Are SAHMS discriminated against. Red magazine are doing an article about it.

[Darkesteyes]

Just seen this on twitter.

Are stay at home mums discriminated against? Are you one and unhappy with benefits, or feel judged? Tell us.
[email protected]

Think as others have said this isn't ESP discriminatory to housewives
It is hard trying to secure employment for new grads,return to work etc
I do not think housewives are a group that are particularly discriminated against

How true Mirry.

If I outed myself too much people would consider that I have landed on my feet and are there any vacancies?? The fact is I always recognised that if I was to become a Mum then I would need to stay at work to enable me to continue in this role. I have had options to work part time but didnt take them. Some have and then changed when their children are older. Its not set in stone! You need to earn the right to work the way you want and turning up at interviews with complete strangers stating you want this that and the other will not get you the job.

Why do you think employers care how many children you have, whether they have any special needs, whether your partner is supportive or not and what he earns- they dont! You chose to have your children with your partner. That's not the concern of any potential employer.

What they want is someone who will do a good job and not give them issues. Some on this thread seem to think that their choices and potential problems automatically become the employers issues. They dont. If you give any indication that you are going to be a problem. You wont get the role. There are just far too many candidates who are more suitable.

Scottishmummy I have to say. Having read your comments. I do like you completely direct straight o the point style! No waffling

Changing the subject here because this seems to be going nowhere...

What would happen if significantly more mothers decided to return to work?

There are apparently 1.2 million SAHMs - 24% - in the UK , an increase of 6% on 2011.

More than half, 59%, said the cost of childcare was the reason they did not return to work.

But if they did all return to work (not that there are the jobs, of course), or even if half of them returned to work, the obvious consequence would be that demand for childcare would soar, and costs would rocket even higher.

The truth is, going back to work is a luxury which families with more than one child. or on low income. simply cannot afford.

Perhaps, therefore, it's not quite such a bad thing that so many choose to stay at home and care for their children?

Rather than imagining a future when all women go back to work after having children, perhaps we should be thinking in terms of fewer women doing so in future, as wages fall even further in value over the next decade or so.

Ultimately, most WOHMs are entirely dependent on the availability of cheap childcare. That translates to other women being prepared to provide that childcare for very low pay - which is in turn subsidised by the taxpayer in the form of Working Tax Credits.

If I were returning to work as housewife I'd advise read about the job,search contemporary articles
Read what's the issues,what terms are being used discuss those as hypothetical scenarios
Incorporate language of job,the jd into your answer to illustrate understanding,application
Rather than how you appeased squabbling weans and manage school run and grocery shop

Scottishmummy, well you would say that wouldn't you? Why are you 'bigging up' paid work, it's just paid employment at the end of the day, most people have lots of repitative elements to their work or they become repitative because that is what they do ALL of the time. My DP is an Architect- he draws a lot of buildings again and again and again. The idea that WOHM are all so influential and hardworking is just not true. Even if it is, it is just a job. I've had a few jobs as have most of the population, there is nothing special about them. They weren't that hard and mine were considered executive, professional positions that you needed to be highly skilled for. A lot of recruitment talk does not match up to the reality of the job but it does make some people feel superior about themselves if it is in their Job description!

Working9while5- it's an interesting point you raise about length of maternity leave and whether it has made a difference to the perception of women in the workplace.

Personally , I had a very short ML with dd (only 3 months paid back then) and a slightly longer one with ds. This is my view of it. Physically, a shorter ML is tougher on the mum, particularly if the baby isnt sleeping through the night and you're still bf as I was (I fed both mine til well over a year old) From the confidence perspective, I think it was easier. I hadn't lost confidence or skills, in fact it didn't feel as though I'd been away for a significant period at all, it was more like a short sabbatical. Another aspect which I didn't really think about until years later, having seen colleagues take longer ML nowadays, is that from the attachment perspective of the child, shorter is probably easier. Some of my colleagues who have had a year off have experienced more issues with settling their children in childcare, which I suspect is because the way it pans out is that they are returning to work when the child is around 10/11 months which apparently from a developmental point is a harder time to start to leave them. Earlier, or much later and it's easier.

So- swings and roundabouts I guess. Shorter ML easier in some ways, tougher in others.

Again, this is where shared parental leave is so significant, because it should make it equally likely that any potential concern about women of a certain age suddenly disappearing from the workforce for a year- its just as likely to be the men! . And as the age span in which men can father a child, it could be a man of any age who goes off and takes time out for parental leave. Win win. Gets the dads more involved. Increases the chances dad may apply for flexible working. A step towards greater equality

Childcare isnt cheap. We were paying at one point over £1600 out of taxable income many years ago and that was just outside of London. Within London the costs were higher (no childcare vouchers at the time) and we only have 2 children.

Someone earlier said how could I expect a SAMP with three under 5's to be able to afford time from them to retrain, volunteer etc. I dont. I expect people to decide what they can and cannot afford in terms of number of children but then not expect a potential employer to be concerned about the fact that DH only earns xx per year. Why is it an employers issue how many children you have and with whom......

To be perfectly honest, I doubt whether a SAHM with no up-to-date experience or training would even get an interview for a job at the moment.

Long queues started to build two hours before the jobs fair yesterday with 4,000 hopefuls turning up and 2,300 preregistering.

You have to have a good mix of skills and experience now to get any job, let alone one which pays enough to make it worthwhile, and has hours to suit.

Goldenbear- youve told us that life as a SAHM can be underrated because it involves a lot of repetition and drudgery, you're now telling us your own job wasn't all that great , and your dh- well he just draws lots of buildings again and again! You really don't sound very happy with your life. Some of us find our work (and our children) interesting you know

Why is it an employers issue how many children you have and with whom. You are right, to not an employers responsibility. These choices are parental....

Why do housewifes need hours that "suit" like everyone else just make arrangements
Work is a trade off you give up time for financial remuneration and make safe arrangements for kids when working

But Golden - you are suggesting that paid work isnt all its cracked up to be.

Are you with a millionaire? The vast majority of us work to enable us to pay our bills and give us the lifestyle we want. Who on earth do you thinks pays the heating billls, food bills etc.

It might not be you now but one way or the other they do need to be paid.

Maisie- I think Goldenbears poor husband just has to keep drawing buildings again and again to keep her happy as a SAHM!!

But seriously- yes, almost all adults will need to work, unless they are born into some silver spoon lifestyle. So it's an argument for aiming for interesting and fulfilling work isn't it?

Golden - you are sounding more and more odd. Please dont indicate to potential working Mum's looking to go back to work that working isnt all its cracked up to be.

The vast majority of people work for money. Maybe to take the pressure off the other partner who is the sole earner. We really dont know.

Stay at home if you wish but dont trash the aspirations of others. And you clearly know nothing about the world of work these days apart from stating people are begging you to work for them. I dont actually believe a word of it.

To start spouting nonsense about SAHM's potential at interview could lull them into thinking that actually employers will give them priority (they wont!).

We are the real interviewers out there. You have no idea. You are not an interviewer neither are you working.

and make safe arrangements for kids when working

Yes, precisely the point I was making above. Did you read my post at 18.55? That's why there are now fewer women returning to work. 6% more staying at home in 2012 compared with 2011.

Although I suppose it depends what you mean by "safe arrangements"!

Sorry should be repetitive not 'reptative' - predictive text on phone.

Janey, you sound so resentful of sahm's. You preach about respecting each others choices, paying lip service to the sahm, whilst dismissing it as an occupation for those with a 'silver spoon' lifestyle. That's quite a bitter comment and possibly borne of resentment, I don't know?

and to spend what must be hours typing 25 pages of long replies about why sahm's don't need any validation!!!!

and surely if you've never really been a sahm you can't really comment on whether sahm's are discriminated against?

We have taken a huge pay cut due to CC and get a lot less per year, Dh has been trying with little success to get a new job for two years.

We are supplemented by benefits, more now due to his wage cut.

Would you like to point out where in any of the 25 pages I have indicated resentment for SAHM? I won't hold my breath...

And if you read my post properly you'll see I said that most people will need to work at some point in their adult life. The exception being the incredibly small number of people born into extreme wealth. Nothing to do with SAHM at all.

Stay at home parents are discriminated against because the short-term government policies value parents' economic contribution through work, not their contribution to raising future generations. The gov't is happy to subsidise childcare for working parents, but stay at home parents are making a 'lifestyle choice'... When I went on mat.leave with our first, our income halved, and it wasn't that much to begin with...

We decided rather than pay x amount on childcare, that we'd make sacrifices and manage childcare between us. I work one day a week, dh works full-time, but compresses his hours to work four long days. Our personal choice, having read the research on childcare for the under 3s. Our eldest is now six, and I can see that friends children who were at nursery full-time or part-time are equally happy/secure in their attachments etc, so perhaps we were over-zealous with our ideals, but I have no regrets.

I don't expect to be paid for looking after my own children, but I do feel that the decision we took is viewed in a negative light. People might think I'm lazy, or that I'm not 'career-minded' or sufficiently driven. People feel jealous, people think we have more money than we have, people think they couldn't afford it, people think all kinds of things. Ultimately, there is more 'value' attached to working than parenting, and for that reason stay at home parents are discriminated against.

Changes to the benefits system also mean that families where one parent works have been disproportionately affected, which is unfair.

I have, for my sins, the worst of both works (which i wouldn't change, by the way!) as people treat me like I'm a Sahm when I do actually work part-time, but I work so few hours I'm not part of the team at work even though I willingly do extra. If I'm paid to work 8 hours and stay an extra four, is that not the same as a full-time worker doing an extra 20 hours? Yet it is not valued in the same way. People think I 'don't contribute' yet I have not had one day off sick through pregnancy, children being ill, or my own illness, and work v. hard... but it is 'only' one day.

I hate the way these debates polarise everything. We are all parents trying our best to make the right decisions. If people work they are doing it for their family, if people stay at home they are doing it for their family, and if they do a mixture, it's for their family. The gov't should support all families, and stop shelling out non means-tested payments to pensioners. Oh, but they are the people that vote I suppose, because we're all so busy juggling work and home and trying to make ends meet!!

Olgaga -of course. Making proper arrangements up front will ensure that life does run more smoothly. We have in the past used a childminder and a nursery. I saw a few of course - but btw - I knew as soon as I met our lovely childmider she was the one. Has never let us down. We dont use her any more but she was wonderful.

God, I am filling up as I write this!

I actually think the issue is this.

Childcare is too expensive. You need to be earning £40k plus to make it worthwile. Only 8% of women earn this amount. But I do have to say that there are some strange views (apart from mine of course!) regarding what employers look for at interview.

I am an interviewer, Janey is also one. We have advised what happens and what we are looking for. Argue all you like Golden and others - but you wont get the role if you start bringing up at interviews childcare issues or worse the fact that you have 3 children and your DP is a lower earner. It wont be of any interest to the company and you wont get the job.

stepaway. How does the SAHM discrimination work and social manifest itself? It would really help people's understanding if we had practical or some sort of example from a SAHM that could really articulate it. As an employer I really want to understand..