to say to people I am not a girl, I am a woman.

[blueraincoat]

Just that really.

It really, really grates when people call me a girl. I am not a girl, I am a woman, I haven't been a girl for a while now. I just find it incredibly patronising. Whenever I say this people sigh or tell me I am being pedantic. Am I the only one this gets to?!

No slug! Really you say that? I'm in awe.

I think that's a bit OTT Slug.

i hate woman, i would never call myself a woman, i would say girl. but i am only 24, and only feel about 18!

I'm in my 20's so I agree that to some people I am a girl and I don't go around biting people's head off about it, I agree with those who say it depends on context, but it does get to me at times. I certainly am not a girl to my male boss who is only a couple of years older than me even though he insists on calling me one.

And to the people saying this thread has been done before, apologies, I have not been on Mumsnet since time immemorial so I am unaware of every single thread that has ever happened ever!

My mum says "That girl over there, with the white hair, and the walking stick". Basically anyone her age or younger is a girl.

I do it too - but am really really trying to stop and will correct myself.

On another note, isn't it odd that "woman" is seen as a bit rude/abrupt. As in, "This woman needs help" or "give it to the woman". Not the same with Man, is it?

Our language is steeped in misogyny...

It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if someone called me a 'girl.' Some people are so quick to take offence at absolutely anything!
In fact, I'd PREFER to be called a 'girl' than 'woman'. Woman makes me feel like my mother. I'm not old enough.
You'd love it round here. You'd get called 'love' or 'lass.' Or maybe 'duck.'

blueraincoat you don't have to have been on here since the year dot.
This type of thread comes up every couple of weeks just like the P and C parking spaces.

depends on context but if a man at work was doing it to me in a patronising way i'd probably start calling them 'boy'.

i do use it myself though - i say i belong to a girls cycling club rather than womens cycling club, i guess because although i'm ancient, most of the others are sort of student age (20/21ish) so although 'women' as in menstuating, the'd be french madamoiselles rather than madames.

Ah well, that's me told!

Really Justfloatingby? why is it OTT to demand the same rights and privileges as a man, including the privilege of being addressed as an adult?

Have you asked yourself why you are so happy to be spoken to as if you were a young child? And why is it so important for women to be eternally youthful?

I've been using that line since I was 18 and it never fails to stop them in their tracks. Speciallanguagelady is so right. Our language is steeped in misogeny.

slug So if my nan, who is 94 and a lovely women and refers to everyone under 70 as a 'girl', ('it's all relative' is what she says) you would glare and say 'I mensturate therefore I am a WOMAN!!' would you?
How odd and rude.

Fair enough it was someone trying to put you down but come on, your response is a bit aggressive if you take offensive when there is none.

Whoa, calm down slug. I just don't find anything rude or dismissive about the term from the majority of people who use it. If someone described me as 'that girl over there with the dark hair' or asked 'are you the girl that phoned up earlier' or somesuch I really would not see the necessity of replying in such an aggressive and confrontational manner.
If someone my own age or younger said something like 'good girl' I would think they were a twat but it wouldn't enrage me. There really are better things to worry about.

Lot's of men are addressed as lads, eg 'Im meeting the lads for a pint, or 'I'm off to the the match with the lads'.
What would the male equivalent of Slug's reply be I wonder?

I prefer girl

Woman sounds really formal to me

LadyBeagle You are right about that. My dad who is 71 still goes out for a pint with the lads from work - He retired 11 years ago!

Dh gets texts from 'the lads over the road to see if he wants to go out'

Me and the girls from work are going out on Tuesday.

Guess what? No one is offended or upset, not even the'girls' who DS thanked on his FB page as I mentioned in an earlier thread.

I think it's because we are hardy Northerners who don't get offended when there is no offense there.

Where I live it's common to say out with the boys. I say to dp they will be calling each other the boys when they are capable of going on a saga holiday.

One of those things that has to be in the right context, or it could be patronising.

yaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnn

There's a qualitative difference though between 'lad' and 'girl'. I've never heard the term 'lads' to refer to a group of toddler boys for example, nor does it have the slightly pejorative sound that 'girls' can have. It's normally applied to teenagers or above. Yet women are referred to as girls all their lives.

When young boys grow up, they don't expect to be called 'boys' for the rest of their lives. They expect to graduate to the 'guys' or the 'lads' but don't expect, once they are past the age of maturity to be persistently referred to as something not quite adult. For boys, maturity is something to be looked forward to. We don't, as a society, generally punish men for getting older. Yet the same cannot be said for women. I think it's quite telling that so many posters have stated that they prefer the term girl because it makes them feel younger. If nothing else, that underscores the fact that women in our society are only valued when they are young. You don't hear men, when complaining of feeling old, that they would prefer to be called a boy as it makes them feel better about themselves do you?

I have no trouble with being called a girl by a relative significantly older than me. I used to work in elderly care and had no trouble being addressed as a girl by my clients because, to them, that was what I was. But in a social or professional setting I see no reason why I should not be afforded the same adult status as the men around me. And if they persist in infantalising me then I gently remind them of what they are doing.

But your response doesn't even make sense Slug. Loads and loads of females start menstruating at 11 or 12. Are they not still girls?

It may be a regional thing then slug

DS's have been called 'lads' since they were toddlers hanging round with their cousins and going to play group.
(come on lads, pack your toys up)
Like wise grown up son and his mates are still 'boys'
The term lad and boy is interchangeable round my way.

Actually, I'm very contradictory because I absolutely hate if someone refers to me and my sister as 'the girls'.

Of course not Justfloating. But when boys reach the age of 16 they are no longer almost exclusively referred to as boys any more. They are afforded the title of 'Young men' or 'gentlemen' (which was my favourite when I taught that age group) They expect to be treated as on the verge of adulthood. Yet we persist as a culture in addressing even grown women as 'girls' and acting surprised when they object.

And, to be factually correct, a menstruating girl, even if she is only 11 or 12 is technically capable of bearing a child. That's not something you could say about 11 or 12 year old boys. At that age girls are already starting to be sexually harassed and we are already starting to tell them to modify their behaviours to reduce the 'risk' of rape. We expect them to behave like adult women yet we still treat them like little girls.