to think capping benefits at 2 children is a good idea

[moogstera1]

Child-related benefits may be 'capped' at two children"
*Iain Duncan Smith said the current system, where families get more benefits the more children they have, was among changes being considered.

Families on benefits were often "freed from" the decision of whether they could afford more children, Mr Duncan Smith said, and must "cut their cloth".*

yes yes, before I get jumped on, if both your arms fall off and a previously hard working wage earner is jobless, there should be ( and I imagine would be)a safety net for those who then need benefits and have more than 2 chidren; but, in principle, I agree that working families seem to have to make much more difficult decisions regarding how many children they have than long term non working do, and it's mostly about finance.
The suggestion is that this would not be happening till 2015 and then only to new claimants so no comments about which children should be sacrificed, please.
The idea seems to be to only factor in 2 children wrt tax credits, child benefit

hahahaha yes everyone in society will be effected. except the people that dont need the money to live on. they will be fine the people that need the money to live on will be forced in to moral dilemmas, woman will still get pregnant. so then what, does she have an abortion?
what if she doesn't agree with abortion? so put the child up for adoption? right. or struggle with the prospect that you will get no extra money for this child even though the government will not cap stupid rents that are continuing to rise and will freeze pay rises. so you will have to stretch the food, the heating, the water, hand down the clothes a bit more, they will do another child and you make do because. lets face it family is about more than can you afford it it's about can you love and create a beautiful person that is going to be good in the world. it is pathetic that your worth is measured only by your ability to provide money and if you cant you are worth nothing. i lived on council estates a large portion of my life and lots of people there just getting on with life heads down raising families trying to get better for themselves. oddly didnt see many 10 kid families in fact I dont think I have ever seen one.
there are your stereotypical shitty families but they are about 1 in 20 if that, the loudest voice and all. i would rather the system got played by a few people and helped the people that need it than it blanketly screw everyone.

See for me this isn't really about money. The last 2 generations have been raised with this 'entitlement' belief and i think these kind of proposals will make people more aware of their own responsiblities. The welfare state in this country has been too generous for too long. Yes it should be there for those who genuinely need it (by that i mean those genuinely incapable of working) but the current system is far too easily abused and needs to change. There are way too many people who have kids just because 'they want them'. I would like lots of things including another child but i simply cannot afford them, i live within my means. Obviously there are other issues needing addressed such as high cost of living/low wages/childcare costs etc.

"There are way too many people who have kids just because 'they want them'."

How dreadful

I thought the majority of people have children because they just want them? Or have I missed something?

Aren't blended families better for the environment? One houseful being kept to 18 degrees is better than two. And there's a housing shortage.

Can the world afford the British government discouraging family blending?

why did you have kids then crazyhatlady did you not want them?

ok let me rephrase it 'too many people who can't afford them'

Now, now... Play nicely.
We ALL know what crazyhat meant.

I don't agree with this idea. Society is so utterly unfair, that as far as I'm concerned, if the rich (many of whom haven't worked for their riches) can knock as many children out as they like, so should poorer people. Of course it would be better if everyone had no more than 2 (ideally 1) children, but the same "rules" should apply across the board.

It's going to have to become much easier to get an abortion. None of this 2 doctors signing a certificate crap, or having to prove that continuing a pregnancy is bad for your mental health.

How do people feel about midwives handing out abortion advice leaflets to poor women who have become pregnant with a 3rd child?

Or, pushitrealgood, people will just bring their third child up on the same money that they had to bring two children up on. The same as most people already do. This isn't going to plunge people into desperate poverty FFS. It will just mean that the money that had to provide for four people will have to provide for five. I really don't think it's that big a deal.

but if all the poor stop fecklessly having children who will mind the future children of the rich ...and clean their bogs!

seriously it is not the issue - the poor are not the problem

But life is unfair badger.
We're not on a level playing field to start with and then it carries on.

Jeremy Kyle could be a documentary of my area. Easy. In fact it's compared to Shamless, people seem to take pride in that fact

We should fight unfairness Wingedharpy and not encourage it via Tory policies.

Smellslike

"How do people feel about midwives handing out abortion advice leaflets to poor women who have become pregnant with a 3rd child?"

Outraged, shocked and offended, tbh

What about parents like us after having BC's and have adopted 5 DD4 was in residential care was costing £5000/ week and DD 4 £1000/week we have saved this country millions.
I fear for looked after children

SmellsLikeTeenStrop - I think your missing the point we are clearly not supposed to be having sex.

Once you?re a mother clearly sex is inappropriate.

Have we pointed out yet that statutory maternity pay is a state benefit?
Cutting that would make third children completely unaffordable for a very wide swathe of two income (or lone parent) families.

Gordy, no ones stopping anyone else from having children. Have two children for free by all means. After that, take some responsibility.

Being able to have two children, paid for entirely by other people, is not really a bad position to be in.

Before you say it, yes, I know this will affect working people too, but still, having support to have two children when you can't provide for them entirely yourself, is not a bad position to be in.

Actually, that brings up another point. There have been discussions in government concerning the reduction of the gestational age limit on abortions. So women will face a financial pressure to terminate, and have less time to make a decision.

I do not want to see women feeling coerced into terminating.

Third children are already unaffordable for a large swathe of two income families! That's the whole point!

how gracious of you Freddos :)