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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this person has an absolute cheek and not to pay up?

135 replies

Otheregos · 29/08/2012 13:58

Good afternoon everyone,
I am a long term lurker, but this has really bugged me so just thought I'd see what others opinions/views are

Here goes... We rent out a house,have Very nice tenants. Received a call yesterday from our tenant to say they have got an invoice for us from next door ( adjoining semi ) for the fence? Wtf? We spoke for a while and it appears our neighbours have gone ahead and ripped down our boundary fence( and the rest of theirs) and replaced it, he is now expecting £400 for this fence...way over priced, it's only about 20feet. This neighbour has had no communication with us or the tenants, the first we knew about it was from the phone call yesterday.

Been to pick up said invoice...which is actually just a typed letter no proof of purchase for the fencing..and if you've not fallen asleep yet reading this post,this is what they have written

Sir/ma'am, due to the recent bad weather and poor maintenance of the fence panels at said property, I have found it necessary to have these replaced prior to contacting you. As you are probably aware the weather has been quite bad of late. This has resulted in said fence panels for the said property which as landlord you are responsible for becoming severely damaged and a health risk due to them being at a state where they could fall down at any moment. as a father of 2 young children I felt that these needed replacing as a matter of urgency, along with my fence panels which I also replace at the same time. The total costs of replacing your fence panels are split into £250 for parts and transportation and £150 labour. The total sum that I request from you is £400 to recompensate me for the costs of having your fence panels replaced at such short notice. I would appreciate payment by cheque of bacs transfer to blah blah account. If you can settle this sooner rather than later that would be very much appreciated as this has left my finances considerably short for this month.

I'm picking now but he spelt panels pannels!

So my problems are,
A) our tenant said the fence was actually ok, we had previously about 4 months ago replaced the other side as our tenant had contacted us about it and like normal people we spoke with the neighbours ( other side) and an agreement was made to go halves and get 3 quotes...so this is what I would have expected from these people.

B) you cannot go asking for money with no proof of costs etc.its a rented house and we have to keep records like any other business

C) even if we are responsible for that boundary( not sure yet as I need to check the deeds) people can't just rip down your fence...surely this is classed as criminal damage ?

I realise I am completely rambling now, but any comments or what you think we should do most appreciated...

Thanks for reading if you've made it to the end! Smile

OP posts:
LordGiveMeStrength · 29/08/2012 14:15

YANBU

Have a look at the fence, which side has the back side of the panels? If it is the neighbours side you have absolutely no need to pay for anything.

ShiftyFades · 29/08/2012 14:16

If he is charging for his labour then ask for a copy of his Public Liability Insurance Certificate. He's obviously a registered builder and if the panels fall on someone he's liable as the workman Wink

housespouse · 29/08/2012 14:17

Legally, you do not have to pay: either it is his fence and so his cost OR it is your fence and so not his place to take it down and replace it without even attempting consultation, no matter how dangerous. Maintaining neighbourly relations however is another matter, and one never to be underestimated.

Have you ever talked to these neighbours? Are they otherwise reasonable and just panicking about their DC's safety, or might they do this kind of thing again if they get away with it once? For a first move, I would be inclined to ask for a proper VAT receipt for your records. You should specifically ask for a receipt for the "cost" of the panels from the store - he has lumped in "transportation" before adding in "labour" both of which could be dubiously inflated if he did them himself.

Incidentally, are you happy with the new fence? Has it been built in the way you would have chosen?

Keep calm and polite though at all times. Put everything in writing. Try to come to an amicable agreement.

diddl · 29/08/2012 14:17

Also, although you are the LL, doesn´t the tenant have any responsibility here?

IE-to have informed you of the damaged fence?

I really do find it hard to think what was so urgent that they had to replace without contacting you at all??!!

Could they not have done a repair at all, for example?

Tell him you´d like to see the old fence panels with a view to him putting them back!

Viviennemary · 29/08/2012 14:18

People usually ask first before they do repairs or replace jointly owned fences. So they should have done this. I'd have a look at the fence and pay what you think is reasonable.

ohforfoxsake · 29/08/2012 14:19

Similar thing happened to be. Don't pay a penny.

If it is your responsibility, or your deeds state it is shared and treated as a Party Wall, and the work actually needed doing, you need to get three quotes and agree it before any work is undertaken.

Unfortunately they are your neighbours and it is best to keep the peace (especially if you want to sell the property at some point and have to declare Andy disputes). Gather the quotes, offer to pay half of the average. Get all the receipts for what he did without your agreement.

But legally you are not required to do anything. If he takes you to small claims he will have to pay. He is in the wrong. And a twat.

NameChangeGalore · 29/08/2012 14:19

He ripped down your fence and put up a new one without telling you and expects you to pay for it? Erm, I don't think so! Tell him to jog on!

AlwaysHoldingOnToStars · 29/08/2012 14:20

YANBU! There is no way it's cost him £400, he's trying his luck and hoping to make some money out of you!

Check who owns the fence. Like a previous poster we live in a terrace and own the fence to the left.

I wouldn't pay anything without seeing receipts.

Pixieonthemoor · 29/08/2012 14:20

That's outrageous! If the fence panels were dangerous which I seriously doubt then the most this neighbour should have done was dismantle the bits in danger of causing injury before contacting you to discuss.

I do hope that it actually isn't your boundary at all and you can tell him to sling his hook. Even if it is your boundary and therefore your responsibility, going ahead and getting such expensive work done without your knowledge and consent and then expecting you to cough up is utter lunacy!

ThisIsNotHoneyDragon · 29/08/2012 14:23

If it is your boundary, invoice him for the return of your fence panals and labour for reinstating them.

If it is his, ignore him.

StuntGirl · 29/08/2012 14:23

I'd be fuming. I'd also be inclined not to pay a penny towards it, it's either his fence so he pays the costs or it's your fence and he damaged your property.

What kind of idiot forks out £400 on someone else's fence without asking then first?! If he's out of pocket it's his own bloody fault.

AmberLeaf · 29/08/2012 14:25

Didn't your tenant notice the work being done? if so why didnt they inform you at the time?

Original poster
Otheregos · 29/08/2012 14:29

I feel the art of conversation has died! Why can't people communicate! Thanks for all you swift replies.

When dh gets home from work I shall be scrambling around in the deepest darkest depths of our loft to find these sodding deeds before I write a polite but to the point letter, telling him to get fucked and perhaps as a good will gesture once I've seen any evidence of prices, pay half, as I am aware how awkward this could be for my tenants and I don't want to cause them any grief. Thanks all

OP posts:
ErikNorseman · 29/08/2012 14:31

Surely half of £400 is £200? He's asking you for the whole amount??

MadamFolly · 29/08/2012 14:31

Yanbu, cheeky fecker!

Rosa · 29/08/2012 14:35

As others have said not a chance... He could have easily said to tennants please get landlord to call me asap regatding the fence.....YANBU at all....

JennerOSity · 29/08/2012 14:37

I replaced 40 feet of fence for less than £100... OK it wasn't a top'o'the line fence but still - you can't spend your neighbours money without some form of consultation over price at the absolute least!

The wording of the letter sounds like someone trying to impress with formal language... but failing.

Who leaves their finances considerably short for the sake of a fence - unless there is a loose tiger on the other side! FFS! If they're short because of the fence they should have planned it better - no sympathy.

NewRowSees · 29/08/2012 14:37

That sounds like pretty insane behaviour, you'd be well within your rights to ignore him. However, if he is a nutter, you might want to be sure he won't retaliate. Don't want your tenants waking up with horses' heads in their beds... Hmm

NCForNow · 29/08/2012 14:37

Oh and ours is about the size of yours and it was about 100 quid! My DH installed them so that's just the panels.

Splinters · 29/08/2012 14:41

OP, you will come back and tell us whose fence it is actually and what happens in the end, won't you?

Original poster
Otheregos · 29/08/2012 14:42

Sorry, just to add, Our tenant also backs us up and said the fence didn't need replacing, he's trying to pull a fast one the cheeky get! Personally I think he wanted to replace ALL of the fence so it looked nice and thinks because we have a rental property we have money to burn ( sadly not just invested well) and I am suspicious that the £400 would probably pay for fencing his whole garden. So I'm thinking he doesn't have a leg to stand on, which is good as both dh and I are fuming, I've had to stop him going round. I do want to keep the peace but you've all helped me decide I'm not paying!

OP posts:
Original poster
Otheregos · 29/08/2012 14:46

splinters I shall keep you posted, as I'm sure this has happened to others and we may all learn from it! I've learnt my rental houses neighbour is a twat!

OP posts:
TheCraicDealer · 29/08/2012 14:48

If I wasn't concerned about retaining a neighbourly relationship I'd pop £400 of monopoly money into an envelope and drop it through the letterbox.

Or you could send a letter saying that you are currently consulting with your solicitor over liability for the fence, and in the meantime you would like an itemised invoice with a sequenced VAT number.

yesofficer · 29/08/2012 14:49

Madness. Ask to see a copy of the invoice?

Original poster
Otheregos · 29/08/2012 14:57

craicdealer great idea, pmsl, Ill get the monopoly game out of the loft while I'm up there.

OP posts:
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