In thinking that good make-up is deceptive?

[Moominsummermadness]

Well of course it's supposed to be. That's the whole point of it. Even very subtle make-up is worn to make us look prettier, younger, healthier. This morning, I was rushing around trying to get four DCs ready to get two of them to panto rehearsals, and then on to my parents house, yet I 'had' to find the time to put some make-up on.

I've been told that I am pretty, but it is all an illusion. I scare even myself with my bare reflection sometimes. I won't go out of the house without at least some concealer under my eyes, mascara and blusher. It makes me feel weird, almost naked. I would love to have the confidence to go make-up free, but the odd time I have been to work without a full face of slap, I have been questioned about the state of my health.

I have four DDs, and hope that at least one of them doesn't turn out as vain as her mother .

Hmm. I wonder how long people actually spend doing makeup, how many hours out of their lives is spent making up and removing it. I have reactions to so many brands, even as a young teen, that I gave up trying and never got used to wearing it. Now, as a mother to two little ones, I can't imagine having the time to do it, especially on busy mornings dashing out to work and getting the children up and to nursery (no, I don't want to get up before 6:30 to add to my morning routine.)

those ten minutes are time i could be doing something else

Fair enough but you can say that about anything though. I don't drink tea or coffee so save many minutes each day not boiling kettles, not drinking coffee, not queuing in Starbucks etc. . . . . . . . . .

Men seem to find me attractive (which is what make up seems to be about)

Really, is it? Even when I'm working from home I like to apply some makeup. The idea that the reason women apply makeup in order to snare a man is pathetic.

And by the way, I'm 35 and frequently get asked for ID when buying a bottle of wine, so my complexion doesn't seem to be suffering too much from my love of makeup.

i have worn makeup maybe 3 times in the last year. just dont wear it. never bothered. i hardly have time to brush my hair in the mornings, often just plonk it a pony tail. my oh isnt bothered either. he once said to me after i had spent an hour doing my hair and make up for a wedding "what are you wearing all that for?" not quite the oh you look beautiful i was hoping for! so not doing it for him and not doing it for me either, i just dont care! maybe i will care as i get older. But with sn kids mornings are too busy to care.

Squoosh, I'm baffled by why people would wear make up. There were various comments up thread about men's take on women wearing make up, so I assume that if women are talking about make up in relation to their attractiveness to the other sex then it must be a factor in them deciding to wear it.

Why be baffled? I don't care whether other women go out wearing five sets of false lashes and their own weight in fake tan, equally I don't care if they scrub their face with soap and water and leave it at that. Their decision.

And really and truly I don't care what men think of my makeup, I wear makeup because I like the way I look when I'm wearing it. I wouldn't allow a man to tell me to wear more makeup, equally I wouldn't alllow a man to tell me to go makeup free.

I like experimenting with makeup, it's fun. To me.

I'm quite happy with different people deciding how much make up they personally are going to wear. I'm happy if they do it for themselves or for others, I'm happy if they do it to impress or not.

I'm not happy if people feel forced or pressured into wearing make up, particularly impressionable young girls. I'm not happy if I am (or others are) ridiculed or treated differently because of not wearing it, whether it is by choice or not. (I was definitely not happy when I was criticised for not wearing it on my wedding day.)

Oh dear. People have been using makeup since 10,000BC. Its not new.

And no one is compelled to wear it.

Its amusing to hear of the 'bafflement' of those who don't wear it. Some people like cheese. Some people don't. Why is this 'baffling'? Its personal preference.

Okay, I am baffled that people can be arsed with it. I am also baffled that people can be arsed to iron all their clothes and sheets. Or pluck their eyebrows.

I don't think any less of people that do or don't do these things, I just don't understand why someone would get up earlier or spend less time with their DCs so they have time to put on make up.

However, it didn't actually cross my mind that someone might enjoy putting on make up, so that pretty much explains for me why anyone would rather put on make up than do other things. So, thank you.

I do love a bit of make up. Some days I go the whole hog and do foundation, concealer, blusher, eyeshadow and all the rest.
Other days I go with nothing I like to do that as it stops me worrying about having to wear it all the time and people not knowing what I really look like.

To me it's just like fashion, it's fun to play around with different styles, new brands etc.

Never understood why some women feel the need to attack other women and their choices

"Never understood why some women feel the need to attack other women and their choices"

Allow me to explain the concept. Other peoples choices affect me and mine (in this case especially my DD). If I think your choices are going to adversely affect my DD then I will point out the fact in no uncertain terms.

Do you think your dogmatic opinion on this matter will adversely affect your dd? What if she grows up to adore makeup? Will that be ok?

How does me deciding to put on a bit of mascara and eyeshadow on, or deciding to curl my hair one day affect your daughter?
You can preach all you like but your daughter will grow up and make her own decisions in life. She may or she may not listen to your opinions on makeup, as long as she's happy and healthy then what does it matter?

I don't wear make-up at all because it angers me that women feel like they have to and are judged for not wearing make-up, when men aren't expected to (feminist). On a personal level I do prefer looking at women who aren't wearing makeup, so I think that helped me to transition from the teen who knew a lot about makeup and wore it every day, to now when I don't even wear it for special occasions including my wedding day.

That's a very sweeping generalisation you've got there Noren

Pure observation, actually.

I too am a feminist Noren and I don't feel I have to wear makeup, I feel I want to. Have to laugh though, you're railing against perceived prejudices towards women who don't wear makeup but then quite happily display your own prejudices against women who do wear makeup.

Hello irony.

Squoosh, I didn't say ALL women. But clearly, there are women who feel they have to.

There's another argument about why you want to, but I won't get into that.

yeah well if all teenage girls were happy and healthy then I too wouldn't give a shit about whether people wore make up or not.

But they aren't. A lot are very unhappy and very unhealthy because of societies obsession with appearance and beauty.

If my daughter is happy and healthy and adores make up then we will agree to disagree. If I have another DD then we will have to see...I wouldn't want one DD undermining the others confidence in what's inside being the most important thing.

So you've gone round asking every single woman why they wear make up and they've all told you they do it for the men?

Well you've obviously not asked me, I wear it cos I like it and I don't give a fig what anyone else thinks.

People do get that don't they? That if make up didn't have the negative side affect of undermining girls confidence then I wouldn't give a shiny shit if people wore it?

The ONLY reason I care is because our societal obsession with appearances and beauty is so damaging to vulnerable girls.

get I am glad your self confidence is such that you can take or leave make up and hence have a free choice.

But that is not true for everyone.

The same arguments are used for Burkhas etc. That no one is forcing anyone to wear one...it's just that everyone happens to choose to do so in certain geographical locations.

And yes a whole load of people probably are happy and confident in that choice. But a whole load aren't and feel forced to comply with their local societal model of correct dress.

Same with make up. Undoubtedly some people just wear it for fun (because a layer of synthetic grease on your face feels soooo nice) but a whole lot of people are being driven to conform to the societal expectation that "one must look ones best" and that is a Bad Thing.

But bringing your daughters up with the opinion of 'its evil to wear makeup' isn't giving them a healthy opinion on women who choose to. I'd much rather bring my daughter with the belief that you can be beautiful with or without makeup. The Roald Dahl quote comes to mind...
"A person who has good thoughts cannot ever be ugly. You can have a wonky nose and a crooked mouth and a double chin and stick-out teeth, but if you have good thoughts they will shine out of your face like sunbeams and you will always look lovely.?