To wonder what Black athletes have....

[CrispyCod]

......that make them so superior in performance. It has to be genetic. I am in awe of them as they appear to glide effortlessly around the track. The Jamaican athletes are just wow! Their speed is just amazing.

My post was to illustrate.

Anyway, it was a sensible discussion, as ever, it took a ridiculous turn.

Yes, I do. I have had to listen to ignorance for years.

There is still a difference between the old lady who pats your hand kindly and says "we treat everyone the same, you know" and the bloke who sits next to you in the pub and tells you how they don't like black people and then goes on to tell you that they're ok when they're little kids though

There's a difference between the guy in the pub who, when told where you're from, says oh, I know someone from and someone who puts your window through.

I've sat at a gathering and had nobody talk to me. Nobody at all. A bunch of women just sat there glaring at me and then had a small child take hold of my hand and turn it, looking at the front and the back and back to the front again.

There's a difference between ignorance and racism.

That is not to say that ignorance is a wonderful thing that you really really enjoy and it's brilliant - but it is different from racism. Racism is out and out hate.

creighton, i think you make a really interesting point about the same trainer and training environment. I questioned whether team mates stuck together in races yesterday. So you tended to see two runners from the same country together througout the race - i didn't know if that was a tactic or not, one being a pace maker or something?

Apologies - didn't see creightons initial comment. That said, as a WASP person I understand that I am fortunate enough to have been born with many, many advantages denied to others because of their colour or where they happened to be born. This puts a responsibility on me to be EXTRA fair, iykwim.

Racism should be discussed not swept under the mat.

Nurse second part was directed at the creighton.

Sorry for mistake Nurse on phone difficult to type.

I'm going to skip over some of the comments on reversing black /white in a sentence etc as I have nothing useful to add.

I assumed that one of the reasons that some sports seem to be more dominated by one ethnic group than others was cultural and down to the sporting icons you identify with. If you grew up watching Coe, Cram and Ovett you might want to be a middle distance runner. If your hero was Carl Lewis you might go for athletics. If you are a young black man looking for sporting heroes you might identify more with Usain Bolt than Michael Phelps. There are excellent Indian and Pakistani cricketers because that sport is very important in parts of the Indian subcontinent.

creighton Sun 05-Aug-12 09:36:18
''maybe we don't swim well because our big black arses weigh us down in the water. they don't weigh us down on land though.''

this first sentence was sarcasm in response to the big nostrils, heavy bones, twitchy fibres and assorted bullshit posted by others

''are you whites enjoying yourselves?''

well, are you? the never ending stream of offensive ignorance that is posted, without thought, is amazing. you are not ashamed of yourselves at all, white people seem to swan through life without having to analyse or think before they open their mouths. where is the logic in any of the comments here?

it's amazing how quickly you move on the keyboard when a black person questions you. do you have fast twitch fibres in your fingers?

''SoleSource Sun 05-Aug-12 10:14:20
Are you blacks enjoying yourselves on this thread?''

i don't know if there are any other blacks on this thread so i can't speak for them. it is always interesting to read these threads to remind myself that 'equal opps' and such stuff is just skin deep (a bit of a pun!) in this society. i shouldn't be so surprised that white people get riled when their motives are questioned when discussing 'black issues'

My child is dual heritage. I am white I know it upsets people regardless of their skin colour.

Can I just add that most ethnic groups are not as homogeneous as people seem to be suggesting. My DH is North African and the variety of heights and builds just in his (huge) family is marked. He and 2 brothers are tall and broad, 1 is tall and thin, 1 is short and thin and 2 are short and stocky. One or two of his nephews have the classic long distance runner type of build (quite short and slender) but DH is built more like a swimmer or sprinter (tall, broad shoulders). So who is the typical North African athlete?

Hecate you make a good point.

I quoted my FIL (the 'large pores' comment) as an illustration of great ignorance. He is not a racist man by any stretch of the imagination.
The point of my comment was that there is a lot of interest in the genetic/altitude/physical differences that make athletes of different races appear to excel in different sports.

I have no idea how this is turning into a racist thread!

So creighton are you saying there is no such thing as fast and slow twitch muscle fibres ?

white people seem to swan through life without having to analyse or think before they open their mouths

See I don't like this and I don't think you'd be much impressed if someone on here said something so sweeping and unpleasant about black people creighton. There has been some ignorant remarks made on this thread, yes, but adding your own to the mix doesn't help anything, it just causes the whole thing to descend even further into some sort of childish bun-fight.

''My child's Father whom is Black and an ex athlete told me that.''

solesource, if black people are sprinters, they do not need big nostrils as sprinting is done anaerobically, i.e. no breathing or not much breathing is done in the 10 seconds needed to win the sprint. if black people with big nostrils were long distance runners there would be an obvious advantage to their big noses.

To the poster upthread who said they'd never seen a black swimmer.

Team USA have Cullen Jones who won one gold and two silvers, and Lia Neal who won bronze at this Olympics!

white people seem to swan through life without having to analyse or think before they open their mouths.

I would say Whites have to think several times because every bugger wants to be mortally offended about anything. Usually on behalf of everyone else.

Christ, if we did a thread on something innocuous like fluffy kittens, the cat haters would come out and moan they kill the bird population.

I've only ever heard the phrase 'Black don't crack' from black friends and used as a positive comment.

Hecate I know you have the example of the child looking at your hand to demonstrate ignorance rather than racism - did it offend you? Would you have preferred her to ask you about the skin tones on your hand rather than just pick it up and look? Genuinely curious. (I had chemo a few years ago and was amazed by the comments I got within earshot of how I 'shouldn't be allowed out without a wig' but never minded children asking why I was bald.)

Really interesting thread.

I think (and I am sure I was taught this at university) that Science tells us that the Caucasian race are a mutation of the Black race. So in theory, the original humans were black, and then through inter-breeding a mutation occurred which resulted in a white person being born. Maybe this mutation causes white people/brown people to be less able to run fast?

I'm thinking back in the dinosaur age humans must have been able to run pretty fast to get away from predators.

Men are also mutations...it seems one of the X chromosomes has a bit chopped off resulting in men's XY chromosome.

Creigton I feel sorry for you.

I'd always wondered why the USA don't produce black swimmers.

Then I heard a very sad bit about the death toll for hurricane Katerina.

They said there is no tradition of learning to swim in poor black areas, no facilities and encouragement. It simply wasn't seen as something they learn.

Almost all the DCs round here could swim by Y1. My two are total fish. They all learnt before they realised water was scary.

DD has several friends who swim pretty seriously, they started going several times a week from Y4.

By the time a big strong black teen meets a pool at high school or college, I suspect it's too late.

I would say Whites have to think several times because every bugger wants to be mortally offended about anything

^^ That's just as bad!!!

Fuxake. I'm black. I think some posters have been naive in repeating various racist stereotypes they've heard from others regarding black people and perhaps underestimated the effect that hearing shit like this, even in an 'oh my uncle is a right tit, this is what he says' way, has on people who come into contact with wankers like this every day. It can start to piss you off and you lose some perspective. I find it hard to laugh at racist old men and how 'ridiculous' they are because their ignorance and others like it impacts on my life.

I also think that making sweeping generalisations like 'white people don't think' and 'whites think more than anyone because every bugger wants to be offended' are really hurtful. I don't put you in a box so don't do it to me.

Nah, I thought it was sweet. She was only toddy and genuinely curious. She was looking at my hand like it was the best thing she'd ever seen

Now the woman sitting half turned away from me and looking down their noses at me like I was shit and had no right to be there - that offended me!

moominsarescary, where did i say that?

rainydays, that's so funny.

StarBallBunny Cullen Jones, the swimmer I mentioned in my last post is very much involved in encouraging swimming in the African-American community.