To use my title

[ArtemisatBrauron]

I have a PhD and use my title - I was thinking of just using it at work but decided consistency was best and changed it with the bank etc as well. I've recently had several snide comments about it as well as a few family members and work colleagues who continue to address me/write to me as Mrs Brauron. I haven't corrected them because it seems rude, but it annoys me - AIBU?

I am a woman not sure where sexism comes into it. I consider it equally affected if men do it.

For what reason?

YANBU, that is, if they're doing what some of my aged relatives do and address me as Mrs surname. I too avoid using 'Dr' (PhD) when registering at doctor's surgery etc. I haven't changed any paperwork since I became Professor as it seems a bit of a palaver, but I do occasionally enjoy answering 'is it Ms or Mrs?' with 'Professor, actually'. Then, in a typically self-deprecating way, say (truthfully) 'but I'm just as proud of my 'Mrs'! I do have a giggle though when the Tesco delivery man tells me about his back ache and I have to explain that he'd better off speaking to next-door-the-retired-physio .

p.s. Mumsnet HQ: have you ever looked at the statistics on the proportion of academics on your board? I'm convinced they're not in line with national statistics, or perhaps I'm getting a distorted picture based on the lists that I lurk/post to?

It definitely helps, in my experience to have 'Dr' as a title, in order to get better service. Sad as it may seem. I hate the need to use it in such circumstance (makes me feel quite pompous), but a female voice, particularly when complaining, is too easily dismissed.

whiteflame yep (wasn't thinking too much about my wording). Still not bothered about it.

imho it is crass to use a non-MD doctor title outside of professional (academic) environments. I live in the US and it is frowned upon

Having worked as an academic in the US, that was never my experience: anyone from an hourly-paid adjunct to a proper professor calls themselves "Professor" in the US. But not everyone has a PhD.

Incidentally, it IS becoming an issue of confusion in the medical world now. There are increasing numbers of nurses who are achieving PhDs and referring to themselves as doctors when they interact with patients

This is funny! First of all, let's diss nurses for getting above themselves (and potentially sexist as most nurses are women), and then let's pretend that the degree of MD is equivalent to a PhD. It's not. Calling a medico "Doctor" is a courtesy title only.

I filled in a web form today, to get someone round for a quote for a patio door of all things. In the 'title' box, I wanted to put 'Ms' rather than 'Dr', which I normally use. Somehow I felt Dr might make them think I was rich and would buy a really expensive door... Anyway, the form had no 'Ms', just Mr, Mrs, Miss, Dr and Rev. So Dr it is. Oh well.

What if I wasn't a Dr? I haven't used Miss since I was a teenager. Have never used Mrs. DH suggested I put Mr . Guess I could have put Rev . Yes I could vote with my feet and pick another door company, but I'm getting fed up of hunting for someone to do the blasted thing at a reasonable price!

...let's pretend that the degree of MD is equivalent to a PhD. It's not. Calling a medico "Doctor" is a courtesy title only.

Hands Collie a flak jacket and a tin hat

Oh, I have loads of medico friends. They agree.

(History PhD tin hat on) It dates back to the time when lots of people's family names were formed by their employment: Wheeler, Cooper, Wright and so on. Or when people were called "Jones the Boot" or Smith the Laundress". So a tradesman who doctored people was called "a doctor."

Being a medical doctor has only been a university-trained "profession" for a relatively short time. Most of them, until the late 19C (except at Edinburgh) were apprenticed to a surgeon or apothecary.

The status attached to being a medical doctor is a quite recent thing.

When I've been in hospital with my DD (complex medical history and neurological problems) if the medical Dr asks what I do and I say I'm a final year PhD researcher they are always interested and without a doubt then speak to me with maybe a hint more respect.

It depends on the setting.

In a very formal letter or professional setting I use Dr as others do according to custom. Nowhere else though.

A nurse with a doctorate is an interesting conundrum. To tell a patient that they are a "doctor" is tricky because the average layman will assume that they have the authority to diagnose and prescribe for medical conditions, and that is not ok. I think a nurse should take care that there is no confusion on this point.

I went to Berkeley, where all professors have PhDs. They were always addressed as "professor." Later, I was admin at a much less prestigious university, and all the professors insisted on being called "doctor." It struck me as being insecurity. Berkeley professors know they are the best in their fields and didn't need constant validation of their status.

It's not a massive conundrum is it? You'd say: hi, I'm nurse msrisotto. How often do you think they'd use their title when introducing themselves to patients?

I really fail to see why this is such a problem. Nobody goes to a friend's bbq and introduces themselves as "Dr X". But if they are asked what their title is, it is Dr.

Put it like this. Mrs and Dr are both titles you "earn" (ie. are not born with), so why is it acceptable to call yourself "Mrs", and go so far as to correct people who call you "Miss"? But dare to use a title that you really earned, and you are deemed stuck up...

Ms. "because my marital status is unimportant", totally valid.
Dr. "because I earned it" sounds pretentious.
Dr. "because I'm acting in a professional role" completely valid.
Mrs. "because I earned it" sounds like prostitution, tbh!
Dr./Mrs. "because I like it and it's true" fine, but don't get in a huff about it, please. I would think it odd if someone felt compelled to correct Miss to Mrs. except in formal settings.

In the USA Professor isn't an honorific like it is in UK, by the way. Any one teaching at Uni level is a Professor; we don't even have the words "lecturer" or "Reader".

Correcting Miss to Dr is no more pretentious or fussy than correcting Miss to Mrs.

One irritating thing about the whole 'doctor' business is is tv interviews when one guest is introduced as 'dr sally souffle' and the other guest as 'milly meringue' even where formal titles are completely irrelevant.

Reminds me of the courtroom scene in the film 'Inherit the Wind' where the judge has to award the the temporary title of 'Colonel' to the defense lawyer to ensure a fair trial!

I have always understood that in this country it was not really the done thing to use the "Doctor" title for a PhD in everyday life, as distinct from within an academic department or other professional situations where it was directly relevant.

Politicians who insist on it (John Reid, Rhodes Boyson etc) strike me as a bit dodgy.

It's not pretentious if it is simply correct.

why is that somebloke?

strikes me as more dodgy if they try to hide their correct title... why should anyone be ashamed of education?

why shouldnt people use the term DR if they have earned my friend has a PHD and on all of her formal documents she is known as DR blah ,blah if i had a PHD I would use the term all the time pretentious or not !

whiteflame I don't know why, but it's just my observation.

Certainly I can see its usefulness for a woman to get around the Mrs/Miss/Ms issue.

If I had a PHD I would definately use my title but I wouldn't insist. Be proud you have earned it and others are probably envious.

interesting somebloke... i really do wonder why that is, because where i come from it would be considered suspicious to try to hide your title!