To start a benefits "myth busting" thread so that I can link the thickos of Facebook to it

[MarmaladeTwatkins]

When they start moaning about how people on benefits can afford diamond shoes and other such items.

I'll start.

1. Housing benefit is mostly paid out to WORKING people. So all of this talk of going out and getting a job and buying their own home if they don't like the bedroom tax is a flawed argument.

Not a myth working below the nmw in a job that would normally pay nmw would normally be a crime.

The two girls in Costa is true, however it doesnt fit into your myth that some people do use benefits to support their lifestyle. I havent said all of them, I have quoted an example I overheard.

Whether you believe it or not is not really the issue. The changes are here. Whether you agree with them or not.

I didn't call you stupid. I merely asked a question.

Yes you are OP.

Have a look at the current thread in 'In the news' and then have another think.

Well - someone has looked at the figures and decided they just dont add up and we cannot afford to continue like we are. And its not just me.....

Its now government policy.

Maisie you still haven't told me when I swore at you - come on, an example please.

So Maisie, how come the current government has borrowed more in 3 years than the last Labour government did in 3 terms in office? How would you explain that?

YoutheCat. You indicated that my illness was stupidity. And I am shocked that you are allowed to get away with that sort of comment on a thread.

Masie you may have overheard it but you then believed it to be a fact and tried to use it to prove what ever nonsense you were drivelling about.

Just because two silly little girls had a conversation does not mean that what they were talking about is possible likely or achievable.

there are really iffy things about migrants ATM on MN:

illegal immigrants are not criminals - they just don't have permission to work here. you can be deported but you don't go to prison for the crime of being an illegal immigrant.

FFS! some are fleeing torture. others just want a better life.

It was most definitely posed as a question. It had a question mark and everything.

Oh dear maisie Just because I dont agree with you doesnt make me wrong! I don't think anyone has a problem with you disagreeing with them, that's just grand. But being the voice of dissent doesn't make you right, either, just FYI.

This government was voted in by someone.

Um, actually, no it wasn't. Unless it was just my ballot paper that was missing the "Coalition Of Epic Fail" option. Also, just because you agree with what someone promises to do before the election (oh yes Lib Dems, I AM looking at you) that doesn't mean you support their policies once in government.

With regards to your peculiar belief that people not beating down your door to do your building work because they are Lazy Slackers, has it crossed your mind that they might, um, be working elsewhere? The building trade was hit really hard by the recession so building companies are in the unenviable position of scrabbling about to cover what jobs are available with fewer staff than is ideal. If you don't mind letting a gang of random completely unqualified people loose on your home to do the work I'm sure you could round up a workforce easily enough. And pay them a pittance because they are so desperate. Bonus.

I am genuinely struggling to understand a lot of what you are saying. Maybe that's because I am exhausted, but given linguistics is one of my pet interests, I suspect the struggle to comprehend is because you were in a bate & didn't preview your post. Sincere apologies if there is a LD issue here rather than a proofing one.

sockreturningpixie
What are these magical benefits meant to be, just out of interest? Are they allowed to count as the occupant of a "spare" bedroom, perhaps?

YouTheCat, FancyPuffin, textfan, SchroSawMargeryDaw & anyone else who understands the utter misery of doing DLA forms: I once made a friend laugh water out of her nose by explaining that the wretched things reduce my Pollyanna-ing to the level of "fully continent, why, yes I am! look at me & my continence! this is splendid! I shall celebrate my DOUBLE continence with a little dance!" I work very hard at not being ground down by my body's interesting take on functioning & the cripple!paperwork has the effect of a power-sander being taken to me. All the stuff I very carefully don't think about (I can't see my internal organs so I shall pretend they are all FINE) demanding to be written about in great detail. Having to tot up how many specialist's I've seen over the last 12 months is always a good game too. Especially if a clinic's been playing Pass The Patient so I end up having to put "X Clinic in Y Department on Z date under care of Prof A but saw Someone Else". Blegh.

I do very much think that there is a need to ensure disability benefits go to those who need them. I also think that there are better ways to ensure that than by tormenting us with Those Bloody Forms. As for the antics of ATOS (No Wheelchairs Allowed In The Medical Assessment Centre WATF?!), all the headdesking, all the time...

you the cat - labour spend most their time in office fuelling a boom then handed the bust to the tories.

so borrowing increased. easy

Yes the benefit budget needs reducing but the government wont reduce pensioners benefits so they have decided to reduce everyone elses. The figures may add up then but the country will be in a terrible state.

Perhaps we should look at the welfare states of other countries as examples. There are said to be 3 types of welfare regime; Liberal, Conservative, Social

Liberal -US - people are encouraged to look after themselves. Those that can't go without or claim what they can and are stigmatised .

Conservative -France/Germany. Some universal taxes to support families or doctrine of the state. Works well in some circumstances.

Social -Sweden - universal benefits for all, paid for with high taxes. Seems to work well with high happiness rating for children and adults.

Guess where we are heading?

This thread is full of swear words. I am not picking on you Saskia and didnt address my comments to you in particular.

And now its been indicated that my illness (which is under control) is stupidty!

"Well - someone has looked at the figures and decided they just dont add up and we cannot afford to continue like we are. And its not just me.....

Its now government policy. "

It is government policy, but these are policies that are going to cost the country considerably more, so it's nothing to do with fiscal necessity. These policies are idealogical.

Faster that has got to be the most sensible thing I have seen you post.

This is Mumsnet, maisie. Swearing isn't forbidden.

sock - you cannot be reading the rest of them tis the only possible explanation...

"I have never been unemployed..... Lucky again it seems...."

Yes. Do you honestly think luck doesn't play it's part? Do you think that when so many companies are going bust, making redundancies etc that it's not at least part down to luck whether someone can walk straight from one job to another?

I got made redundant from one company, and managed to walk straight into another. All good so far. Then I got made redundant from that company (last in, first out rules applied). Was unemployed and almost out of savings when I found a new job, stuck on temp contract. Guess what? Made redundant then too. I was good enough to get the jobs, and persistent enough. But unlucky in that the companies I worked with were hit hard, and that with so many companies losing staff in one area there were more unemployed than there were jobs.

I know in one of the companies I worked for there were whole families made redundant. One poor bloke wasn't far off retirement when he lost his (specialised) job, and his children worked in the same company as unskilled NMW temp workers. Neither he nor his children were the sort of people likely to be snapped up in an employer's market.

I worked in a recruitment company briefly, before the economy really went down the pan, we were turning away highly qualified people with good amounts of experience and glowing references, even for NMW work, because the demand for work was far far greater than the amount of jobs. No amount of hard work was going to help those people, they just had to hope that they ended up in the right place at the right time, or that they knew the right people. Their qualifications etc weren't worth the paper they were written on.

I meant the immigrant post

*there are really iffy things about migrants ATM on MN:

illegal immigrants are not criminals - they just don't have permission to work here. you can be deported but you don't go to prison for the crime of being an illegal immigrant.

FFS! some are fleeing torture. others just want a better life.*

The ones fleeing torture are not illegal immigrants but refugees.
And anybody knowingly committing fraud whether an illegal immigrant, legal migrant or British IS a criminal.

Wow, 2 companies. A diverse cross sectional study then

"Unless it was just my ballot paper that was missing the "Coalition Of Epic Fail" option."