To ask if you are or have been the parent of a bully...

[Tootiredtosleep]

My DD was singled out and excluded for most of Year 3 by one girl. This girl is a born ring leader and easily manipulates the other children. DD withdrew on the basis that not being involved with the group of girls was a better option than being picked on, excluded etc.

She had quite a miserable year. We made several trips into the school. The child was spoken to, the parents were spoken to etc. things would always get better for a while then revert to the norm of excluding DD. As an adult I could see that this child was jealous. She also had a much stronger personality and by excluding DD, made life a lot nicer for herself.

Anyway, I digress. Things are gradually getting better and DD is settling down a bit.

I often think that whilst hard for me to witness and distressing for DD, how must it feel to be on the other side? It's all well and good having the school on your side and all saying great things about your DD. What is it like, however, on the other side? This girls parents are nice people. They seem like very caring parents. They never apologised for their DD's behaviour. Do you go into denial and think it must not be true or blown out of proportion?

Would love to hear it from the other side?

Have name changed and changed some details.

Thanks for your comments Sarge
Unfortunately the biggest bully I know is the Head of a local school. They pick on staff they don't like, ask parents of SEN children to remove their children, and go off with stress when they don't get their own way. And the Governors don't do anything for some of the reasons Sarge has given - they would rather be "in" with the Head than risk the Head taking it out on their child. Sadly I have heard of other schools where this is the case, so clearly some bullying children grow up to be bullying adults. The best we can do is to try to stamp it out in childhood, which is why I was so determined to make sure that my DS knew what he was doing was wrong.

Have been in HerMajesty's situation and remember well that sinking feeling and the subsequent relief.

Have also been in the situation outlined by jandy. Funnily enough, this was a school that dealt very well with any bullying perpetrated by the children. Perhaps there was only room for one bully...

I wish that schools would educate children as to why bullies are bullies. It is often something lacking in their lives (or that is how they see it) which they are angry about (my non-professional view) and take it out on someone who either has what they want eg is v pretty or is a quiet natured person who won't fight back.
I think there is something in their family dynamic which is feeding this need to bully.
Anyway, telling all children that bullies bully because of a lack of something in their lives or just pure envy would make them seem more vulnerable imo and maybe less scary. In other words a bit of education in human psychology would go a long way.

My friend is currently going through a long drawn out divorce from a man who she describes as a bully. Naturally she is very absorbed in this emotional drama and her children (young teens) are suffering as you would expect.

Her DS is manifesting his distress with bad behaviour at school and at home, including bullying. The school has said to both parents in a very caring way that he is bullying and that they think the problems with the divorce are the cause.

Her response is a) deny the bullying and b) say that the victim should grow a pair. She has spoken to the victim's parents with the sole purpose of making them understand that their child is over reacting and her son has difficulties too. Needless to say the other parents, quite rightly, are having none of it, so now she's angry instead of conciliatory.

As a result, she's not taking proper action in respect of either her son's behaviour or his own distress and she's not recognising that to an extent his behaviour is learned. I have seen him treat her just like his father treats her and she does nothing about it.

The causes are complex and lead to misery all round. As the parent of a child who was bullied throughout his school career, I think schools should take a much more robust stand and step in where parents can't or won't take appropriate action. I tried to use my own DS's experience to inform my friend, but she was frightened and upset and really unable to do what needed to be done.

Reading poor Verity's post I wondered if her daughter could be held back a year.
Much less chance of bullying then as she would be one of the bigger girls.
My son went back a year after moving from one part of the country to the other and just thrived. Not that he disliked his existing school but he was just so laid back at the new school, and also hit on some lovely class mates that he jelled with which was pure chance but great for him.

carabos I am not surprised that child has turned out to be a bully if he has learnt his behaviour at home from his own father!

MY dd has been the victim of meaness and bullies and i know a few of the parents and they are really lovely people and I'm sure they would be horrified if they knew how mean and nasty their daughters are

, DD2 is in high school and the same little girl has been nasty to her and a few others since primary.
I am not sure if the mum has been in to school or anything but I am sure she wouldn.t stand for it , DD can handle herself although some of the meaness does get get her down but she won't say anything to teachers and avoids the girl , Most parents don't bring children up to be mean and nasty and its a powerthing children develop . school is a blood minefield .

I think there is also a secondary issue in that children now are very aware that "bully" is a good shout to get parents in to complain and get another child into trouble.

If I think about dd1's year there's one child who has regularly accused children of bullying. No evidence has ever been seen, and often the stories are so ridiculous to be silly. But her parents believe every word from her and storm into school demanding things are done. After a few months she gets bored with that child and moves onto another child. This has happened since reception and she's now in year 6.

Another child I know if she has a falling out with another child, the shout of bully rings out from their house. I'm not sure if this child tells her dm lies, or her dm reckons on getting in first before her child is accused. Dd1 commented on one occasion that it was generally 6 of 1, half a dozen of another when this happened, but I do know this child can be seriously nasty including physically, knowing that her dm will always take her side and rush into school to complain.

I've also heard accusations of bullying over silly things, like a form vote not going the way their child wanted, two children accidently bumping into each other, 3 children wanting to sit next to the same child (obviously they can't all manage it) and other things that are upsets but not bullying.

With regard to the bullies themselves often being the subjects of emotional trauma or other difficulties, I think that this depends on the nature of the bullying.

Ds was the subject of over 4 years sustained bullying at his school (before we moved him). He has been described by other parents as "individual", "not like other children" and "a bit odd". He was assessed by an Ed Psych so we could work out if there was an underlying issue and the consensus was that he is a profoundly gifted child with no understanding of the motivations of his peers. I say this as it explains what happened.

There was one child in a higher year who subject ds to physical abuse from the day he started school. This child does have a difficult background and needs of his own. I do feel for the parents of this child and for the child himself. They do have a difficult time and are pariahs. However, because his abuse was easy to spot and deal with it has not really emotionally traumatised either ds or the wider family. Ds can understand that the other child has issues which are nothing to do with him and could take steps to try and avoid him.

There was also a group of highly popular children in ds's own year who isolated him, tormented him, hurt him and blamed him for things that he did not do. These children have no identifiable problems, they were simply acting as a mob. Their parents either did not know or care enough to intervene. I do not think that either the parents or the children suffered as a result of their actions. By contrast, ds sobs himself to sleep many nights and has problems sleeping. He has gone from a super confident child to a much more introspective child. I have isolated myself from them and as I live in a small community this has been hard. They have in every sense of the word broken my heart and come close to destroying my family whilst they continue to laugh and have fun. I think they have the better end of the deal.

The one thing that really makes a difference in all the above cases ime is if the school has a good policy of encouraging children to tell if anyone (they themselves or anybody else) is being bullied, of training staff in how to handle bullying and of enforcing their own rules. Dc have been fortunate enough to attend three such schools- it makes a massive difference. And by the time they all got to secondary, it made a massive difference that they all had been trained in how to handle bullying since Reception; there are all these kids looking out for each other and knowing where the boundaries are.