To tell DP that he gets a weekend lie in when he starts doing night time "duty" with DD

[RainbowsFriend]

... or when she starts letting me have at least 6 hours sleep in a row.

He says it's unfair as it's not his choice he doesn't deal with her wake ups but hers - she just screams if he goes to her at night despite being perfectly acceptable during the day.

So DD is 16 months and doesn't sleep. NEVER has. Used to be no more than 2 hours in a row, sometimes now I might get 3 or if I'm lucky 4. (Not interested in advice on controlled crying etc thanks as it just doesn't work on DD)

I cosleep and generally just shove a boob in and she goes back to sleep very very quickly - but I'm still tired and one weekend day I ask DP to get up with her when she wakes properly at 7.30 so I can have a lie in until about 8.30.... The other weekend day he tends to be up early for sailing.

He works full time but has practically zero commute, and I work 4 days a week, with a small commute - but only until 2.30 on 3 of the days.

For completeness - he sleeps in the spare room as he gets too disturbed by her wakenings so gets a full nights sleep every night unless she's been particulary vocal...

(he gets very grumpy on little sleep, while I tend not to until I'm very very tired and haallucinating from lack of sleep)

Rainbow - I could have written your post, except DH is not working right now and I am. Full time. And still getting up in the night with DS3, and, as it happens, doing everything else bar getting dinner ready for when I'm home from work .

Getting a bit fucking pissed off if I'm honest. I don't want to dent his fragile ego (as someone at work suggested - he was made redundant) but I simply can't and won't do everything. Came downstairs this morning and noticed he'd left an opened letter and a KFC bag by the front door yesterday. He is also still in bed. I have to go to work soon.

YANBU. And why only till 8.30? I have a lie in till about 10 as I find it's enough to regenerate the batteries, DS doesn't need or want me in that time, and it's not late enough that it affects me going to sleep at bedtime.

I can see this generating a huge fight in my household though, so good luck with yours!

How can he see to her in the night, when all she is waking up for is the comfort of the boob? That is the root of the problem.She is more than capable of sleeping through the night but has trained herself to wake up and cry for boob whenever she comes to the surface.You will be in the same situation in a year or 2 years if you don't break this unhealthy habit.
Also if you are lying right next to her she will find your nipple by herself at that age -no need for you to properly wake up.

YANBU. I can fully sympathise as I'm in a somewhat similar position.

DD, nearly 2, is still co sleeping and feeds to sleep. She also wakes up several times in the night. As I'm a SAHM and DP works very long hours, he feels he is more deserving of a lie in. He often gets annoyed at me when I say I'm tired as he thinks I have brought it on myself by not sorting Dd's sleeping out and I often go to bed late to get tasks done that are impossible with DCs around during the day.

We have compromised by having one sleep in each per weekend although DP often works weekends. Could you and DP compromise by having one day each? That seems fair to me and will give you a chance to catchup on sleep. Tiredness is difficult for everyone!

OP your DP has a choice...

He gets up in the night.
He gives up sailing temporarily, or at least say every other weekend.
He goes without a lie in.

Agree with Beau about lieing in longer than 8.30

A lie in is 10:30am here. I am happy for DH to read or watch something, he doesn't have to be asleep.

I can't sleep in but love a cheeky restorative nap. Could your DH take your DD out for a few hours so you can rest properly?

I suggest you invest in some heavy duty ear defenders and lock yourself in the spare room. Better yet, a nice b+b up the road.

He "can't" settle her? He needs to learn. Assuming he's an intelligent, able-bodied human being, he has no less aptitude for parenting than you - he just needs to practice, just like you have.

When you've caught up on the sleep he's getting, he can claim a lie in (which, btw, should give you a clear 5-6 hours once he's taken over, not a measly one!)

I totally agree with socharlotte. How on earth can he get a look in if she's just wanting the boob? Is it your choice the sleeping arrangements and feeding? Does he agree with it, does he have any say in this?

And re 'controlled crying doesn't work on dd'. Controlled crying works with all children if you stick at it! It doesn't kill them. It just means a few heart wrenching nights. Your daughter is 16 months old, not six months. I am fairly relaxed re co sleeping etc - my dd still comes in to my bed sometimes and she's 8! So I'm not a tyrant about this. But honestly how much longer can you do this for?

Re everything else YANBU ie he needs to do his share and give you sleep/lie ins one way or another. It is unfair for him not to see how knackered you are and pull his finger out more.

I have similar dd to you - co sleeping, bf. But at the weekend both days when ds wakes at 6ish dp takes over and I spend a couple of hours sleeping in the spare room. He sleeps the night in the spare room so isn't tired. He works full time, long hours, long commute.

Yanbu, your dh should give you a lie in both days of the weekend!

I'm probably going to get flamed here, but can't he just have one lie-in every couple of weeks or so?

Ok you get woken every 3 to 4 hours but you say yourself she goes back to sleep very very quickly. Some people sleep worse than that without a baby just because they're not great sleepers themselves. Can he at least go back to bed for an hour once you're up at 8:30 on your lie-in day?

Some people cope better on less sleep and some people don't. They can't help it!

I agree with ProudnScary. I know you're not interested in CC but can I ask you to expand on why you think it doesn't work for your DD?

I sympathise though, 16 months of broken sleep must be torture and I definitely think your DH should let you catch up on some sleep when he's at home.

erm he does get a lie, he just chooses to go sailing instead! Is he really expecting you to get up both weekend days and do all the night wakings and work 4 days per week? So that he can have a full nights sleep ebery night and have a lie in and a nice morning doing a child free activity! Although I know how hard it is if a baby just wants the boob but HE will have to put the effort in to change this. My dh really struggled to settle our bf dd, but after persevering for several weeks, she would settle for him.

Is he happy about the co sleeping and separate room thing? Maybe after 16 months he is feeling a bit rejected and resentful and thinking you have kind of brought this on yourself.

I think one lie in each at the weekend would be fair.

But you need to talk to each other about the sleeping arrangements. Not good for intimacy (I mean more being relaxed and close to each other than sex) if you never share each others bed.

Why can't you get up on the day he doesn't go sailing??!! Don't understand why you lay in one day, and he goes sailing the next so doesn't get a lay in, surely it's just switching days?

He does deserve a lay in too. You need to deal with your baby's sleep issues.

Some children just don't sleep well FFS, just like some adults don't sleep well. CC does not work for all children. I know of several failures.

OP YANBU, if it helps DD was the same until she was night weaned at 18 months. She sleeps a little better now but still does not need a huge amount of sleep. My DNeice was the same (non bf'd, refused milk from 9 months at night), DSis did CC for 3 weeks before she finally gave up.

We have had some sucess with No Cry Sleep Solution, might be worth a read. DD gone from waking every 1 - 1.5 hours to sleeping for up to 6 at a time (sometimes even in her own bed!!)

Your DH needs to step up, if he won't do a night shift (DH was the same until I decamped to my friends house for the night) then you need a lie in.

Lol at "its not his choice" that dd screams at him - its not your choice either, is it? Although actually I think you both need to work at getting dd and dh more used to each other. So she screams. Doesn't mean he shouldn't do it.

When I do nights, I get all the lie-ins. Till about 9 because it is just too hard to keep the older children quiet longer than that. If dh wants a lie-in, he does the night before. We have a child with SN so we're still operating that system, 5 years on ...

Do you get a weekend morning/afternoon completely to yourself, to go off and do a hobby (my chosen hobby would be to sit in a coffee shop with a book )? If not, why not? And you're owed 16 months of being the only one to have a weekend morning off ...

Does dh agree with having dd in bed and feeding on demand? Is that the problem - that he thinks she shouldn't be? If he thinks the solution is to put her in her own bed and not feed her at night, he'd need to take over nights completely until that is sorted. But perhaps he is resentful, thinks its your fault (not necessarily thinking that rationally, of course) etc. Has he tried any sort of sleep training with her, and realised for himself that it doesn't work, or is that your conclusion? I'm not saying you're wrong that it doesn't work - I had 2 children who didn't learn to sleep till between their 2nd and 3rd birthdays and one who slept beautifully so I do understand that. But maybe your dh doesn't?

YANBU DP and i have a night each on baby duty at the weekend and a lie in each the other day unless someones lost a limb neither of us gets up before 10am an extra hour one day a week is utter bollocks he should have her til at least lunch time even if your awake you should stay in bed with a book and if he CHOOSES to go sailing instead of getting a lie in thats up to him and he should like it or lump it.

DS isn't keen on DP getting up with him in the night but i just ignore them and let them get on with it cruel mother

I don't want to give you advice as i know how annoying fucking infuriating it can be so i'll just say good luck

Oh ugh.

Now - he will have to learn to settle her. That's a given.

He takes himself off to the spare room so he is not disturbed does he? That's caring and involved of him isn't it? Nothing like looking out for number one.

And he gets grumpy on very little sleep but you don't. No mate - he feels no worse than you, but doesn't see the need to modify his behaviour like you do. He feels entitled to indulge and express it, to the point where you give in to him just to keep the peace. Quite dreadful.

It's time for the new way. Ring the changes.

Sorry, but CC doesn't work on all children. My child (DS3 - my twins were a dream compared to him!) just cries until he is sick. I can't cope with that. Yes, I guess I could do it over and over again over a few nights but he is only one, he will grow out of it, and for now it's more doable than cleaning up sick all the time.

I think a proper lie in on an alternating basis is fair. But NOT till 8.30 - till 10 at least!

And good idea about trying to get baby off the boob - think I will start DH on 'baby settling' duty from tonight.

Thanks for all the replies.

To respond to a few things:

I haven't "trained" her to just wake for the boob - she just hasn't grown out of it yet - as I said her sleep used to be a lot lot worse and if boob gets her back to sleep quickly then that's good for everyone. She seems incapable of finding the nipple herself though - just wakes up properly if I don't drag her over... and waking up properly means awake for 3 hours

DP is happy with the cosleeping thing - in fact he sleeps badly when in bed with anyone else, even me, so he prefers it. We still have cuddles though! DD settles for the first 2 hours in her cosleeper cot fine, and we cuddle until DP wants to actually go to sleep when he goes back to his own bed. He has restless leg thingy as well so separate beds actually work quite well for all of us. :)

CC does not work for her and I have no intention to leave her to cry until she throws up again. She can cry for 7 hours straight without sleeping, and resettling just makes her worse. Not doing it. You CANNOT persuade me that they get no harm from it - she was practically traumatised and very subdued for over a week from one night.

I have read the no cry sleep solution and again it didn't work - tried it for 3 months straight. I truly believe that DD is just slow to get mature sleep patterns. Some babies are slow to walk, some to talk, some to sleep. She walked early, is talking in sentences early, but sleep is her compromised.

Swapping days to have a lie in doesn't work as if I had a lie in on the sailing weekend day DD would be unsupervised for an hour until I get up! (He leaves early)

I can't sleep through her feeding. Just can't.

If DP tries to settle her at night she wakes up properly and screams - cue us pacing the floors for 3 hours and mucks everything up for days. He has her on his own for one afternoon a week, and does his fair share the rest of the time - and she accepts him just fine then. Just not at night or when ill - only mummy will do.

I might got for a 10.30 lie in next time though!

So he's taking your lie-in on a Sunday by going sailing, leaving you caring for the children all day, presumably? I would have the Saturday morning lie-in if I were you, and leave him the choice of what to do on Sunday - have his lie-in or choose to use it going sailing.

He's going sailing rather than having a lie-in.

Let me say my experience - mine also couldn't sleep through without feeding, and we co-slept - at 16 months he was having about a midnight, and about a 4am feed (plus falling asleep, waking, and naptime feeds - and a lot of solid foods - I don't know how he fitted it all in).

At about 18months he decided that for most of the night he didn't like being stuck in the bed with us though, so he started in a little nest by the bed, then we bought a toddler bed which we butted right up next to us. He'd spend the first part of the night in his bed (he came to be with us at about 10ish), then join us from about 4am.

A couple of months after that, he dropped the midnight feed, then at about 2 he just dropped the 4am feed (unless miffed, or has a cold). Now at 2 and a few months we've moved his bed into another room, and he spends most of the night there, then wanders into us at about 4 or 5 (again, unless miffed or sick). On the days when he's skipped his nap he'll go to bed at 7 or 8, on days when he has napped he goes to bed at 9 or 10. We do have to settle him to sleep, but he will let DP do that now (at 16 months, DP would only have got him to sleep after a lot of crying, once he was truely exhausted - he really, really wanted the sleep)

In summary (given this was an essay) if you can hold on, I bet she'll be sleeping through by/soon after 2. You should split the lie-ins at the weekend, and DP I'm afraid is spending his by getting up and going sailing. It's all very well saying to nap when the baby does, but there's something so much more restful about sleeping until you naturally wake up rather than when you are woken up.

'In summary (given this was an essay) if you can hold on, I bet she'll be sleeping through by/soon after 2.'
.. why because your child did, they will all be the same?

I haven't "trained" her to just wake for the boob
No-she's trained herself to do it, because you reward her for it! If everytime I woke momentarily in the night somebody popped a slice of Terry's chocolate orange in my mouth, I'm pretty sure I would continue to do it

'CC does not work for her and I have no intention to leave her to cry until she throws up again. She can cry for 7 hours straight without sleeping, and resettling just makes her worse. Not doing it. You CANNOT persuade me that they get no harm from it - she was practically traumatised and very subdued for over a week from one night.

..of course it doesn't work if you only try it for one night!!

If DD wants boob in the night, of course she is going to scream if DH goes to her - he doesn't have what she wants.

If you want DH to see to her in the night then you need to agree to stop co-sleeping and that he will settle her in the night until she is night weaned. (which might mean well mean she screams at first, you have to work through it)

I agree with those that are trying to explain that your DD is conditioned to expect a bf every time she wakes in the night. I made the same mistake with my DS, who didn't sleep through a night till 36 months, and was determined not to repeat it with DD.
I realised that I had been reinforcing DS's waking by responding instantly with milk. I did whatever got him (and me) back to sleep the quickest - but it was the wrong thing to do as it just prolonged the unwanted behaviour.