To think £31500 pa is less than average wage?

[Elderwand]

That's it, I work as a nurse in the Nhs, I'm 33. , just thought at this stage of my life I would be earning more. (unhappy & bitter) have 2 young DD, So career change at the mo would be difficult.

And hahahhahahaaaaa to 'raking in the benefits' at 15k.

Yep, I saw lots of those.

Yeah Stetson, you lucky bugger with your tenner. Bet you had enough for new tvs and forrin holidays every year!

Yellowcoat, I don't discount the fact that "loads of graduates take jobs in pubs etc." that's my whole point. Those are not graduate jobs for the purposes of calculating the average graduate starting salaries. Ok, if you want a really wide meaningless view of what graduates earn, you include everything; but for most people attending uni the point is to get a job which pays some kind of premium for their learning, the so called "graduate job".

If 30K was too high a figure for you I will revise down to 28K. Happy? It's somewhere around there in the SE for graduate job. There's plenty of evidence of this on the internet if you bother to look it up. As others have pointed out a salary at that level doesn't even buy much after tax and commuting.

I too graduated in 2005 and dont know anybody around my age (apart from DH) on over 30k!

These are people in their late 20's who have 6 years of work under their belt too. These are graduate jobs in IT, health, accounting, fashion design etc and some in jobs are based in central London.

Yes I know that is only antedontal evidence but 30k plus doesnt ring true with me.

Even doctors start at about 25k as SHO dont they? (Im not in medicine but its just what somebody told me)

I see where richteas is coming from - all the surveys say that those graduates who are in graduate level full time jobs 6 months after graduation are earning on average £23K-£25K (depending on survey used) - sorry £28K is still too high.....

BUT only 46% of graduates - a minority of those who graduate actually GET graduate level full time jobs within a year of graduation. These are the ONLY ones quoted in that average.

Therefore MOST graduates are on less, some of course due to statistical averages being the way they are will be on more - and some come outside the statistics all together - the 9% unemployed in any capacity, the 4 % doing voluntary or internship work, and the 1-2% self employed.

Overall 70% of graduates gained full time employment after graduating in 2010/11 - so 24% were employed full time in NON graduate roles, the remainder were part time or mentioned in the above paragraph.

Statistics can be argued any which way you want them to be....

Richteas seriously, go and look on the graduate page of the Guardian job website (I know how you love a good old broadsheet) and tell me how many graduate jobs pay £30000. Get back to me when you've found them.

Richtea a lot of graduates who got the choice gold-dust jobs worked there for FREE for ages before being paid maybe 15K to start after ages of voluntry work experience (even after being selected and recommended as the best of the graduating year!)

greenplastictrees I never said that being on 30000 meant you had no financial pressures.

But at the end of the day, people who are on 15k also need somewhere to live.

So I'm not sure what your point is.

and those positions and voluntary positions were "graduate" positions

I get paid more in my non graduate job that I've done since graduation (that doesn't require my degree) - I can't AFFORD to do the graduate jobs my class mates are doing as I have a family and a home to run

Why is everyone getting so arsey about what an average graduate salary is these days?! Does it matter?

My first graduate job was as a recruitment consultant in 2000 and the starting salary was £25k and bonuses easily added another £40k. I don't earn so much now (as a lawyer), but graduate salaries for lawyers at City and West End firms are certainly over £30k. Like anything else, talk of "average graduate salaries" is meaningless. If you're a graduate trainee midwife you're going to earn a lot less than a graduate trainee lawyer/banker/accountant. Surely this is not news to people?

The number of people I know in London who worked for 6 - 18 months for free as an intern before getting a job is staggering. It's probably 50% of the people I know. Yeah, they get a good job out of it at the end of the day, but for so many people it's simply not an option.

Peppin, if it doesn't matter, why are you talking about it?

"Duellingfanjo I didn't mean to be snippy" hey there, it's ok. Me neither.
Recently discovered that my DH is losing his job leaving us (Hopefully temporarily) on my less than the national average job. Though I know we are still much better off than many people and now we are going to below the threshold for some benefits but I would rather not be in this position.

Incidentally - as a graduate my first wage was something like £11,000. I have been working for 20 years and have only managed to just over double that salary and I count myself lucky.

I just checked in on the thread yellowraincoat, and was surprised by how nasty people were being to each other about something so... uncontroversial. I don't have a view on what "average" should be, other than that "average" seems to be no indicator of anything much. Surprised people are so hot under the collar about it,

Maybe it's because people care about it? You don't have to care, but some people do.

My point is: what is the point of caring about this? It is what it is. It's like caring about the national average height of people. It's just a meaningless number that - as this thread has demonstrated - bears little or no resemblance to most people's actual salaries.

It all sounds to me a lot more like a lot of resentment and justification of what individuals are paid, what they should be paid, and why anyone earning a lot more shouldn't be. Bit of a waste of energy.

Ok, so don't comment if you think it's a waste of time or energy.

well the OP is about nurses being worse off than the average graduates, which people either agree or disagree with! I don't understand what you don't get about this thread?

Noone is saying it is the biggest issue in the world but it is interesting to see other people's perceptions of what other graduates from other disciplines are doing/get

as a nursing graduate I was WAY better off than I am now as a graduate again after a career change, and friends who stayed in nursing and worked up are in the better off half of my friends, the "poor nurses" thing is a myth IMO

yellowcoat I am entitled to comment on the fact that I think it's a bit of a waste of time people here being nasty to each other over something so nothingy.

Have fun hectoring the thread - you sound like a playground bully.

Sure, you're entitled to comment, but also we are entitled to comment on stuff we find interesting.

Bemused by the playground bully thing, but I guess some people just can't resist getting into slinging personal insults.

You weren't commenting, though, you were instructing me not to.

Like I said, have fun with it! I have better things to do.

I wasn't instructing you to do anything. I said that if you find it a waste of time, don't do it.

But of course, you're not reading this, cos you have better things to do.

The OP is about nurses being worse off than the average graduates, which people either agree or disagree with!

It's not really a question of agreeing or disagreeing though, is it?

You can't agree or disagree that 5 is larger than 4. It just is. All you can agree or disagree on is what constitutes an "average graduate".

The OP asks if she is being unreasonable to think £31,500 pa is less than the average wage. It's not a question of reasonableness, it's a question of being right or wrong on a numerical question.

but everyone is defining it differently

the average city grad job
the average "graduate job" nationally
the average wage of graduates (not the same as average graduate job as I am a graduate working in a non graduate job)
the average wage overall

there's loads of ways of looking at it and there isn't going to be one perfect statistic, there will be lots of different studies interpreted and reported a certain way to make a certain point

Nurses are better off IMO than your average uni grad. If you narrow that group down you will find groups that are much better off than nurses, but overall nurses have it pretty all right wage wise IMO

lots of interesting stuff on this thread, some of which is human nature -

whatever you have, you'll use it, some people will always want more..

statistics can be mucked about with to back most points of view.

and ignoring the fact the OP agreed swbu many pages ago!

i think a study found people earning £50k total were happiest, though obv there are some that can feel well provided for on next to nothing and some who won't be content with several millions...

if you are one who is readily contented you are more likely to feel you are doing well (obviously) whatever life throws at you.

After DH being unemployed a long time- yes, we do take home more with a job - £100pw more. if he'd got the same job in London he'd be working and taking home nothing/ less net income in effect..due to commuting costs.....so although benefits not a great way to live, it is important to recognise the costs of work....and look at net income and of course this can vary greatly from the 'headline' salary figure.

i found BoffinMums list enlightening - i have worked in Retail (where 'fairness' means all employees get the same tough deal) and for SMEs (where benefits depend entirely on the CEOs opinion of what is important) and in banking (better than retail, though nowhere near as good as BMs list!) and public sector suppliers (generally good deal)....the private sector is not homogenous, and large parts only deliver statutory minimums of anything (and of course, if you are self-employed, perhaps not even that!).