp://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/asia-pacific/pakistan/130110/pakistan-delhi-gang-rape-india

aboutus, I can hardly believe I'm engaging with you, but I'd like to point out that any woman has the right to walk anywhere, at any time, dressed or undressed as she pleases, without fear of assault. If she is raped, that is because she came across a bastard who is a rapist - he was the wrong person there at the wrong time, not her.

You should also be aware that, sadly, most rapes are perpetrated on women who know their assailants - and, even more sadly, that many women do not even report the fact that they have been raped. So I'm afraid that may include many 'sober women in a hijab'.

Also (can hardly believe I'm saying this), surely you must know that many rapes have been perpetrated on older women in their own homes - women in their 70s, 80s or even older. These are women (I hate to say this) like your mother or grandmothers. I think we can assume that they do not fit your 'drunk women in a tiny top or a tiny skirt' sashaying down the street stereotype.

Well that argument only works if the only women to get raped are drunk ones wearing short skirts. I think you'll find women get raped in all sorts of situations, on their way home from work in their sensible office clothes, dragged into the bushes while jogging in tracksuit trousers, even old ladies in their beds. Are they all asking for it? Your argument also requires a total absence of rape in islamic countries but we all know that isn't true either.

cross post

crescentmoon, I don't agree with you, but I thank you for answering my points and engaging in debate with me. Perhaps we might continue the discussion another time?

Meantime, good night and sweet dreams.

aboutus

You don't answer my points? Perhaps you can't.

In the meantime, may I suggest these possible situations:

1. You're walking home at 6pm when you are suddenly mugged from behind. You're badly hurt; perhaps your assailant kicks you in the head and the ribs, and you're bleeding badly. Your wallet, keys and phone are stolen, but hey - so what - it's all your fault for walking home all by yourself. Get over it.

1. You've been to the pub and struck up a conversation with someone. You played pool together, had a chat and drank a few pints. You both leave the pub at the same time. And just as you're checking the messages on your mobile your new friend suddenly punches you in the face and you fall to the ground. You're badly hurt; perhaps your assailant kicks you in the head and the ribs, and you're bleeding badly. Your wallet, keys and phone are stolen, but hey - so what - it's all your fault for walking home with a stranger. Get over it.

1. You haven't been out all day. You go to bed at 10pm but wake up when you hear an unfamiliar noise. You switch on your bedside light but before you can react you realise there is a burglar in the room. The burglar thumps you before you can get out of bed. You're badly hurt; perhaps your burglar has kicked you in the head and the ribs, and you're bleeding badly. Your wallet, keys and phone are stolen, but hey - so what - it's all your fault for waking up all by yourself. Get over it.

All so unlikely, eh?

You still don't want to address specific points, aboutus?

So why don't you just fuck off with your nasty little agenda that might be read as misogynistic and just plain shit-stirring?

Not sure I should feed the troll, but while I am happy to wear hijab and think there are many benefits from not drinking, immunity from rape is not one of them.

Most rapes are by people you know and wearing any item of clothing does not protect you from meeting a rapist.

What a lot of wet dreams sense you speak, aboutus. If only all we girlies just took your advice, eh?

Because obviously you are the master of the universe

but is that why so many muslim men jump and prey on "western girls" - they see a bit of flesh and turn into the animals we have seen on the news?

this is off topic, but I don't think it is just 'western girls', I think they are the ones who go to the police or eventually tell a parent what is happening.

If you live in a community that telling may mean your death, or you be made to marry one of your abusers are you going to tell?

And yes I know that is not typical of all Muslim communities, I know the vast majority of people, whatever culture/religion/colour/sexuality/etc/etc are normal loving human beings who would never hurt a child.

But these are not the girls targeted.

I can't sleep. Sallyingforth you express something very well there, I agree with you. And yet the sense of bitterness and victimhood is tangible.

Lasttango thanks, you seem to be able to say things I want to say but so much more concisely!

Oh I didn't see all these appalling posts from aboutus. I've read one: I think time spent reading any more will simply be time I'll never get back in my life.

"It is sad to see people boast how great women's rights are in this country - not so much in a grateful way but more like gloating and turning their noses up at those less fortunate. "

Is this a joke? I am very proud to boast of women's rights here and I am certainly not gloating. I would like them shared with everyone. Where on earth are people turning their noses up at those less fortunate? I would like to see them shared with those less fortunate. Why on earth to you call it gloating? Are you not proud to live in a country (I assume you're in the UK) with strong women's rights? How much more work needs to be done? More, to be sure. Have we achieved much? Yes we have.

And whoever mentioned Egypt - has the Muslim Brotherhood changed the law that the word of two women witnesses are needed against the word of one man? An inequality from the Qran which was enshrined in law?

Here's a Q for you.

Who is more likely to be raped- a drunk woman in a tiny top or a tiny skirt, or a sober woman in a hijab? (muslims don't drink alcohol)

In the UK probably the drunk woman in the tiny skirt.

Globally? Probably the sober woman in the hijab.

I bet skinny jeans offer a lot of protection from rape. By the time the rapist finally managed to get them off he prob wouldn't have an erection anymore.

Actually the majority of women in this country who are raped were wearing jeans and a T-shirt when they were attacked.

Who is more likely to be raped- a drunk woman in a tiny top or a tiny skirt, or a sober woman in a hijab? (muslims don't drink alcohol)

Neither, the only increased likelihood is meeting a rapist.

Have you seen what is happening in Egypt? Not a drunk woman in a mini skirt in sight, but plenty of sexual assault by those nice respectful Muslims.

www.thestar.com/news/world/2013/07/02/egypt_protests_new_wave_of_sexual_assaults_reported_in_tahrir_square.html

www.thestar.com/news/world/2013/07/02/egypt_protests_new_wave_of_sexual_assaults_reported_in_tahrir_square.html

IMO she's a bit young but it is her families choice. It's no different really to us choosing to get our children baptised or do first communion as they aren't necessarily old enough to make the decision for themselves re first communion and certainly not re infant baptism.

Mejyooo, just seen aboutus posts actually and just amazed.

LasTango, no Muslim will take time out in the middle of work to go pray, we can pray later if we cannot make it on the time perscribed and the time perscribed is pretty wide except for the dusk prayer which needs to be performed on the dot or if missed then with the night prayer.

I take time during lunch to pray (or used to when I was nearer a mosque), as do my friends, those who can't delay it till they get home or have a five minute tea break to pray quickly.

My friends are genetiscists, lawyers, surgeons, GP's, teachers etc.

Also we are all loathe to draw attention to our religious needs due to the general hostility towards Islam, I find an empty conference room or wait till I get home in summer. I wouldn't dream of expecting special dispensation to go pray.

My colleagues who smoke take more breaks than I do, I fit my prayers in during my designated breaks.