to love my 4x4

[holidaysarenice]

And to not have to justify it to anyone!!

Pringles please?

I don't think anyone has talked about driving in the country being a problem. The ones I am referring to are the ones I see parked on my road in a small city and the same ones that do the school run everyday and generally block the view and road and take up more than one parking space.

I have just seen a huge 4x4 on a street near me that doesn't actually fit between the white parking lines on the narrow road where I live.

very sorry bigjo l thought you were referring to me.

By way of an apology I will let you adopt my little saying 'Reverse in, drive out , it's the way forward !' and shout it out your car window as you sail past the struggling reverser - cos I'd love too but havent got the bottle

So your 4x4 is supersafe and bombproof. If you are in an accident you will be fine. But what about the poor sod you hit?

I have just seen a huge 4x4 on a street near me that doesn't actually fit between the white parking lines on the narrow road where I live.

But how is that the drivers fault? I understand where you are coming from but unless they were driving like a complete cock you can't complain.

I'm pretty sure you get plenty of small cars driving down your narrow road way over the speed limit??

Yes I know they havent hello but was just saying why I still feel safer in mine despite the statistics.[stubborn]

Well according to lots of people on here, its not the size of the car that is important, its the NCAP rating. So the size of my car shouldn't matter. Just reversing the logic.

Just to counter the inevitable argument, the car I drive has the same passenger NCAP rating as an average saloon.

The closest accidenst I've had in the past 2 years have been:

• someone overtaking a car coming in the opposite direction to me, so that I've had to brake suddenly to avoid an accident, I came to just about a full stop whilst the car cut in, in front of the car it overtook. I was doing about 60 on an A road when I had to stop.
• someone not checking their mirror whilst changing lanes on a motorway slip road, I had to serve to avoid the car by going onto the hard shoulder.

Each time I had my three children in the car, and I was shaking for quite a while afterwards. None of these near misses had anything to do with anyone being in a 4x4 but I thank god I was in Volvo.

CargoTrike

Actually, 4x4s are much more likely to have rollover accidents than normal cars.

There's not a very high incidence of rollovers, but when it happens it tends to cause very serious injuries / fatalities.

(I've been reading the EU and US safety assessments).

Recent 4x4s have electronic systems which help avoid too much body roll - and they help avoid rollovers - but they don't avoid the 'tripped rollover', which is where the tyre hit the kerb sideways and the vehicle is flipped over and rolls.

So a 5-star 'traditional' car might actually be safer than a much higher-bodied 4x4.

Also not many 4x4s are actually 5-star rated for occupant safety - it's only the Volvos and the VS Touareg, I think. The discovery 3 is not as good as it should be.

I'd consider the Volvo XC90 because it's got what's effectively a roll-bar in the roof - if it does roll then the roof shouldn't buckle.

The XC90 and similar models are also kinder on any pedestrians you might happen to hit - the bonnet is lower and more curved, whereas with the more traditional straight-up-and-down 4x4 front end, a pedestrian is likely to get a broken hip and then maybe go under the car.

Apart from rollovers, blind spots are the other big safety issue for 4x4s. There's a pretty high incidence of "Honey I Reversed Over The Kids". Sensors, good mirrors and reversing cameras can help with this to some extent.

bigjoeent "its not the size of the car that is important, its the NCAP rating"

NCAP ratings are only comparable within the class of car.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro_NCAP#Comparing_test_results

In a crash between a light vehicle and a heavy one, the light one will always come off worst (ceteris paribus).

www.euroncap.com/Content-Web-Page/0f3bec79-828b-4e0c-8030-9fa8314ff342/comparable-cars.aspx

"In real life, when two cars collide the vehicle with the higher mass has an advantage over the lighter one. Generally speaking, vehicles with higher structures tend to fare better in accidents than those with lower structures. Therefore, ratings are comparable only between cars of similar mass and with broadly similar structures. "

Toaster24, I stand corrected. But thank you for the defence of the XC90.

So when the arsehole who overtakes when there isn't enough space does actually hit me, we will hopefully be more protected.

Apart from rollovers, blind spots are the other big safety issue for 4x4s. There's a pretty high incidence of "Honey I Reversed Over The Kids"

God point.

Those buying them to keep their children 'safe' perhaps haven't thought that the child pedestrian most likely to get injured by the family vehicle is their own child.

The poor visibility at lower level combined with the unforgiving shape of these vehicles seems like a perfect storm.

The current Range Rover was described as "Dire" in pedestrian safety terms by NCAP. (One star)

Two cars or two vehicles can only collide if at least one of them is in the wrong place. Driver error causes that.

I've just thought of an antidote to all the complaints about 4x4s taking up too much of the parking space/taking up two spaces.

Anyone else ever driven round and bloody round looking for that elusive parking space swearing like a trooper then remembering the kids in the back only to spot one and just as you're turning into it you see this squat little car already parked in it - or the front half of the space more like - which you couldnt see from the road. Grrrrrrr.

So annoying. Shall I start a thread ?

My DH is a fireman, has been for over 20 years.

He's been to a fair few road accidents in that time - obviously these are the more serious ones not just little bumps so I admit it's not the same as insurance claims figures

But In all those years he's never once been to a serious accident involving a 4x4, never, not happened.

Bloody selfish small car drivers - there said it !

bigjoeent yeah, as far as I can see the XC90 is about the safest car - for the occupants - on the market. Which is a surprise as the platform is quite old.

It's difficult to compare SUVs/4x4s with traditional saloon/estate cars because the risks are different.

rollovers are 2% of crashes but 35% of road deaths (US figures for 2010)
www.safercar.gov/Vehicle+Shoppers/Rollover/Fatalities

I think ideally (from the point of view of the occupants) you want a SUV-weight but non-SUV-styling 5-star-NCAP car - but there aren't any.

ComposHat

yeah, backover deaths of children are a really big problem

edition.cnn.com/2005/AUTOS/tipsandadvice/11/03/backover/

although reversing visibility of non-SUV cars is pretty shit too, in a lot of cases

www.themotorreport.com.au/44287/family-cars-offer-poor-rear-visibility-nrma

• the solution is a reversing camera.

A head on with a lorry?? sounds horrific but if you're wanting us to believe that a modern car would have saved her then I'm assuming the collision wasn't at any great speed as I'm sorry if that's not the case please do show me any car that comes off best in a high speed collision with a lorry?

A lot of people seem to think they are invincible when they get in their car & this is really not the case.

Another interesting link

www.iihs.org/brochures/pdf/sfsc.pdf

"Electronic stability control lowers the risk of a fatal
single-vehicle crash by about half. It lowers the risk of a fatal
rollover crash by as much as 80 percent."

"Small, light vehicles generally
offer less protection than larger, heavier ones."

The graph on page 2 shows that SUVs have a higher rate of driver deaths (per million vehicles) than cars, at any weight except for the very smallest SUVs.

(that's US data).

sorry, I meant 'occupant deaths' not 'driver deaths'.

Anyone else ever driven round and bloody round looking for that elusive parking space swearing like a trooper then remembering the kids in the back only to spot one and just as you're turning into it you see this squat little car already parked in it - or the front half of the space more like - which you couldnt see from the road. Grrrrrrr

And because I have a (beautiful!) squat car I don't pay road tax & probably paid half the money you did to fuel up.

Life sucks sometimes, eh!

Kenneddie, it was probably less than half.

Seriously, in a couple of years I will probably swap cars, I could never have a squat car, until the kids leave home at least (aah I am getting a sports car then), its still going to be have to be pretty big. And it will be a Volv.

I don't think I'm invincible in one, far from it, but they are some of the safest cars around.

keneddie

Is your car a smart one then?

Genuine question, what exactly can you fit In one of those?

A friend has one - a sporty version - and by her own admission she can fit fuck all apart from herself into it and even then she struggles. She says it was the worst thing she ever bought and she can't sell it on.

She's ended up having to SORN it and invest in another larger car (she bought a freelander as it happens)

No not a smart.

We had a Smart years ago, we fitted a huge Lurcher and a Jack Russell in the back easily.