Young teens, strings & pubic depilation

[tsunami]

My eldest daughter is just 14 and I've found a lacy string in her room and now a big wad of pubic hair in her shower: suspect we're talking a close shave, and I dread to think how much she's taken off. I don't think there's a (serious) boy in the picture or if this is just peer-pressurised body-angst, but - while I'm no saint and have been around the block myself in my time - I really hate this current pole-dancer/porn shaved pussy trend. Call me a square (and maybe a hypocrite as I do wax up to my bikini line - sorry; TMI but I'm hoping we're all girls together in here - or can at least tolerate girl talk) I think total pubic baldness is unreconstructed pandering to male fantasy... IMO even Brazilians and landing strips are inappropriate for young teens. Still trying to cope with the string (yes, this is my first daughter, and she's growing up, so maybe I have to get used to it. We've had the high heels conversation, the provocative dressing and the make-up one...is this just the next step?)

I find it gutting that such young girls fall for this kind of stuff. OK - once you're older then it's your business, but kids need boundaries and should we and can we draw the line? Given the images they can get access to online - which they can and do, no matter what precautions you try to put in place at home - I'm not surprised they feel under pressure. Yes, I have looked - half the porn girls are bald; most have breast implants. Call me old fashioned, but - yeeuch.

I would've died if my mum had ever discussed my depilation issues with me. I can just see it: 'Darling...about your pubes...' 'Yeah, Mum, whatever: bog off.' You can't! Maybe I just tell her I don't think she should leave big clods of pubic hair in the plughole from a hygiene and self-respect POV.

What do I do? Do I do nothing, and leave it? It's her body...AIBU even to think of getting involved?

Good question Lastnerve.

I'd treat it the same way I treat the convos that I feel it's my duty to have with my son about things like porn, and consent.

ie. It's not great, but we do it, he's listening, and I'm as

By 'we do it' I mean, we get thru the convo.
Not 'hey ds porn's a consumer choice'.

How do they come up though Lindsay ?

Like 'hey you been watching porn?' how would you bring it up.

I just can't imagine how you would bring it up without being cringeworthy at best and creepy at worst.

I have a son I'll need to do this one day.

Laughing my head off here at the thought we should be shocked or disgusted by the sight of a stray pubic hair escaping from a swimsuit! How on earth did normal bodies become so scary to people? When I was young, we were pleased when we saw our first pubic hair. It meant that we were growing up. And it would never have occurred to us to shave or wax. In fact I had never heard of such things until I joined MN.

Yes, I must be old, but it is really funny that old ladies like me are not turned off by normal bodily functions. Can't imagine going through the pain and discomfort of shaving and waxing. Not enough time to waste either.

He's ten. I know that other friends' kids have deffo seen extreme porn already, via mobile phones or being at a friend's house whose parents can't be arsed to have paretnal controls.

So I had to explain why we're so uptight about parental controls, and very roughly about porn: sex is lovely, we all do it, it's brill. Seeing pictures of it can also be exciting - problem is that the way it's done right now is pretty sexist (he knows this concept) and doesn't show what sex is really like. Also sometimes the people wouldn't have chosen to do it if they weren't in difficult situations. Maybe this will change in the future. In the meantime, it can look quite upsetting and I don't want you to be upset; atually sex isn't upsetting, it's really lovely.

I bloody wished I didn't have to , but I did. He nodded, and moved on but not in that "lalalala I can;t hear you" way that we all know. At a later point I'll go into more depth on the 'pretty sexist' bit.

AnyFucker says sthg like 'funny how the OP never came back' - H'm...yes, sorry. She was indeed at the orthodontist but since she's been busy, finishing stuff, going on holiday, winding up work, kids off school, builders coming in (not as in 'painters and decorators'/euphemism for the curse/period/mess that matts up your pubes if you're 'disgusting' enough to have any...)

Brilliant thread. I love the feminism/patriarchy rallies, am depressed by some of the attitudes out there (as for the effin spelling - jeez), but hey - that's why I posted. I wanted to know what women are thinking, and we got that. Had some belly laughs in the 'butt out'/'keep your nose out' etc posts which then ramble on, offering advice,doing everything BUT butting out.

Oh, yes, a 'string' is worldspeak for what I gather you call a 'G-string' in the UK. Is that rocket science - ?

Anyway, the point in my story is, I haven't spoken to my DD, haven't told her what to do, haven't embarrassed her: we are bouncing ideas about here. Brainstorming. Pubestorming. But my bottom line (before I get on a plane to a place where the bikini line will be on show, possibly even my unenhanced, 44-year-old breasts, OMG) is that any girl on the cusp of adulthood and not yet independent is allowed to be worried about by her parent. I agree with the poster who said that a lot of today's problems come from people who don't get involved enough - amen to that. It doesn't mean telling them what to do. It just means caring, maybe talking about stuff, and looking out for them.

As for the sharpwit who said: 'You have an odd turn of phrase OP. Like the nun that used to run our secondary school.
Weird thrad.', I can only say - until you've had a glimpse under my cassock you ain't seen NOTHIN'.

here's to you, OP

I think that's exactly what I would lindsaywagner, seems like the best most honest way to deal with the situation.
I am very interested to know how ruby thinks that feminism has nothing to do with rape? As a feminist, I feel freedom from sexual abuse is one of the underpins of feminism. I thought this was widely known too. I know not many people are feminists but most ppl would agree that freedom from rape is what feminists are fighting for.

Yes, to you OP. Have lovely hols.

This has actually been really intresting reading.I'm not quite sure how we got to some of the subjects but all the same intresting.
Op glad you got back I was concerned that the orthadontist had kidnapped you.

Would it be tmi to disclose that I have breast implants but haven't been arsed to shave my legs since mid April.

What I really want to know from the hygiene and swimming costume camp is why, ifbthose are the rqsons, donyou take it all off?

And for those who wonder how you talk about this to a 14 year old, surely it's just part of an ongoing conversation? You don't just start talking ahout removing pubic hair from a standing start at 14. You will by then have already talked about leg hair, underarm hair....and you will have already talked about how women are perceived in the media, air brushing, how models body shapes are not actually achievable by most women, how the commercial world works by inventing an issue then selling a solution to it, how advertisers prey on women's insecrutis about their bodies...

"What I really want to know from the hygiene and swimming costume camp is why, ifbthose are the rqsons, donyou take it all off?"

God, typo hell!

"What I really want to know from the hygiene and swimming costume camp is why, if those are the reasons, do you take it all off?"

seeker i took it all off by accident one time, was trying to get everything neater and even and sadly it was a bit like when you cut your fringe without a mirror, in my defense i was wankered, for some reason i was trying to do it with actual clippers and i did have my left foot in a plant pot at the time.

I take it all off, its become habit.

^In what way does feminism have nothing to do with rape ruby?
It is one of the main aims of feminism to stop sexual abuse so that makes no sense^

Feminism isn't going to stop rape. You do know that? The same as stopping shaving ones pubes isn't going to stop it.

As a feminist, I can't believe you are pushing your views onto other women. You're telling them what they should and shouldn't do instead of letting them have a choice. Isn't that one of the main things of feminism, for women to be able to make choices for ourselves?

why we want to shave is here nor there. It might be a social norm, so what? It's also a social norm to use a knife and fork whilst eating but no-ones complaining about that.

And again I'd like to ask you to apply your logic to men, how come they arent repressed in your eyes then? I know my fella would probably have a Gandalf beard if I wasn't for me.

with all due respect rape is a crime therefore it should be an issue for every member of the comunity every single one.

its also a power and control issue its about dominating and harming not just about gratification,pornography,shaven muffs,nail varnish or any other thing has nothing to do with it its not soley a crime relating to females there are fairly high incidents of hetrosexual men commiting it against other men. its unacceptable criminal behaviour commited by criminals
whilst it may very well be an issue that feminists may wish to raise awareness about, but it is not a feminist issue, to make it such or claim it as such gives it the potential to be invalidated as a community issue.shit like that is why some people dont take it seriously

Good post socknicking

It's an issue for each and every person, we are all fighting rape crime. It would seen I'm almost advocating rape by shaving my own fanny in krumbum and pals eyes

I think these people should be focusing their attention elsewhere. My bestfriend was raped when she was 15, it never went to court because she was told 'the case isn't strong enough'. How it wasn't strong enough I'll never know because even if she had been willing she was still only 15. Thinks like this need changing. We can't stop people from raping people, we can make it easier for those who have been victim.

This is derailing slightly we are talking about bald fannies not rape cases...

This debate is getting away from the issue of shaving to wider feminist campaigning readers may (or may not) agree with. I'm interested by why women feel the need to shave.

It IS uncomfortable to say the least, even if one gets used to it. The hygiene argument is surely ridiculous. And given that someone said on here that 70/80's porn was all about hairy muffs, the hairs on our muff is surely just part of trends that go in and out of fashion.

I don't buy into the radfem interpretation that the patriarchy is seeking to keep us down in our place. I agree upthread with the consumerist analysis. It's all about selling us shit we don't want and never needed. Why is it suddenly de rigeur to shower three times a day (men and women)? Wear padded bras (I can never find a normal, non-padded bra anymore)? Whiten our teeth (men and women)? Have hair extensions? Get a sun-bed tan (men and women)? The list is endless and one that applies just as much to teenage girls and boys as to "informed" adults.

Why is no one challenging this? I live OS and I'm shocked more and more eveytime I return to visit family. UK men and women are drones. They are all suppressed by the the power of advertising and no longer have individual/original tastes or desires.

Yes, bald fannies is true but, the message that seems to be coming from the 'feminist' camp is that by having a bald fanny you are not supporting feminism and therefore by default you are aiding in the continuation of rape.

I had come back to say I have never associated feminism with rape I believe rape is a person against person crime, individual against individual, aggressor against victim, man on women, man on man, adult on child whatever that it is not typically a sexually driven act it is about power and control but generally is related to issues within the individual rapist, and as it involves all should be the concern of all and not hijacked by people to push their own agendas.

I would still like the points I made about tattoos, gaming and breastfeeding answered as well as wondering what the feminists are doing to push their feminist agenda other than not shaving their fannies? Also if they do things like get their haircut?

Also I would like to know what the solutions are for overthrowing the patriarchy or gaining their ideals, I can't believe that the method is solely dependant on putting aside make-up and growing out your bush.

I guess feminism initally came into the equation as for a long time, women victims were told 'you had it coming' or were met with general disbelief. As always, there is an historical aspect.

Feminist issues are wide and varied, like the feminists themselves. The bfing bit is a french fem obsession. One many anglosax fems are not so bothered about, though I'm sure the fem lobby will inform you better on this and answer your other questions.

LeBFG that is just a silly thing to say that UK people are drones that have no individuality. Frankly that is offensive.

Just my observation imnotmymum - sorry if that offends you.

It ok just a massive sweeping generalisation that all

Why rape is a feminist issue:
www.awc.org.nz/userfiles/16_1152582920.pdf

And I'm not telling women what to do, I'm explaining how choice is compromised in a patriarchical society. Once one has awareness of this they are much freer to make an informed choice...
I have already explained this if you read back.