NHS funded IVF for same-sex couples.

[oopsi]

Further to the other thread, how do we justify same sax couples getting IVF treatment on the NHS?
This is not infertility, so nothing is medically 'wrong'.Should the NHS be funding it?

fund IVF for people who don't want to have heterosexual sex

You have mentioned this "not wanting" heterosexual sex a few times now - I guess you know nothing about sexuality then as its not a case of not wanting heterosexual sex like you dont want a strawberry ice cream for example, but simply how you are born.

"please can someone tell me what nhs funded services resources should be diverted from, to pay for this?"

cancer treatment.

HIV drugs.

Heart disease.

what do you want us to say? None of these things should be neglected but what you seem to be missing is that most people have answered telling you that they believe IVF should be funded for those who need it alongside all other treatments on the NHS.

oopsi - as a single woman with no fertility issues, I was not eligible for any treatment on the NHS. HTH

Wilson- i said all fertility procedures including artificial insemination.

Not in your OP you didn't - you've changed what you "mean" to try and cover your massive homophobia up. You homophobe.

please can someone tell me what nhs funded services resources should be diverted from, to pay for this?

What a massive pile of wank (geddit) this statement is. And as this will undoubtedly be deleted:

Your homophobic attitude disgusts me.

You are most definitely homophobic oopsi. As your post on the 'openly gay superhero' thread shows.

Homophobic views belong in the arc, its quite discusting that we still have people of this earth with such prejudice views!!

i hate the way oopsi is hiding behind the internet....answer the question 1. do you work/or are you on benefit when you are able to work.

1. do you know alcoholics and drug addicts been treated on the nhs.....

see single oopsi.................the world is moving on,,,so back off gay people as am almost sure you are seeking attention. get yourself a boyfriend for sex as that is more your point

it's so easy for oopsi, with her/his four kids, to make judgements about other people's fertility and body rights. Of course if you are super fertile and have never experienced infertility issues you can wander round life making judgements about other people's need for fertility treatment or about adoption. That's what oopsi is doing and what plenty of people without empathy do all the time. Shame that she/he is also being homophobic on top of it.

I am not homophobic at all, how do you come to that conclusion?

Assuming this is due to fertility problems rather than the lack of a penis, then I don't have a problem.

Although would this be if only one partner has fertility issues or both? Part of me wonders whether it would be wrong to offer it if the other partner is capable of conceiving a child.

For me its the lack of understanding about homosexuality and the obvious disapproval of gay people having children, disguised as something else.

I am not homophobic at all, how do you come to that conclusion?

Your obviousl disapproval of people who are not straight getting help to conceive children - see your OP
Your refusal to believe that sexual 'norms' include gay sex -see posts where you've referred to people 'just not wanting' to have heterosexual sex.
Your use of the word 'they' throughout to denote gay people.

Your tone, and your refusal to change your thinking or show that you're hearing the points of view of almost everyone else on this thread I just put down to pig-headishness, though. HTH.

*refusal to believe that sexual 'norms' include gay sex -see posts where you've referred to people 'just not wanting' to have heterosexual sex.
*

being gay isn't 'the norm'

As far as I know gay people don't want to have heterosexual sex.That is the only thing that sets them apart from heterosexuals isn't it.f that's not the case then I would be pleased to be enlightened

oopsi please define "the norm" in terms of sexual preference. Down to position, number of partners over a lifetime, genders of people involved, and so on.

'norms' oopsi-what is with this whole thing about 'normal' what would you define as 'normal'?

Do you mean 'the norm' in relation to having sex with a view for reproduction or sex for pleasure? Because perhaps that is what is making this argument so circular.

As far as I know gay people don't want to have heterosexual sex.That is the only thing that sets them apart from heterosexuals isn't it

It's not a case of don't want to, like it's a choice, like I choose not to have bum sex.

It's a case of being sexually attracted to the same sex, and probably physically unable to have sex with the opposite sex (I only mention this as someone I know tried for ages to be heterosexual and deny his gayness but it physically wouldn't happen with a woman iyswim). Therefore it's as natural as me wanting sex with my DH.

Interesting you should say what you did just then, Cowbag - I am catching up with a friend in a couple of weeks I haven't seen in ages. He is now happily coupled up with his DP and has been for over a decade. However, prior to this he was in denial, dated women and even went as far as to get engaged in order to 'conform'.

Aye, notgeoff, obviously I know it's not the case for every gay/lesbian that they are physically unable to "perform", but I believe it can cause significant problems such as no sex or very rare sex when in a hetero relationship.

My friend even went to the doctor to get him to check for physical problems .

Being gay most certainly is the norm for gay people. It's their norm, and it's normal. You disagree, which in my book means I don't have anything further to say to you on this subject oopsi.

Although would this be if only one partner has fertility issues or both? Part of me wonders whether it would be wrong to offer it if the other partner is capable of conceiving a child.

My question too. Only if both IMO.

Oh no! Somebody take the egg back off these penguins

oopsi Wed 23-May-12 09:55:55
No. I just don't think it should be funded by the NHS as there is nothing wrong with them mentally or physically.

That'd be why WHO recognise infertility as a 'medical problem' then.

Just to remind you and point out your utter hypocrisy and U-turn; your first post said "Further to the other thread, how do we justify same sax couples getting IVF treatment on the NHS? This is not infertility, so nothing is medically 'wrong'.Should the NHS be funding it?" before saying you weren't homophobic.

Well why are you commenting on same sex couples and not any other group that might be considered by the changes? And why are you still very conveniently managing to ignore every single person who has pointed out that those lesbians seeking fertility treatment and IVF do so, because they have FERTILITY issues.

Perhaps if you read the thread you created to DISCUSS the subject, rather than to tell everyone how all these lesbians are taking away treatment from the 'poor more deserving causes' you'd learn something.

Perhaps you would also like to read the NICE draft before spouting off like you somehow know more than the medical professionals who wrote it.

I would first of all refer you to the entire section 4.3 entitled Psychological effects of fertility problems. Bit of a clue here about there being mental health issues associated with infertility.

This is just one quote from the section:
In one study, the psychological symptoms of anxiety and depression associated with infertility were found to be similar to those associated with other serious medical conditions such as heart disease, cancer, hypertension and infection with HIV. A study in Sweden reported that almost 50% of women said they needed professional help and support to deal with their anxiety and problems in their marital relationship two years after tubal reconstructive surgery.

I have to say Oopsi, you are doing a very very good job of making yourself look very closeminded and ignorant purely by not bothering to read responses and continuing to insist that there is no medical issue here.

Some free advice. Go away and educate yourself before you make yourself look even more stupid.

Of course being gay is the norm, just as being straight is the norm too. Just because something is in the minority doesn't make it abnormal. People with auburn hair or over 6 foot tall are in the minority, but are just as normal as everyone else!

NotGeoffVader Thanks for finding the penguin article. It made me smile.

God bless those penguins and all other homesexual families in the world.