AIBU in thinking the attitude of some MNers towards the grandparents is dreadful?

[janey68]

There's a thread at the moment from a mum who handed her child over to granny to be looked after for the day while she went to a wedding, and then the mum was horrified that granny had given the (faddy) child a weightwatchers petit filous when he wouldn't eat yoghurt.

Another thread is from a woman who wants PIL around on Christmas day to be with the grandkids, but doesn't want to put them up overnight so is planning to stick them in a hotel (even though her DH disagrees and she hasn't even asked the PIL yet!)

And there are regularly threads from parents who are happy to use the grandparents as unpaid childcarers so they themsleves can earn, but then complain that their child watched a bit of telly/ate a couple of sweets/slept for 10 minutes too long.

I feel that some (not all) people have a really selfish attitude. If the gps are still relatively young and active, then surely this is their time, having raised their own family, to have the freedom to travel when they want, see friends, not be restricted by being an unpaid childminder, and yes godammit, even spend christmas in their own home if they want! And if the gps are elderly and frail, then surely it goes without saying you shouldn't be expecting them to run round after toddlers and have all the worry and responsibility? (Though there have also been threads about gps in their 70s who are still being expected to revolve their lives around their adult children....)

I expect many of us on here will become gp's within the next 20 years. I am sure we won't feel any different inside. We will still have our own lives and want to make our own decisions. I'm sure I'll love any future grandchildren to bits, and enjoy spending time with them, offering babysitting now and again etc. But I hope my adult children would respect the fact that DH and me are still people and not there to simply service the needs of others.

(And before anyone jumps in saying well I cant afford to work unless granny minds the kids for nothing, we certainly weren't at all well off when our kids were small, every month was a struggle and all my income went on childcare, but I still wouldn't have expected anyone else to care for them for free. Our children, our responsibility)

well TBH I can't wait to be a granny just not yet I am looking forward to it and will be a better gp than my parents are thats another gripe, MY mil was fab sure the kids ate crap and were up late and tired when I got them back but they were happy at grandmas they miss her

When my children were small I never 'expected' my parents to look after my children. They were lovely parents and very willing and when the children went to them it was because they offered and enjoyed their company. As for moaning when they spoilt the children a bit - that's what grandparents are for. There is a different but equally special bond between GPs and GCs than the bond they have with parents. It isn't going to kill your precious child - for example - if they provide an alternative to yoghurt on the odd occasion.

If you want your child brought up precisely in the way you do (I'm speaking generally not at any one poster) and GPs are minding on a more than occasional basis then pay a professional to do it.

I worked full time, but would never have imposed my children on their GPs, who had already brought up their own family and also worked bloody hard in times that were a hell of a lot more difficult than those today i.e. the war and post war period.

OK, I admit some GPs are a PITA, in which case that is even more of an argument not to get them involved. Why would you?

I wish my parents and in-laws were still around to enjoy the fruits of their hard-earned labours. Sadly, only one lived long enough to do that.

I don't expect my view to be popular, but as a GP myself my children have the same attitude as me and would never expect me to be a childminder, though I am always happy to help out. Nor do they leave me instructions: they trust me to be competent. After all, most GPs have brought all you posters up and you are still here to tell the tale aren't you?

So thanks OP for raising the issue, as the GP-bashing threads have really irritated me.

I don't expect my views to be popular but, just as some mums needed to rant about GPs, I reserve my right to rant about ungrateful kids.

Some of us see children as a joy and want to take any stress or strain off our family members, who we love (yes, really some of us love our families).

birds, please don't suggest that those who see it differently love their families any less.

My parents couldn't adore my DD more. I'm happy they have a relationship with her. But neither I nor my parents believe that they have a responsibility to provide for her, or to help me out as an adult parent myself. Anything they do for or give to us is just that, a gift. They don't feel as though they have a 'claim' to DD (and I know this explicitly because I have had conversations with them about this topic, based on things in the news etc.).

Likewise, they respect that I have made certain decisions about her upbringing, which might be different from their own choices, and they try to adhere to those. If they found something too difficult or objectionable to do, they'd let me know. After all, they're not obligated to do anything, but they also have no right to do exactly as they please.

There is no lack of love. Just a lot of respect.

YANBU!

My MIL takes care of ds 1 day a week, and my DM has him 2 days a week. They both also babysit him at random other times. Without them, I couldnt work and therefore earn a living for us.

Sure, sometimes MIL lets ds sit in his nappy for too long, and sometimes my DM doesnt persevere with getting him down for his nap - so what?! I owe them both so much, and ds LOVES them, they have such a loving close relationship with him.

I'm firmly in the 'grandparents rock' camp :)

Yep some people do treat their kids grandparents appallingly but I doubt there is any more of them than the entitled grandparents who are equally as awful to their offsrping and their spouses.

Its life - some people are shits and some people are on the receiving end of shit!

if i did read your op correctly then YANBU

if gp's provide you with regular free childcare then stop bitching, if they do something anyone would know is wrong then change the childcare.

however i do think that if it is regular childcare then the gp's may be a bit silly if they also use that time as spoil rotten time but then again if they do just change the arangement.

i do subscribe to the 'they are my children' school of thought because they are (along with the other parent involved) but that means they are totally mine and his responsability i do not expect gp's to provide me with anything at all. if i disagree with how they treat/behave with my children then i will change the time they spend with them. i expect to be responsable for my parents when they are frail, they ceased to be responsable for me when i turned 16 and left home.

i also dont subscribe to the whole lets be in and out of each others houses and do everything/most things togather thing that some people have going on with there families or lets see each other every week,but thats just the way our family are.

if you rely on gp's for support with money/childcare then be decent about it and dont complain.

if gp's are shite dont depend on them but bitch as much as you like.

I know 2 people who have recently found out that their Mum has cancer and their primary concern was who will provide the free childcare now? Sorry but if you have children and want/need to go to work/college then you should have considered this and made provision for it prior to getting pregnant. Relying on family members to provide free care for your children is selfish IMO. I can think of nothing worse than being in my 50s/60s or God forbid 70s and being responsible for babies.

eeerrrmmm I would think that gp's looking after their dgc actually do it as they want to - I doubt that there's some illegal gp slave trade going on - and it is natural in any family for issues to arise as the dynamic changes with gp and their now adult child relationship coupled with the dgc themselves.

Add in to the mix -all these gps and parents are just people - some are lovely, some a bit eccentric, some are total pricks - each with their own idea of how the world works- also consider that the parents of your partner will have (usually) a v different way of doing things which are potentially v differerent to the dil/sonIL which is another cause of issues in this relationship.

I don't think it's just current generations either as the mil jokes issues have been documented for years and years.

Another point is that both parents working is still relatively new as the norm - the financial climate at the moment requires it in many cases where previously - even 1970's -80's many more mothers stayed at home till the children started school.

I don't get free childcare, have a lovely relationship with my parents and will be more than happy to provide a more supporting role to them as they move into their old age - and won't be charging for geriatric care as that's what you do in a loving family -help each other out.

janey68 - I was referring to people who had worked and contributed. Most of the people I know worked for the governement in some form or another. As I'm sure you've heard about the pension furore, people have been paying in and then taking out a blimin lot too. They say workers today won't have the pensions of our parents. I see it as the golden age of pensions atm - generations before never had it so good. Neither will future ones. I live in France where retirees have profited in the past from the favourable euro etc. Now they complain poverty...er, hello? They are living in properties worth 300k+ euros (and they are selling at the right price btw).

"As for swanning around spending the inheritance.... err, it's their money" course it is. They have zero obligation to do anything other than what they want with it. My mum spends hers on catalogue clothes and makeup (has the spare room full to the ceiling of unopened boxes). They can do that. Doesn't stop me being pissed off when they do so...or feeling that they 'ought' to be sparing an afternoon a week to bbsit. I suppose I see it as a great big fingers up at the younger generation and saying 'let them struggle like we did'.

YABU. You are cherry picking threads which you feel suit your argument. Seen the one where a GP has endangered the life of a preemie triplet by exposing it to chicken pox: knowingly, deliberately and without telling the mother?

(justhadenough, if you're here - happy to see on your thread that DT1 is improving )

Or how about another ongoing thread where a landlord MIL is trying to emotionally blackmail a MNetter into staying in a house which almost certainly has an unsafe boiler?

there are regularly threads from parents who are happy to use the grandparents as unpaid childcarers so they themsleves can earn, but then complain that their child watched a bit of telly/ate a couple of sweets/slept for 10 minutes too long. - That's just melodramatic. And ignoring the fact that some GPs want to be involved. For example, my DM is already begging to join in childcare and I'm only 14 weeks pg.

I'm sure there are a minority of MNers who take advantage of GPs by most objective opinions, but your posts appear to simultaneously disapprove of GPs who are involved in childcare, and to disapprove of MNers who haven't had the same experience you have.

Yabu cause it's normally only complaints about the paternal grand parents and they don't really count

mayorquimby - oh yes that's so true about paternal gps

BTW I did write in my OP some parents. I am very aware that a lot of parents aren't selfish and don't view the gps as there to service their needs

brdgrl yy to your post. Why do some posters respond with a sacastic 'Well some of us love our grandchildren...

No lack of love here at all - I love my parents enormously, but also respect the fact that they are still their own people with their own lives to live, and not put on this earth for my convenience.

This isn't about the love that you have for your parents, but the love that GP's have for their GC.

I can think of nothing worse than being in my 50s/60s or God forbid 70s and being responsible for babies

I doubt that you will be looking after babies in your 70's.

My mum was still having my teens to stay, in her late 70's, she is now 84, it was a two way relationship, they needed someone to be in the house with them, she needed someone to run up and down stars, put her Christams decorations up, take curtains down, all of the manual stuff etc.

My mum was a looly pop lady until 80, some of us don't want to stop,or do traditionally what you are supposed tobecause you are 'retired'.

She enjoyed the company, she lives in a three bed house on her own, most of her friends have passed away.

I am thinking more about my health, since finding out about becoming a nan.

There are a lot of positives in family life that continues until death.

The assumption in your thread has been that posters will be GP's in 20 years, for some of us this is happening now and we cannot wait for thie 'burden' to start.

I have a leg in both camps.

I get annoyed when people who have tons of free no strings child care complain about the giving of Haribo or a slightly late night etc. Me and DH get NO child care help whatsoever and haven't been out alone together since 2011, so I do get jealous and bitter when people say " although GPs had the DCS for the whole weekend, they didn't give them organic food" etc Therefore YANBU

HOWEVER, re: the thread where the OP wants to the GPs to stay in a paid for hotel 5 mins walk away, I totally understand. When we have house guests I am in the kitchen so much waiting on everybody that I end up totally left out and not even being with the kids. I am an unpaid skivvy and DH has to remind his family to thank me as they leave otherwise they don't bother. Therefore YABU.

As much as I should respect and love and spoil the GPs, it works both ways and I am not the unpaid help. Or am I?

Also- Grrrr- when people suggest that not having them to stay means we don't love them enough!

oh and looking after v elderly parents is a lot less joyous than gc and often done while juggling full time work and children

I agree with birds.Im looking forward to looking after my grandchildren in my 50s 60s and 70s.I cant think of anything I would rather do.

Birds is the one from a normal loving family on here.Thats what most rl grandparents are like.The ones you here on here that havent ever got time for the gcs or dont look after them properly are the strange ones to me.

I didn't realise there was one blueprint for a 'normal loving family' .......

If you would rather be doing something that is lovely and full in a good way and you dont think looking after your own grandchildren is that then yes personally I dont think that is loving.I would never feel like that about my own grandkids tbh.

Well I can't wait to be a grandma but I would understand if the house was full and DH ("Gramps") and I had to have a nice peaceful hotel when visiting.

I nor my parents believe that they have a responsibility to provide for her,

I work in child protection and i have never quite 'got' that, although i do not judge as such.

I don't know how you cannot view your child's child as a part of yourself also.

The 'claim' would come on the death of a parent (or removal of child) and i suppose with me being older and my family not being from the UK, i can remember a time/stories about when more women would die in childbirth.

I do wonder at families that do not struggle financially and are 'functioning', that leave the children of close relatives in foster care, tbh.

Just to add, i suppose there is a difference of working class and middle class families.

Traditionally (before tax credits) many working class people would need the help of family, to be able to put food on the table, in the way of childcare.

That is what i don't understand, why you would not want your family members to have a good standard of living, rather than struggle, by helping, as well as the relationship that comes via that.

I am surprised on here how many grandparents have no interest in their grandchildren, that was a horrible shock on those threads.

The thread about staying in a hotel is a red herring in your argument, as the IL's don't do childcare whatosever, it's about what happens during their brief Christmas visit (paying for a hotel is generous IMO).

Apart from that, I am slightly in agreement, when you give your child to someone else to care from, even a childminder, they do things slightly differently. I disagree CM's do everything just as you like it, ours used to be quite firm when I was a bit wussy, feed them ok food but not gourmet and so on. My mum cared for my two much more similarly to me, but of course she had to make up her own mind about how to handle day to day events. But, if you live/work alongside family members, they will get on your nerves and you will get on theirs, there are probably 100s of threads on Gransnet all moaning about how we look after their precious grandchildren!

I agree with you birds.People here stay close to each other and look after their old and young because they want to and love each other its not some awful burden.