To get annoyed when other women say "I'm not a feminist"

[Nickabilla]

As if it's a dirty word and a shameful thing to be? I hear it every now and then and always question it. Someone said it today and I'm annoyed again.

Do some women not realise that women didn't used to be allowed to go to university, get divorced, own property or vote?

Rant over.

Anyone else waiting for someone to come along and tell us we've all got it wrong?

I do that too, Eyes, it's mannerly :)

Idly ponders whether to get up a posse to get it changed to 'menz-erly'...

I suppose it's that I pick my battles carefully and always have, there are some truly foul things that get my feminist hackles up and are worth the rage IMO.
And others that are not.
But if everything is a 10 on the outrage scale, I overload.

A man opening a door is a tiny problem in comparison to all the other serious problems women have in the world. But I still would rather a man acted in kindness towards me because of me, not simply because I'm a woman. I open the doors for anyone, because it's just general kindness, not because I think the other sex need it more. For the same reason, I pay half on dates.

I meant to expand on the last sentence but decided not to, so I know it sounds a bit stuck-on now, sorry!

Isn't the door thing a red herring? People should hold doors open for other people out of politeness.

I also open doors to anyone, regardless of gender.

I wish being a SAHM had more respect, by both men and some women. It's absolutely a worthwhile, valuable occupation.

Agree that people should just hold doors open regardless of gender. But some (possibly older) men do it because they were taught they should do it for women in particular.

Being a SAHM should be given more respect, it's one of the most worthwhile jobs there is. I think the reason it's not is that it used to be solely the woman's domain, whilst the men went out and did the big 'proper' jobs to bring in the money. Women couldn't possibly have coped with such difficult 'proper' jobs, and thus there were a lot of very bored housewives with little stimulation.

But isn't women being the home makers, and being the weaker sex a hang over from the days when being the male meant defending the family, hunting, doing back breaking physical labour and possibly hand to hand combat? It's the order of nature. Males defend and provide, females raise young? The reason we have breast and men are stronger?
Obviously nowadays, due to the way we live, things are changed beyond recognition, and there are no clearly defined roles, but its only recently that the lines have become blurred? It's only really since the development of formula milk that women have been freed from the home?

The majority of millworkers were women, doing extremely long shifts.
Coalmining and steel required a lot of physical strength, so were male-dominated.

many poor working class women didn't stay at home to look after children they had to go to work (not a clue how they fed their babies though) but they still went out to feed their families, and keep a roof over their head, please nobody take this the wrong way but being a SAHM was for the middle and upper classes ,

most women of my grandmothers generation went out to work at 14 got married had babies and still worked,

But do you think the men took any more responsibility for the children, even if mother had to work? I think they were still thought of as mother's responsibility overall.

oh goodness me no the men didnt do anything I don't think I know my grandad died in her late 40s so my nan had to go full time and look after children

SaggyOldClothCathPuss: throughout history, all over the world, women and men have had to do hard labour in order to feed themselves and their families. Working the fields is hard work, and has historically predominantly been a woman's job. Same with animal husbandry. Running a house, while raising children, is hard work. All of these things require physical strength, and the first two require working away from the home.

Problems arise when we see positions that bring wealth, power and decision-making as a logical progression from the 'hunting/hard labour' 'away from the home' that men with 'military strength' historically engaged in, and justify the lack of female representation in those areas accordingly.

Much more significant in Western history was the exclusion of women from education, from the church hierarchy (i.e. they could become nuns but not bishops, archbishops, popes), and from public office. And general lawlessness outside the home.

The 'prehistoric' hunter/gathering & childrearing model has been used to justify gender inequality. If that mode of thought works for you, fine. I just hope you realise that to use it as a basis for male and female roles is a bit suspect.

It astonishes me how many women consider themselves 'feminist' without a seconds thought. There is a very dark side to feminism and although I hold many beliefs that might be considered 'feminist', there is absolutely no chance that I would ever label myself as one. I consider feminism akin to a cult, and anyone who dug around enough would understand exactly why I think this.

Cor, really? A cult?
I've always seen it as a spectrum, from deepest magenta to pale rosewhite, rather like a tree, and different people are at different places. Some are firmly stuck on branches and aren't moving. Some are travelling, but not all in the same direction.

Feminism is a cult?! That's a new one... I don't think 'many women' do consider themselves feminists without a second thought. There is a dark side to everything, and some people take everything to an extreme. Eg someone being a Christian. I'm sure there are 'dark sides' in that there are some cults and sects that define themselves as "Christian" but have very extreme views, but that doesn't mean nobody else should define themselves as one.

Could you expand on what you mean?

OK. I think one of the most concerning threads on a forum I ever came across was one where a woman had been sectioned and was talking to a feminist. The sectioned woman was obviously confused and in distress. The feminist was insisting that this woman ignored what her mental health team were telling her and to speak to a feminist counsellor instead, just in case the mental health team messed with her mind.

Suggestions that only feminist counsellors/lawyers are used in case they are indoctrinated further by non - feminist professionals. It's all a bit Scientology to me, smacks of 'auditing'.

Telling women that they are never responsible for their own actions, that 'patriarchy' controls everything.

Patriarchy theory/propaganda itself.

The 'women as victims' mantra.

The 'If you're not with us, you're against us' mentality. Not allowed to 'talk about teh menz'.

Shaming tactics.

Etc...

And the 'look what suffragettes did for you' riposte is growing tiresome. No-one says anything about WWI/II soldiers giving women/men the freedom that we take for granted.

No Y.N.B.U for having an opinion but neither am I when I say I'm not a feminist. I don't really get on with fellow women to be honest. I much prefer the company of men. I find the opporsite sex much easier to talk to. I always have done. I mean I am civil them (women) because I have to be, but I feel as though they are always sizing me up.
I hope my post does not offens anyone but this is a public forum after all and opinions thoughts and expereinces will differ. xxx

I don't think it's a cult but I do get the impression that a minority of posters on here are somewhat brainwashed.

It's often quite clear in their posts on various subjects, that they are completely against men and will always take the side of the woman, even without asking any questions. The ones I'm thinking of, will often overuse the words 'patriarchal society'.

A minority but none the less I do get the impression they've been brainwashed.

See, in my world you are talking about one deep pink branch of the tree called feminism.
You get extremists and enthusiasts in every area of debate.

a cult wow really I do think some women will side with only other women and sometimes demonize men and they are actually a rare side of feminisim but a cult

international you sound insecure about yourself perhaps that is why you just get on with men