To not buy a poppy

[Hippymum89]

Why is it more important to remember the death of a soldier who died fighting for the country (or so he believed) than the death of every other person who has died?
What about all the others who have died helping others? Were their lives less important? Or the little old lady who died in hospital at the age of 97, she didn't kill any Germans, or rescue people. She lived her life, but doesn't that count?
I think poppys glorify war and therefore murder, so I will not be buying one.

So, ethelb, you would be a pacifist and stand by while someone murdered your children would you?

@bree well they could stop having expensive wars for a start.

It's Ok, ethel will pay all the tax that it would take to make the money that charities like the RBL and MacMillan donate to people in need.

She has magnetised the Euromillions balls and will be winning every week for the next 10 years, I beleive.

I don't think you understand the notion of tax.

That my tax goes to the government, and onwards to the NHS, for instance, who then spread it among needy cancer patients.

Since you don't believe in charity because the government should pay for that, despite the fact the government has made massive cutbacks in nearly all areas including the NHS.

So where would the money be coming from exactly?

I dont think you understand a lot of anything really ethel.

I just hope that if you are unfortunate enough to have your life affected by cancer, either directly or indirectly, you would stand by your convictions and not take any help from any charities.

I didn't say that people shouldn't use charities. I just don't think there should be a need for them. Unfortuanly there are. I give to shelter.

The thing about all these people who are calling servicemen murderers is that they must be disrespecting the memory some of their own family. If not in recent time then certainly from WWI and WWII,simply because of conscription.

There have been a lot of servicemen in my family. Though none of died in service since WWI. That doesn't mean they didn't see terrible things. The one who died in WWI was a 14 year old boy. He died at Ypes.

I have nothing but the upmost respect for service men,all of them. Those who have lost their lives,the veterans of all ages,those who continue to agree to protect Queen and Country. We may all think the Iraq War is wrong (and that will include plenty of servicemen) but one day,a war will start and all you nay sayers will all be damn grateful for these men and women. As every normal person is now.

Dumkopf !

I'm anti war, I marched in protest against the war in Iraq, but I always wear a poppy and always go to a Remembrance Day parade. If you don't want to then that's your choice but if any of my friends didn't want to I would and have think a lot less of you. Poppies don't glorify war, the point is to remember the sacrifice and hope it doesn't happen again. I don't believe in the figting going on at the moment but I repect every single one of those soldiers for being able to do something I would frankly be too scared to do. And once a year I show my gratitude to soldiers past and present.
If you don't believe in war then protest, fight the politicians and get up petitions and do something about it. But don't call soldiers murderers and condemn them for doing something they believe in. Yes they kill people but in a kill or be killed situation how many of you would be willing to put your hands up and accept death without a fight. If your family was there being threatened how many of you would allow them to die without a fight? I hope anyone who is saying poppies are wrong is blue eyed and blonde haired with no jewish or gypsy ancestory. I'm not

MrsDeVere: I am angry that the state hasn't provided adequately for your OH and your family. And I think it's something that should be addressed. I can see why charities that provide this kind of care exist because it is just unthinkable that people would be unsupported in this way. But I think this does let the state off the hook. We should be very angry that the state so easily disregards its obligations in this way, and this should most definitely change.

(And, for what it's worth, I do also feel for your OH and your family (and others in similar situations). I understand that living with disability and coping with loss are incredibly difficult, and my anger at the state does not prevent me from recognising this. I wish I could put this better but I'm struggling to find the right words.)

Thats good that you support Shelter, Ethel. There are a lot of homeless people who are ex servicemen. :)

I don't think even the expensive wars could cover the cost of what your suggesting.

Squeaky got in their first re shelter

I know they help a lot of ex servicemen. Who suffer because of government policy. However, I prefer their campaigning angle rather than just paying for things. I like they way they put a lot of pressure on gov.

Ethel - you don't get it. If you mean that in an ideal world, the Govt would fund research and palliative care for all medical conditions, and therefore charities would not be required, well, no one would disagree with that. But it's not an ideal world and no nation on earth could afford that, even if no one ever fought again. Your choice of words was, at best, unfortunate, at worst, damned offensive.

Whereas your 'murderers' was damned offensive and nothing else.

Cancer charities failed my mother, she had ovarian cancer for 7 years but when it spread to her brain & became terminal she called McMillan as was desperate for some support. She was told that she wouldn't be able to see a cancer nurse as they were not enough to go around, she put the phone down & sobbed her heart out. Does it make me think cancer charities shouldn't exist? Of course not, it makes me think they need more money. The NHS does not have the funds to run itself, let alone take on other roles. Which is why its important to make charity contributions including the poppy appeal.

I don't glorify war but I recognise that in many times of life, sometimes things cannot be resolved with words alone. If a peace cannot be made through words then other decisive actions have to be taken. I know Hitler is brought up in these threads but he's a prime example of why armies need to exist.

I don't wear a poppy, well I wear a white one I was brought up wearing a white poppy and going to peace marches, my great grandparents were conscientious objectors in the 1st and 2nd world wars and I am proud of them.

I think the victims of war need supporting but I believe that the money should go to the people disfigured, displaced and orphaned in the countries we invade. The citizens of Afghanistan and Iraq didn't choose to have bombs dropped on their villages but the service men and women did choose to go into a dangerous situation and fight as their job. Yes their families will be worse off without them if they die but they will be a huge amount better off than the families left homeless and displaced in the invaded countries.

Don't wear a poppy if you don't want to.

People died so you could have your freedom. You may not even be here today if not for them. Talk about ungrateful. :(

I forgot to answer your question.
YWBVU not to wear a poppy.

lb you would honestly think less of me?

No, I'm not backtracking on the murder comment. Killing people is killing people. Sometimes it is more justified than other times but it is murder

No it isn't. Murder is the unlawful killing of a person. So, going out and stabbing someone in the street not fighting a war in defence of freedom.

OK, I am going to say something controversial here. I suspect my controversial opinions have made me already quite unpopular on MN so I will say firstly that I am not trying to be unpleasant, just honest in how I feel.

Every year when I start being asked if I would like to buy a poppy, I sometimes do and I sometimes don't. My DH wears one every year and last year bought one for each of us, though I didn't wear it.

I actually become quite angry about this every year.

As some regular MN's may know, I am of mixed African descent. My family members who contributed to the war effort have all been forgotten about and have never received any significant or direct recognition or compensation from this government or country for their service to the war effort in either of the great wars.

My family not only contributed by serving in both great wars as soldiers and servicemen, but also as farmers and labourers for the war effort. They have received nothing for this.

I come from an ex British colony and I am incensed over this every year.

I think it is honourable to support those who fought for our 'freedom', but my anger makes me unable to wholeheartedly support what I feel is an unfair distribution of recognition and compensation.

If my feelings and knowledge on this are wrong, please educate me on the matter. I would like to not feel this way about this issue.

Well your entitled to your opinion, don't buy ne who cares!