to swear at the Tax Credits advisor?

[MountEtna]

Feel a bit bad now - god knows why!

H and I split in July. We had a joint claim as he does not earn much and I am self employed. I was told I had to make a new single claim and they would immediately stop the joint one (fair enough) but it would take 2 weeks for me to get a claim form (can't do it on the phone) and then it would take a further 3 weeks to process. So OK I will be left for 5 weeks with no income as I cannot work if I can't pay the childcare for 3 DCs . H's maintenance is paying the essential bills like food and that's all really.

Rang today as I am 4 weeks down the line, to be told that the advisor is referring my claim to a specialist team as she needs more information. 'What information?' says I. 'I don't know' says she. 'So if you don't know what further information you need, why are you referring it to a specialist team?'. 'Can't answer that' says she. She also says it will take a further 4 weeks from today as it is going to this team.

By this time I have steam coming out of my ears so ask to speak to a manager as she is talking in riddles. After another 10 minute wait in addition to the 20 mins I waited to get through. The manager informs me that the cannot match my children up . The same children that were on my joint claim and have been claiming for years for. I say to him can you not just look at my joint claim and you will see that they were all on there. 'Hmm' says he 'it's not that easy'.

He appreciates my situation he says. Lone parent, no income, no money 8 weeks for childcare so cannot work to get some. I say 'you appreciate my situation, you don't give a flying FUCK' and slam the phone down.

What a bloody great system. Getting the money to those who need it!

AIBU to feel a bit stressed and a bit bad for being rude?

Sometimes the answer really is 'I can't help'

But you know a rule you can break bend to help the customer with a small risk of getting wrong

We've all done that, just not for shouty arseholes

YWBVU and I honestly fail to see any justification for how you acted. Yes, it's frustrating but that's no excuse for being abusive.

If that was a hospital, a supermarket, a school, a garage, whatever, and you spoke like that to the staff you would have been removed and quite probably barred.

There is very little the call centre staff can do, they literally put your details in and pull up your claim - they don't have the means to issue payments or override queries lodged by back-office teams, the function isn't even built into their level of system access so they couldn't do it even if they wanted to. The vast majority are hardworking people doing the best they can with the resources available to them. They are watched constantly. If they deviate from the information on the system then they can be disciplined. They've asked for it to change, to be given more power to push claims through and override anything blocking them. It was refused. If you want to complain, complain to your MP and the government - they made the system, they imposed the restrictions.

Some people up thread said more people should swear at them and then maybe it'll change, the phrase 'thick as mince' was used. DH is a TC advisor, he gets abuse on a daily basis. He's been sworn at, there are people who think it's acceptable to suddenly shriek at full volume when things aren't going their way, he's been told to die, someone wished our children would die, he's been called names I won't even repeat and had sickening comments made to him.

Thankfully those people are in the minority but every single incident is reported, the call is listened to, you will be logged as an abusive caller and further action taken against you. Did you know they can ban you from phoning them? If this happens then you need to make all your queries, changes in information, etc in writing.

You lost your rag at someone doing their job. I hope you're proud of yourself and that you feel you accomplished something today.

Well OP. What are you going to do for money now? Kinda burned your bridges with tax credits haven't you? When I worked in a call centre our system had the option to have a screen pop-up when certain customers rang in to warn of 'diffiicult' customers. They aren't going to be jumping through hoops to process your claim now are they?!

Hey Kayano, are you a TC advisor too

The problem is when you take crap day-long, often from people who lie through their back teeth (Really folks, do you think we spend 9 hours a day on the phone without developing a spidey-sense for who actually didn't receive their renewal pack or who is calling for the 9th year running to say they didn't, with added sweariness? Really? Bugbear emoticon) it starts to harden you - you want to help, but the system is what it is and we are checked and judged and disciplined based on our adherence to it - when people call up and get sweary when you genuinely can't do a single thing more (people forget we're not sitting with a filing cabinet and a chequebook, it's all virtual) it can mean that the next sweary furious person gets a little bit less of your heart and soul, because you just can't commit so much care and worry to every single call.

I had a call spectacularly backfire - I could see a large overpayment was about to be notified, and it would have had an impact (based on the discussion during the call) on choices made by the applicant, so I told her about it. My reward for not shutting up? 30 minutes of screaming from the customer, followed by a slightly scowly conversation with my stand-in supervisor about call handling times.

Lose/lose. Contact centre work can make you lose faith in the basic goodness of humanity.

Hammy don't be such a dick she hasn't burnt her bridges. No one gets refused the help they are entitled to because they lost the rag once.

Some call handlers, and I'm not just talkin about tax credits, have this horrific 'I could help you if I want' snarkiness about them. I've seen it first hand, people on total power trips. This 'braver over the phone' works both ways.

It did sound by his responses (ie not explaining exactly what the problem was and what he did actually intend to do about it) that he didn't give a flying fuck, so you just said it as it is.

All this on here about it not being these people's fault because they can't actually do anything about anything - why the heck are we talking to them then? What is the actual point to their job??
Wouldn't it make sense to be able to phone someone who actually can do something???

So yeah OP. It now appears that that you will have to wait even longer for this to be sorted out because those lovely people at the call centre do actually have the ability to put your case at the bottom of the pile (and then proudly brag about their powers on a forum)

No, tech support lol.

I had one woman scream at me because a report was wrong
I told her she was printing the wrong one and to print a different one and showed her how to do it

Next minute she went absolutley batshit screaming that the figures were wrong and I didn't have a clue

I just said if you talk to me like that again I will hang up on you.

She did

I did. I then sent her an email about the report and how it did as she needed.

She emailed me back later saying she had messed up and I was right. Instead of being happy I sat and sobbed at my desk.

Wrong, sixmonkeys. Tax Credits advisors have zero ability to put a claim at the bottom of the pile. We can go the extra mile and do above and beyond the call of duty, but in the normal way of things there's not much you can do to hold up a claim out of malice.

If it's a child not matched verification failure, that comes about if the information on the new claim cannot be verified (for whatever reasons) with the Child Benefit records. In the case of a fresh claim, it's a legal obligation that it be treated as stand alone - no 'dipping' into prior claims - so the checks have to be run regardless of whether or not the information involved was previously verified.

If you've been referred to a specialist team, it's so that they can check for any information mismatches that may be holding up your claim.

The problem is, in real life, 5 weeks is a long time, when it comes to information processing, identity checks, and correspondance via mail, it's not long at all.

Responses like yours, sixmonkeys, are why advisors end up not caring.

Op YABU! Most people who have claimed tax credits will have experienced problems with the system.

I personally have switched from a single to joint claim, back to single and then onto another joint claim. Since I started claiming. Each time having to close the old claim and make a new claim. It's shit, it can take forever, being skint is rubbish.

But, it is not the advisors fault. See the title 'advisor' they advised you what was happening to your claim and how long you would expect to wait. Why should they get sworn at for that?

And as other have said 'you catch more flies with honey than vinegar' it is quite amazing how they may just put that little bit more effort in (phoning another department to find out the hold up, passing you on to somebody who may know, calling back when more information becomes available. if thus is possible, it's not always) if you are being polite and acknowledging that whilst the system is bollocks, which is plain to see, they are only doing the job for which they are paid.

I was in this situation (with csa not tc) and kept them onside, phoning to check how things were progressing etc etc. XH wouldn't talk to them on the phone properly and was blocking throughout. So the advisor decided to take the most dramatic course of action he could (highest % of back payment he could) to get my money to me quicker as I was the 1 co operating. It's not hard to see why tbh!

responses like mine? Which bit?

You have to explained to the OP what the actual problem was and what needs to be done. The chap she spoke didn't explain (or give a flying fuck?) Why didn't he explain? Because of me?

You say there's not mucg you can do to hold a a claim? So that means tehre is 'something' you can do? So.... previous posters who have bragged are not lying about this then?

You say you can go above and beyond the call - how exactly? It has been repeated on here time and time again that all you can do is read a screen.

I say again - what is the point of the job? What is the point of speaking to someone who does not have the ability to help?

@ hammy's post. It's funny because it's true!

Oh, no point at all.

Thank-you for calling.

oh op, it's a bloody nightmare isn't it? all these people saying 'there's no justification for being so rude' have obviously never flipped in a state of sheer panic about putting food in their kids mouths. You know, i'm sure you were BU, but jesus christ, sometimes it's all you can do not to find out where head office is, and go round there with a hammer!!
Take a deep breath, phone back (will be someone else) and get to the bottom of it. Expect the worst, and hold your tongue.
Hope it gets sorted soon.

but the system is a bit useless my claim was stopped in april as i earn to much [according to new guidelines]. Fair enough i only got about 40 pounds a month but the i got another four letters telling me my award for this year was zero with calculations on the back telling me how they had reached this dazzling figure [ie i earn to much] yes even i who failed my maths gcse three times can work that one out. My husband also got the same amount of letters as it was a joint claim exactly, how much money are they wasting [ that could be put to better uses] sending these repetative letters out.First class mail as well.

YANBU people don't understand how frustrating it is, and she didn't sound like she helped you much on the phone. I'd have done the same, and I have been sworn at, actually called A CUNT by someone when I couldn't get their delivery out on time. Happens in all jobs, sad but true, don't feel bad, you are human!!

You make a decision to represent the moral/economic/cultural/political whatever values of a company/place of employment when you take up employment there. I hate it when people whine that 'they're only doing their job/what their boss tells them to'. You are part of the system, then you are part of the problem by putting up, shutting up and expecting clients/customers to. And I speak as one who has blown the whistle on cruel, corrupt, abusive psych managers and paid a heavy emotional and psychological price for it.

I spoke to an HMRC person today who, when told that their own recorded information stated that UTR numbers would be received within 14 days, told me that I was incorrect and that it stated one calendar month. I am not incorrect. It states 14 days.

We have been waiting 6 weeks for an UTR despite repeated enquiries because HMRC fucked up.

That was after 45 minutes negotiating the phone system designed to keep customers away from an overloaded organisation. And let's face it, it's hardly a big surprise to anybody deciding to take up employment in a govt/civil service organisation that it is underfunded and understaffed.

So don't work there, get stressed, call me untruthful when you clearly haven't a clue about what your own company tells it's clients and be surprised when I drop an F bomb on you.

Do not expect patience, sweetness and light when you, yourself lack these qualities.

My time is my money. I pay taxes on my earnings, I pay it on my phone bill then I pay it via your costly telephone service because only some departments accept email enquiries.

The letters are a legal requirement set out by the Tax Credits Act and must be sent out to both claimants, again a legal requirement. They must show the calculations, three guesses why. Staff have put forward multiple suggestions on this including putting it all online instead, only sending one letter or only sending letters if requested or if necessary. All suggestions in this get knocke back, legal requirement blah blah blah. The staff in the call centre didn't write the TC Act and can't change it, you'd need to write to central government about that one, writing to your MP would be the way forward.

And I still think the OP is BU. Losing your temper is not a free pass to act rudely.

YWBU and very rude.

Mig

You are aware of the recession and the global financial crisis. If you think people take these jobs so they can represent the dodgy computer system or morals of a company you are kidding yourself

Likely it doesn't go much further than 'I need a Jobso I can feed my family, there is a job, I will apply'

fair enough they have to send both me and my husband the same letter but so many times?I,m not having a go at anybody working for tax credit system just the system itsself i work for the nhs so understand how the public services like to waste money and overcomplicate thing!

Sometimes it's not a case of putting up and shutting up, it's a case of people having entirely unrealistic expectations.

Don't on the one hand ask for the civil service to deliver as cheaply as possibly, then on the other hand kick off because you get your mail from them second class.

I liken it to someone screaming the odds because after filling their trolley at the supermarket they then have to unpack and repack in order to pay.

It may seem needless but it's necessary, and no-one's extending the timescales because they enjoy the blowback.

Specifically regarding the UTR query - sometimes real-time guidance is updated to deal with real-time issues and may not immediately be reflected in recorded messages - want a better service? Pay more taxes/vote differently.

Universal apology here - I'm a bitter old soul who's been on the receiving end of one too many unearned screeching sessions, and this thread has been a bit lemon juice/papercut

You have partially misread what I said- Kayano. I said, 'do not whine about it only being my job' when people are justifiably pissed off because you are not doing it properly!

I'm not necessarily confining my anger to delays caused by back-ups from under staffing. I am talking about bloody useless unfit for the job employees, many of which exploit the sub par working conditions as an 'explanation' for their incompetence.

I am having to sort out the tax affairs of my recently deceased Father also and despite my starting off all dealings in a calm, friendly manner, I have been met with incompetence, ignorance of their own information, at times total obstructive rudeness, a total lack of empathy.

If it's a recession, why the hell are they not more concerned about the disciplinary procedures or investigations that may or may not risk their jobs when complaints such as my impending one arrive?

The message has been on there for too long for it to be an inaccurate reflection.

And believe me, this broad has never stopped trying to be part of change. I don't and never have just sat there and moaned. I believe if you are not part of the solution, then you are part of the problem.

And I work in NHS psychiatry. Tax advisors have it cushy compared to my colleagues and I.

I had an issue with tax credits recently after a change in circumstances meant I had to claim as a lone parent.

It dragged on for weeks and I was really broke. I explained to the advisor and they were able to refer me to the financial hardship dept and they sent me £50 by giro special next day delivery to help me out whilst waiting for the tax credits to come through.

Maybe this could be an option for those struggling whilst editing for tax credits to come through.