To feel sad to see 5 year old girl in hijab

[INeedSomeSun]

Probably will get flamed for this & iabu as its not my business.
I am not racist in any way. I am Asian myself and have many Muslim friends.

Growing up, I never saw any muslim girls with hijabs. This is a trend which has been growing since the late 90s.

I know that the meaning behind the hijab is to protect modesty and show committment to Islam. It is supposed to be the girls/womans decision after much thought and dedication.

At 5 years old they are still getting changed in the classroom for PE and she won't be able to do this now with boys around. How will she play and do PE freely? She has been singled out by the views of her parents.
Also, she will barely know what religion means, so she has not made an informed decision for herself.

Normally she is chasing about with my DS and other kids before school.Today she was just stood there, perhaps embarrassed or told not to?
I felt very sad

Wharr are there depictions of Mary without a head covering? I wouldn't know not being a church goer.

It's a stipulation form God to be covered when outside the home.

No idea what other men and women think of women who don't cover, perhaps you should canvass women walking down the streets.
I personally don't feel its any of my business.

Cantspell there's an entire chapter of the Quran devoted to the birth of Jesus the son of Mary (its called the verse of Mariam), there's also a chapter call the table laden with food, which could be about the last supper its about the feast with the twelve desciples of Jesus the son of Mary.

Need to re-read it myself.

"But muslims have down graded Jesus from the Son of God to the status of a prophet "

I think the story is that he never claimed to be the son of God during his lifetime and that his Godhead was decided upon at the 1st Council of Nicea about 300 years after his death. God wasn't happy with this distortion of the religion he sent, among other things, so he sent another one (Islam) in which he expressly forbid making pictures or sculptures of Mohammad and worshipping/praying to anyone/anything other than Himself.

I live in a very Muslim part of Sydney, Australia. When I was growing up,most girls didn't wear a headscarf here until the onset of puberty (if they wore them at all). However, since the 'GWOT' started, I've noticed that age getting pushed back now. Five would still be very unusual but eight or nine seems to be more common now. It doesn't prevent them from playing sport etc and I don't see the scarf as an oppressive thing for them at all, they wear it like a badge of pride. I would have more reservations about sticking a young girl into a niqab or burka. I don't like those, even on grown women.

Little is written about the rest of marys life we we believe she was so loved by God that upon her death her body was lifted into heaven and so we celebrate the assumption of `mary as part of the religious calender

Pixel if my (non existent) son got headlice, after getting very hysterical about it and getting my mum to louse him, Iwould most certinaly put him in a keffiyeh......and if he took it off I'd shave his head and dye it blue (I understand that to be the acceptable deterrent aginast headlice).

"Crumbled, my wearing a headscarf obliterates the negative and worng associations that people have of Islam and muslim and muslim women in hijab."

No it doesn't.

Yes, Mejypoo, I do. I wouldn't force her: we don't do that sort of thing. But I think it would be the right thing for her to do.

"they wear it like a badge of pride"

Hmm.

lol fuzzy - i was just about to say shave it off (on my non-existent son) too.

Alternatively hoodies may be quite effective too - against lice and people!!

Crumbled yes it does, when they see me in my head scarf and then see me in action at work, it totally makes them reassess the negative prejuidices they have of women in headscarves.

Crescent, such an interesting post.

I am not religious in any way and defiantly see all religions as mysoginistic but have really enjoyed reading different views on this subject.

I still feel that I don't need any other adult to tell me how to dress. Although my mother tries😄.

Wish every woman everywhere had my and my dds choices.

And they've all told you this? I'm afraid it doesn't work on me.

cote there are plenty of reference to Jesus saying her was the son of God in the bible.
The clearest probably being John 10:36

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Say you of him, whom the Father has sanctified, and sent into the world, You blaspheme; because I said, I am the Son of God?

I wonder what the response would be if I posted to say I was 'sad' about a 5 year old wearing a mini skirt and skimpy halter neck (as I have done)...

I wonder if we would talk or even think immediately about female oppression and how men's ideals and sexulisation of women/girls have changed the way women dress.

Crumbled lets see, my barrister certainly has, a lawyer who was representing me was also very taken aback and then actually asked me what I did for a living the previous assumption being I would have been a SAHM (no offense to SAHMS, but most peopel who see a woman in a headscarf assume she is not capable of holding down a job.

Then there's work who are very respectful going from rude and dismissive to contrite and (at first) grudgingly respectful to respectful and with high expectations of me and two promotion in as many years.

I don't need to be told I have made people re-think their assessment of women in headscarves by meeting me, I know for a fact I completely wrong foot people and their expectations of a woman in a headscarf.

But I'm damn good at what I do and work harder than most because I have more to prove due to my dress choice.

And by the way, the only negative prejudice I have of women in this country covering (mainly more than the headscarf to be honest) is not a prejudice at all. A choice has been made to adopt a symbol of oppression. You might not like that it's a symbol of oppression, but you can't deny that it is. You might have a job, and financial independence, and a very devout faith. I don't doubt all of those things, I wouldn't stop you worshipping freely, living freely. I can't stop you wearing it and I won't even if I can. That's not the way things are done. But a choice has been made to wear a symbol of oppression, and a denial is being made that it is a symbol of oppression.

It would be nice if it wasn't, and perhaps one day it won't be, in the same way that the Union flag and the England flag no longer represent racism, xenophobia and thuggery. But right now, it does.

Has it occurred to you that they may simply like you and respect your work?

(no offense to SAHMS, but most peopel who see a woman in a headscarf assume she is not capable of holding down a job.

Not surprising, since we were just told that a niqab wearer wouldn't want a job. Didn't you say that yourself?

I work with someone who covers everything except her face and hands. I have, and had, no prejudice about her, or her capabilities. She's extremely good at her job and has a really sharp attitude. It's impressive for anyone. But it doesn't change my opinion of the covering.

It is not a symbol of opression, it is your choice to see it as such to justify your personal prejuidice of women who cover.

Its more palatable to pretend its a symbol of oppression than I'm a bigot and feel Muslim women should not be allowed to make their own sartorial choices because I am superior to them and should dictate how they dress.

Women who choose to cover their heads freely are not symbols of opression, we are strong kick ass sisters who are showing up everywhere and shocking the naysayers into silence by being the best we can possibly be.

I think you misunderstand, Fuzzy. You seem to assume that the problem is people assume women who cover are somehow stupid and incapable. If they did think that then I suppose you could have your prejudice removed by seeing a competent or impressive lawyer. Maybe that is a problem for you, plainly it has been.

But that's not what this is about. This is about what covering represents. We starting talking about five year olds, and so it's all about what the covering represents, and the oppression it validates. You are talking about something rather different.

crumbled, you said you wouldnt expect to hold down a job in public services whilst wearing a face mask, I said no muslim woman a face veil would expect that either.

I told you I know plenty of owmen in face veils who run their own businesses and are teachers at islamic schools.

There are also plenty of non Muslim SAHMS who rely totaly on their husbands income and have given up financial independance.

You might not be 'symbols of oppression' among your culture and religion - but there are many many people who are not of your culture and religion who DO see it as a symbol of oppression.