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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Jeremy Forrest verdict - aibu to be confused?

999 replies

noddyboulder · 20/06/2013 14:54

Yep, I don't think even his own parents could deny he's a massive, hideous scumbag with no impulse control - but how can he have been found guilty of abduction when the girl he had an affair with said it was her idea to go to France and she went willingly?

Can somebody legal shed some light?

OP posts:
lougle · 21/06/2013 21:54

I'm not picking it over. I'm stating my opinion that the published sentences do not support the daughter in any way.

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 21:58

I'm not sure why you're denying youre picking apart mums statement?
you've made accompanying disparaging comment about the prom dress remark

you cut and pasted with accompanying comments and bold for emphasis were you want to make your point

lougle · 21/06/2013 22:02

Because my opinion, and I'm allowed one, is that I am commenting on the statement, not picking it apart. In fact, I quoted in its entirety what was published.

I am allowed to hold an opinion on the statement given by the mother. You are allowed to view it as 'picking it apart'. I disagree, as I am entitled to.

edam · 21/06/2013 22:04

quite, Scottish.

Isn't it a bit much to have a pop at the poor woman? Not only has her daughter been horribly exploited and abducted, but the poor kid has been brainwashed and is still in the control of the predator. Good grief. Anyone with an ounce of compassion would not even dream of attacking her.

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 22:05

well clearly in online discussion you can posture and pick apart as you wish
and I see you've done this
I think globally there been too much emphasis on blaming adolescent and her family

edam · 21/06/2013 22:06

Lougle, your picking it apart is there in your post, in black and white, for everyone to see. You provided a detailed, line by line critique.

It really is pointless for you to deny doing something that is right here in your post.

lougle · 21/06/2013 22:14

I'm not denying anything. I'm disagreeing and I still hold the opinion that the Mother is grieving for herself, not her daughter. It may be unfortunate wording, but there you are.

edam · 21/06/2013 22:15

You are free to believe the moon is made of blue cheese, if you wish. But you aren't able to claim you didn't say or do something that is right here in this thread in black and white.

WorrySighWorrySigh · 21/06/2013 22:17

In general terms, the person making the statement is allowed to discuss specifically the direct harm or trauma they have suffered and problems that have resulted from the crime such as loss of income.

I picked the above up out of Wikipedia so I make no claims for its reliability

Is it possible that the victim's mother was only allowed to make a victim impact statement on behalf of herself?

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 22:19

quite legitimately the mother is grieving for lost future closeness.a rift orchestrated by abuser
I'm appalled at the insidious blame heaped on adolescent and her family
it seems wrong that they are subject of derision.i. wonder if it's a snap class judgement

lougle · 21/06/2013 22:22

What class are they? I've not come across them in the press. The girl herself was in the press briefly then the court ordered her annonymity and I've never seen the mother.

Worry that may be so. Or it may be that the Mother didn't want to further alienate her daughter by stating opinions on her feelings. Or it may simply be that the girl refuses to acknowledge any feelings other than positive ones from the situation because she's not ready or able to break away from it.

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 22:26

what about the prom dress remark did you find so objectionable,that you picked it out?

flippinada · 21/06/2013 22:32

I think picking apart the victim impact statement (is that the right term? Am assuming so) for the mother seems unfair. I mean yes it's focused on her and maybe it is self centered but then isn't it supposed to be - and she will have been through hell in the last few months.

It's a common tactic for abusers to isolate their victims from support and it looks like this has been done very effectively here.

lougle · 21/06/2013 22:36

I didn't pick it out, specifically, I copied the entire reported impact statement and made comments.

As I stated above, I felt that given the huge situation her daughter is in, it seemed very self-centred to be upset that she didn't get to 'dress her up in a prom dress'.

It may be that the entire impact statement had more detail about her daughter and the Telegraph simply highlighted those sentences, but I would have thought that a mother would be more concerned about her DD's self-esteem, etc., than the fact that she didn't get to do some of the things she expected to as a mother.

Could you elaborate on your 'snap class judgement' wonderings? You haven't described their class yet and as the press hasn't identified either mother or daughter (other than in the first days of disappearance, etc., some months ago), I haven't got a clue what you are alluding to.

flippinada · 21/06/2013 22:36

I think the prom dress comment is more about what it symbolises - a mother and daughter bonding type of thing or a milestone; like your child's first day at school or watching them in a play, that king of thing.

She's not upset because she can't buy a dress.

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 22:39

an accompanying commentary,bold for emphasis,all to pick apart mum statement
nasty and unnecessary
save your ire for the abuser who orchestrated a familial rift to his advantage

ExcuseTypos · 21/06/2013 22:44

"What class are they?" What the hell does that mean?

lougle · 21/06/2013 22:45

Oh for goodness sake, sm Hmm

I have no ire. I'm not intimidated by you. Give over.

scottishmummy · 21/06/2013 22:48

no.dont digress into a poor you.yiuve been strident this's your opinion
in no way are you being intimidated,nor does this warrant humphy faceHmm
quite simply,I and others have disputed your posts and you don't like it

mirry2 · 21/06/2013 22:49

The victim blaming has now moved to the mother Shock. Some of the posts on this thread are truly repellant.

josephinebruce · 21/06/2013 22:49

They were just a normal family who worked hard to give their kids a good life. What does class matter?

cory · 21/06/2013 22:50

I didn't read the prom dress as self centered, more as symbolising something they would never share together now.

On the SN threads we are often allowed and even encouraged to grieve for the child we will never have, for the life we will never have. I don't see that this is really all that different.

Instead of a healthy happy child with a normal teenhood and a normal closeness to her mum, she has a damaged child who has lied to her and deceived her and may well do so again because she is still enthralled by her abuser, she has horrible, horrible memories of believing her child dead. Why should she not grieve for the whole family and their loss?

josephinebruce · 21/06/2013 22:51

Ok, I admit - I looked at the DM website (I'm an insommniac ok?). Think this says a lot.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2345665/Jeremy-Forrest-jailed-FIVE-AND-A-HALF-YEARS-guilty-abducting-pupil-15.html

cory · 21/06/2013 22:52

I remember sitting on a bus once sobbing my heart out because a party of drunken teenagers were weaving their way across the road and I thought "that will never be my daugher". The prom dress seems wholesome by comparison.

MummyAbroad · 21/06/2013 22:54

phew just read 26 pages.

I really wanted to say to Berts and SomeDizzy thanks for sharing your stories. That's a very courageous thing to do, and it really helped me understand the dynamics of this situation better (though I need no convincing that Forrest is a dangerous, manipulative abuser) I really really really hope it also changed the minds of the posters who had previously been supporting or defending his actions (WAKE UP YOU LOT - ITS ABUSE AND MUST BE STOPPED) Like many others I am just horrified and shocked that this can be defended or described as a "love affair" or other nonsense. It makes me very very Angry I am so glad that lots of eloquent and educated posters on here have been able to put you in your place counter your viewpoints.

I am also a bit worried for Imnotmymum - do you know what Stockholm Syndrome is? You sound like someone who is desperate to convince everyone that this girl hasn't really been harmed by all this because of the similarities (which you see) to your own situation. Perhaps you think that if you admit she has been harmed, you have to admit that you were/are too, and that is something that you really dont want to do at all? Apologies if I am way off mark, but reading your comments, that's really how it comes across. I dont believe that you are actually sticking up for Forest, because you keep saying you know what he did was wrong, so why are you trying so hard to argue that this girl "will be alright?"? If I am right, I am afraid that you have made no friends on this thread and wont really get much support, hence the worry. I hope that you are able to process all this in a healthy way somewhere somehow.