to think this woman has no need to apologise for ending her mat leave when she chooses

[lecce]

I am a teacher and am getting seriously pissed off with the comments from my colleagues about a teacher who has been off for about a year and is coming back to work a week before the six-week holiday. She is doing this, I assume because 5 years ago I did the same, because you are not allowed to say you are returning to work during the 6-week break (because you can't really go back) but if your entitlment runs out during that time you face a few weeks with no pay at all.

I assume that this woman, like me, cannot afford the few weeks with no money coming in but wants to maximise the time she can have off. People I work with are saying what a "nerve" she has etc but surely she is doing what is right for her and her family and is not cheating anyone? After all, it's not her fault that this is how the dates have worked out and that there is a 6-week holiday at this time, is it?

I don't really know why I'm so bothered (except I do because several of the people who go on about it were here when I did more or less the same, so I assume they talked about me in the same nasty way they talk about her but have now forgotten my circs) but it depresses so much that people (and women in particular) are so bitchy about each other and quick to believe the worst.

Novack, I'm sure you're not really stupid.

INSET days actually have been taken from holidays. Before INSET, we worked the same amount of days but got more holiday.

Are you just cross because you are confusing education with a babysitting service?

I am doing exactly this in four week's time! I will be doing activities with small groups of children from all the classes. I don't think my head was exactly thrilled but said "I'd be encouraging my daughter to do the same if she was in your position.". We were just lucky with the dates, it wasn't planned that way but I'm making the most of it. DD will only be seven months when I go back for a week and a half but closer to nine when September rolls around. Why wouldn't I do exactly this? For the record, I'm pretty sure I could declare my start date as the first day of the summer holidays and get paid through the summer without going back at all but I want to get a bit of practice in with nice days before I have to go back to teaching full time and all the planning and marking that comes with it in September.

Loopy be as obtuse as you like we both know that you could do your inset days during half terms Easter, Summer Christmas etc but some arrange them for random Thursdays or Fridays during the term just to be more inconvenient.

But if a teacher was taken on on a short contract basis to cover a maternity leave (rather than supply) wouldn't they lose the summer pay if the teacher they replaced came back? Just wondering. Not suggesting of course that it would be the fault of the teacher returning from leave.

Mary supply staff don't get holiday pay so no impact that way.

We DO do our INSET days in the holidays, thanks very much. That's where they came from in the first place.

Personally a) I'd rather not do them at all b) I'd rather not have to organise childcare when my kids' school does it c) the LA don't consult me when booking my, or my children's teachers' INSET.

Abolish 'em & give me those 5 days' holiday back, would be my vote.

Novack the teachers cannot be compelled to come during the dates the school is closed to students, i.e. term dates. Like most people they book holidays in advance, so if schools want everyone in for INSET, then that's when it's going to happen. They actually can't be made to work Saturdays or Sundays, either.

DO keep up. You say Loopy is being obtuse, but you're the one not reading the facts of the thread. The teachers don't set the dates for INSET they mostly don't get a say in the content, either. Nearly all the INSET I've every attended on one of the days has been utter utter shite.

And the reason INSET days could not be on the first Saturday of half term is? But sadly this if off the op an will cause undue thread creep . Point is you are unreasonable with the random INSET days off as ravenak says even she has trouble with her local education authority setting different days so maybe abolish them if you are all up to speed enough although the last the public probably think teachers need are more holidays I suspect.

echt Could teachers not easily be compelled to do all their INSET days in a week before Michaelmas term begins if they are necessary and you'd all know that you return one week earlier than the pupils.

Mary, you are correct. I've done a few maternity covers and you would normally be on contract so you get half terms paid as well as days off sick. However, the pay stops as soon as the post holder returns so you do miss out on the holiday pay. You could in effect work Sept to mid July and then not get paid during the summer holidays. That is how it works though and I certainly never blamed teachers for coming back just before the holidays.

Makes no odds to me, but unworkable because external trainers aren't grotto Santas.

They spread their bookings over the year.

Ah, perhaps i was wrong before. No about the INSET though. Or the babysitting.

It's what we all do isn't it? I'm doing it and was actually advised by our business manager to come back 4 days before the hols to ensure that the person covering me also gets paid for the hols. Your colleagues sound lovely

And the allowance for teachers is considerably less than that offered by many private companies employing people (women) with comparable qualifications to teachers

Are you referring to the amount of maternity pay? Am I right in thinking that teachers get 6 months full pay and then 6 months half pay (was told this today by an ex teacher so might be wrong). That is considerably more than most private sector companies would off. I am professionally qualified and have an MBA and work for a plc,, and I get only statutory pay ie 6 weeks @90% then £135 per week. It seems odd to me that government sets a statutory maternity framework for everyone to use, but then significantly enhances this for its own employees (teachers, NHS workers, civil servants). Oh and I get 30 days annual leave not 13 weeks.

oops only read op really, can see the conversation has moved on

no ceevee, that is wrong. 6 weeks full pay. 6 months is civil servants.

actually advised by our business manager to come back 4 days before the hols to ensure that the person covering me also gets paid for the hols

And you wonder why there was no money left after labour left office?

Suggesting that there may be a better way to organise your annual timetable is nor deranged. If you think trying to get you to think of a way to work smarter not harder is deranged then I'm afraid that perhaps you lot deserve Govey.

And as I say if you really cared about cuts perhaps if you had demonstrated during the summer hols I´d take you seriously rather than just think you voted yourselves a day off come autumn.

Mrsdevere sounds like an excellent example but sadly so few public sectors workers have her ethic to work.

Novack the schools often have speakers, who would not be available all at the same time. Having the days scattered throughout the year means the school can be more responsive to the later compulsory drivel to come from the government. You wouldn't expect a business to have all its important meetings in one week a year, would you?

And no, teachers can to be compelled to work when the school is closed.

If you're so miffed about those INSET days, you should reserve your ire for the way they are used; so often entirely useless. Think Brain Gym. Think Learning styles.

Am I right in thinking that teachers get 6 months full pay and then 6 months half pay (was told this today by an ex teacher so might be wrong)

I most definitely did not get this or even nearly this!! I got two weeks at full pay! I believe (or have been led to believe) that maternity pay as a teacher differs from LA to LA.

Can not be compelled.

I think Novack should go to our next one instead of me.

It'd give her something to moan about, & I can definitely use the time better.