I got road raged today, was I in the wrong?

[VivaLeBeaver]

I'm waiting to come out the supermarket carpark onto a fairly busy road. In the left hand turn lane and indicating left. A woman on a cycle with a kid on a tag along tried undertaking me. Managed to shove between my car and the pavement but couldn't get any further then level with me due to the nose of my car been a bit further to the left. Now I thought undertaking in this manner as a cyclist is dangerous if to illegal. I think she thought when the car infront of me moved I'd let her in - well I didn't I carried on,in a slow and safe manner. I was in no danger of hitting her at all but I did make her stop. As far as I was concerned she could wait her turn rather than trying to undertake a car which is clearly turning left.

So I'm now on the road, the cyclist and her cyclist husband are following. I come to amino roundabout, fairly big one for a mini roundabout and went right round it so I was double backed on myself. Fairly standard I'd have thought to save trying to turn right out the supermarket. Enough room and I was indicating.

As I went round the roundabout the bloke cyclist swore at me and told me I needed to have a P on me. I assume he means a P plate rather than a golden shower.

I know I could have let them undertake me and push infront but I don't have to. She's lucky to be honest I saw her. I think a lot of cars wouldn't and she and her kid could have been squished. Strangely he seemed more annoyed at me going all the way round the roundabout. That's not wrong is it?

YANBU. It sounds like she was riding dangerously by trying to edge past you. It's a good job you spotted her. The P comment might have been a reference to the fact that you obviously wanted to turn right out of the supermarket but if the road was really busy it was probably the sensible thing to do. It doesn't sound terribly ragey anyway. Forget about it.

How can "two narrow road lanes" NOT provide enough room for a car and a cyclist? Perhaps the clue to the whole incident now is that you say you were angled over - I guess you mean you were angled over two lanes, and the cyclist was in the inside, fondly imagining that one lane would be enough for you. Did you by any chance originally intend to make that right turn and only change your mind about turning left after your nose was out into the junction? That would have been most confusing to others.

I can sadly believe that WithoutCaution (apt name) was told that by a driving instructor. I had a learner driver overtake me on my bike whilst we were both going over a speed bump and through a pinch point. When I (very politely) spoke to her at the next set of lights, the driving instructor told me she had told the learner to do it, as there was plenty of room. Apparently it did not matter that I had had to slam on my brakes as clearly I had enough room to avoid her.

Ok,this is why I was asking. Next time I'll pull over and let her through. It would have put me in a crap position for turning left as I'd probably have then ended up swinging into the wrong side of the road as I turned. But I guess it's better to be safe than sorry if she felt she couldn't wait.

Undertaking a lorry in traffic is dangerous. Moving up to the front of stationery traffic should not be dangerous - unless entitled drivers make it so. I'm sorry Viva I think you were wrong here and you should have allowed them more space. It seems like you got hung up on this pushing in thing.

:-) Very well said Viva

and northern lurker puts it all so much better than I do.

You did deliberately block her. You saw she was trying to get past, you had the option to move a little to your right to allow her to do so, you chose instead to continue to go left so she couldn't come past.

No, hadn't been intending to turn fit at all. The other lane was full of cars waiting to turn right. So there are two narrow lanes both full of traffic.

I'm in the left hand lane sat behind a car which is much further over to the left than I am. So she certainly couldn't have got past that one. I'm sat right behind this car with my nose slightly further over to the left than the back of my car. She managed to get halfway down the side of my car and then couldn't get any further.

When the car infront of me moved I carried on along the same pathway I was already in, first making sure that she was still stationary and not moving off with me. My other choice would have been to straighten up/pull to the right, wait to let her pass and pull out. Wait a bit longer for a gap in the traffic and then when I did make the left turn to not be at a good angle at a tight junction to make it. So I'd probably have had to have waited for a gap in the traffic both ways.

Whereas she could just have waited behind me which is what I'd have done.

Well I'd have classified deliberately blocking her as moving to the left to prevent her coming through which I didn't. But ok, next time I will move out the way.

I often edge ahead to the left of queuing traffic when cycling - most of the roads round here have advance stop boxes to enourage this. I thought cyclists were encouraged to go ahead of cars on a junction? They are in my area of London.

However, I wouldn't bother pushing ahead if there wasn't space and if I have DS on the back, i try and keep very clear of traffic turning - but then I also expect them to give me a lot of space - and to be fair, most of them do. I don't cycle to the left of lorries in particular at junctions.

I can't really see what either of you did wrong here and therefore why you were angry with each other?

Thistledew - Having had entitled cyclists scratch my car trying to fit through a far too small gap I fully agree with my old driving instructor in that a lot of cyclists do not know have to be safe on the road. By preventing them from squeezing past me I am reducing the risk of further damage to my car or them being hit by people who may not have seen them

It can be very tricky driving with cyclists. Most are great but you get the odd ones thats are so angry and seem to think you should change everything for them. I do try to help them when I can but, I also read the road.

So for example the other I was driving into my town centre in a 30mph. There was a cyclist trying to turn right coming the other way. As I approached him I realised I could let him go or I could continue and make him wait to turn right. So I checked my mirror and there were no cars behind me, so for the sake of a couple of seconds once I had passed I knew he could turn right and so I didn't let him go.

As I drove past he was clearly very upset that no cars had let him go shouting "fucking dickheads" as I passed him. I then had to try and explain when my 3 year old asked me what a "fucking dickhead" was! Nice!

YABU. You seem very hung up on "who got there first" whereas what matters is giving way to a much more vulnerable road user. Oh and doing a U turn on a mini roundabout is not very safe either.

So just to be clear, cyclists need LOOOOOADS of room, except when they decide that they want to get in front of a car instead of waiting an extra 30 seconds and staying in a queue of traffic, in which instance they can squeeze through a gap smaller than the one between my arsecheeks, and car drivers just have to suck it up if their paintwork gets scratched, because, yunno, it's perfectly reasonable to NEED TO BE AT THE FRONT OF THE QUEUE!

Just checking. Viva, I wouldn't have moved for her either. Other cars can wait behind me, so can bikes.

I wasn't angry until he called me a fucking cunt and told me I needed a p on me.

I do find it hard to believe that the road you were turning into was so narrow that you could not have turned within the white lines with your car at a right angle to the road you are joining.

WithoutCaution, I would squeeze past you regardless of your actions - trying to pointlessly prevent me just makes it even more likely your car would get scraped .

Drives me nuts when car drivers do this - what utterly pointless point are they trying to prove?

Withoutcaution I am speechless. I seriously hope that when your children start cycling on the roads, drivers are rather more considerate for their wellbeing and safety and don't try to deliberately block them going past, whether or not the driver genuinely believes that to be in their own interests as you seem to suggest

Like I said I cycle. I wouldn't try to squeeze down the inside of a car which is indicating left, I'd wait behind it. But maybe I'm an over cautious cyclist. I certainly wouldn't expect a car which has already started to swing left to then swing right to make room for me.

Rule 188 last part

Thistledew, it ain't London. Believe me the roads in coastal Norfolk towns are narrow.

Highway Code:
188
Mini-roundabouts. Approach these in the same way as normal roundabouts. All vehicles MUST pass round the central markings except large vehicles which are physically incapable of doing so. Remember, there is less space to manoeuvre and less time to signal. Avoid making U-turns at mini-roundabouts. Beware of others doing this.

Well I don't want my car damaging or to have to be a witness in an accident when a cyclist sneaks up the side of another car. That was a day that I'll never forget

My Dc will be told to wait behind cars in traffic unless it is safe to do otherwise

Snap thistle

I think YABU, cyclists are safer at the front and it wouldn't have hurt you to let her through.