We encourage children in our cafe BUT

[childfriendlycafeowner]

I hope you don't mind us asking any readers for their opinion on child behaviour in public places.

We run a small cafe in a small town, and we love doing it (opened up 4 months ago). The previous owners did not encourage children and families, we do, we bought high chairs and do what we can to make families feel welcome. But today two girls came in with a baby and a toddler, my guess is the toddler was 2. From the moment she arrived the screamed, not crying because she was upset but screaming because I guess she liked the sound of her own voice. We made comments to the mum in the hope she would take the hint that the child was disturbing all the other customers but her comment was "she is a little tinker isn't she" The other customers threw their food and drinks down their necks and left as quickly as they could, some complaining as they left. She did go quiet for a little while but she was screaming for probably at least half of the 1 hour plus that she was in the cafe.

When the lady came to pay we said to the lady that we are very sorry but unless she can stop her little girl disturbing all our other customers and driving them away perhaps she could sit in our outside seating area with her or not come in. We felt terrible to say this but it really was a terrible din that upset many people.

Are we being reasonable or unreasonable. Would you tolerate your child no matter how young being so disruptive to other people in public

DD was yelling in a cafe today. She wouldn't listen to no and we couldn't take her out as I was in queue getting food and she needed to eat.

She doesn't really understand no.

Its great to read these threads and know people are thinking.of me as a feckless gormless idiot.

One lovely woman offered to let.me.go ahead of her to get DD's food but her lovely daughter (aged 30 plus) then said I couldn't.

Maybe she was a MNer.

If I saw the cafe owner telling someone with a crying child not to come back, I wouldn't use that cafe again.

Same here, Usualsuspect, and I wouldn't use it if they told someone not to come back because their child was screeching, screaming or squealing whatever the reason may be.

There are some brilliant examples upthread of how to handle these challenging situations. If they didn't want/couldn't apply any of these strategies (which are classics in that business) they should have said what they said much sooner, not when the mother was on her way out because it looked like they were pissed off with her and just wanted to unload their frustration. It was pointless at that time.
Yes, they offered her to seat outside on her next visit or not come in. Not really good for a business not at all.
Hospitality industry is all about sugarcoating.

Fanjo, if I ever have a cafe your dd and my ds can yell and screech together!

People always include an SN disclaimer but then loads of people say "even if they have SN you can tell them not to shout".

Just hope cafe owners don't start grumbling at us as we leave now too

Hazey...that would be a great cafe!

I don't think of anyone who does whatever they can to quieten or console their child as a feckless idiot. Good lord, DC1 was a bloody nightmare as a child (actually, it was much worse than that but I won't go into details, suffice to say we've had a challenging time with him over the years ), and so we used to have to manage his behaviour with lots of interaction, toys and books, or sometimes we would have to avoid cafes altogether or keep visits to a minimum.

Crying/screaming/hungry/thirsty children will be tolerated by most people, but what does irritate others is when the parent does sod all about it and just smiles or shrugs. Then, and only then, do they become gormless idiots.

Dd wont interact or look at toys or books if she is yelling. So I guess I must simper like a gormless idiot.

Buba - the owner spoke to the parent during the visit as well as on the way out. Sugar coating is fine, but being told you're disturbing other customers and given your drink in a takeaway box is hardly a good example of handling a challenging situation. It's rhetoric, pure and simple, and rather patronising rhetoric at that.

don't worry Fanjo, in real life people are more tolerant and empathetic than they are on MN!

But SirChenjin, the child in the op wasn't upset, she was

shreaking at the top of her voice, as she was playing with the toys her mum brought for her. She was not unhappy or bored

I have a friend whose older dd (with sn) shrieks and squeals when she is very happy, we swim together and the sound reverberates around the room! There is nothing the mum can do about it, I would hate to think of someone like her being told not to come back because of the noise her dd made.

missmarples, I think it would be huge shame if people with sn and their families felt like they couldn't go to a cafe sometimes (is it just cafes,or are there other places - shops, libraries, restaurants, any indoor space?), don't you?

Yes, that's right - and yet the parent continued to let her scream for quite a considerable amount of time, even after that owner had a quiet word with her about it. You would have thought that the penny might have dropped and she might have thought about finishing her coffee and going for a walk or something. Being in a small cafe is very different to being in a large swimming pool.

Missmarple..I will not hide my DD away.

She has as much right to go to a cafe as you.

To suggest otherwise is extremely offensive.

She is also not my "misfortune".

What a disgusting post.

Well, my son is one of those with SN who screams.

I don't take him a lot of places. Life's a bitch.

No wonder people make establishments 'No children'.

I don't feel he has a right to make other people miserable, no, even temporarily. Because that is what he does.

Seriously.."joyfully share in my misfortune"!?

What the actual fuck.

YANBU. If mine were screeching for over an hour, I would have left as quickly as possible. It's time some people realised that others don't think your child is half as cute as you do.

And I would be less likely to go back to your cafe if I knew they were screeching children in there.

So there you go, OP. Get rid of the highchairs and stop encouraging children and families.

For those of us you with noisy children I'd like to quote the always fabulous Dylan Moran here, talking about how he responded to someone on a plane asking him to 'make his child be quiet'. "Oh, I'm sorry, I'll just knock him out, shall I?" (or words to that effect).

Ffs, what is WRONG with people? Small children (toddlers especially) are generally noisy, grubby little monsters who are into everything. Sometimes you can 'control' them and sometimes you can't and sometimes you're simply not up to it (physically or mentally). I have three and none of them are perfect (and I wouldn't want them to be either, for that matter) and I've had times when I wanted the ground to open up and swallow me/them. Such is life.

I've seen adults behave in MUCH worse ways - what's their excuse? Been at a christening where someone was texting throughout/making calls - in the church! Been a funeral where someone thought a body-con dress, leather mini-jacket and wedges were appropriate attire. Heard the foulest language possible directed at children/the elderly/the disabled. Give me a noisy toddler every time.

It makes me sad that you feel like that expat.

I know you don't need my sympathy though, so feel free to tell me to shove it :)

I don't know, expat. We have a cafe in town, there are a couple of adults with learning difficulties who go with their carers. They sometimes talk to other customers, and one of them often makes an involuntary screeching sound. I would be appalled if the cafe owners ever said anything to them.

Life may be a bitch, but I think it would be a bit less of a bitch if people could be a bit more tolerant.

Yea..that's what I meant.

I didn't word it well.

I meant I didn't want to sound patronising to expat.

But it's sad that she feels her son just makes people miserable and that life's a bitch and he can't go to cafes, is all.

Hazeyjane - yes I know of a similar person who lunches out round here with her carer. She screeches very loudly indeed!

I'd like to see who will swear blind they would avoid a cafe from now on, if they were disturbed by an adult with SN making a racket.

Some people talk a lot of rubbish on here.