to think that the keeping of dogs for domestic purposes should be banned.

[AKMD]

That?s it really. I am sick to death of having to watch my feet to make sure I don?t accidentally tread in dog muck left to steam by some selfish, lazy dog owner. I resent not being able to take 2yo DS to the park directly opposite my house because it?s used as a dog exercise ground and you can?t play toddler football without the ball and toddler falling into said dog muck. I hate that every time we go to the slightly nicer park there?s at least one dog without a lead who decides to come and sniff DS and that while he backs away the owner stands there laughing that ?he?s only being friendly?. I loathe and detest the particularly ?friendly? dogs who lick DS while I drag him away, probably just after eating another dog?s poo or a dead rat or some other disgusting thing they just found. I have personally seen the scars left on a young child by a ?friendly? dog turning savage and ripping the toddler?s cheek off. The problem of people getting bored of their dogs and dumping them in rescue centres is sickening. The stories of dogs being bred to fight, being neglected, being bred for ?beauty? despite the ?beautiful? characteristics causing the animals pain and suffering are beyond belief.

IMO domestic dog owners as a general class have proved that they are irresponsible and selfish. Fear of treading in dog poo on a pavement or in a park is common to everyone and I am so, so sick of people blaming it on a tiny minority. Domestic dog owners can?t be trusted to be responsible so they shouldn?t have them, end of. People should only be allowed to keep dogs for working purposes ? guide dogs, sniffer dogs, police dogs, sheep dogs etc. - if they are licensed.

AIBU?

^What kind of crazy person throws away a perfectly good kebab anyway?!

YABU. Not all dog owners are like that.

What you said in your OP (not read any more) is as unfair as saying that because of the amount of child abuse in the news all parents should be banned.

Or all muslims are terrorists.

Or all journalists listen to answerphone messages they shouldn't.

That's the trouble with generalisations. They're often wrong.

OP YABU but automatic custodial sentences for dog fouling would be fine by me.

I live in a nice area but there is nonetheless plenty of poo on our pavements - usually rows of parked cars/ in quiet side streets where people think they won't be seen if they don't bother picking it up

God knows, Easily, but the Seagulls certainly don't eat them so maybe they are not that good

Picnic rubbish annoys me too. And eejits who sit in the middle of the off leash area and get out their picnic blanket and then start huffing and puffing when they are swopped upon by hoardes of labradors. We have one tiny section, they have a whole park and yet they still sit in the dog area

But GrahamTribe it is very unclear from your posts what it is you do want.

On the face of it you and I seem to be not so very far apart.

You said:

"I've loads, so many that I'd be here for hours, AKMD, so I won't bore you but for a start I'd like legislation to ensure that every council has sufficient FT dog wardens, to be charged with the carrying out of a multitude of tasks - welfare, environmental health related and others - and not just someone who has another job altogether but who is called on to pick up stray dogs as and when necessary. I'd also legislate to ensure that these dog wardens were in-house and not contractors as ime in-house wardens tend to care more about the community which they represent."

But that is exactly what I have been proposing but with the added step of introducing a license fee to fund it yet of that idea you seem to think:

"It. Just. Isn't. Workable."

Maybe my back of the envelope figures don't cover it but obviously I am not sitting here with a white papare on the subject, detailed research findings or even any particular expertise in the field. It was just a suggestion inprinciple.

And I struggle to see how it is so very different from the legislation you youself said you would like.

So - are you or are you not in favour of dog wardens? Their remit being not just to impose the rules but to try to educate the public in to more responsible dog ownership.

Oh, and arf at D0oin's post at 14.37.

ithink your BU too.

HTH

Maybe instead of removing the dogs we should just get rid of the people who don't like them instead...

Sorry but you're being VU, what ever happened to tolerance?

BTW - I'm a dog owner and I hate the poo too. I think that a lot of it is left by elderly dog owners who didn't have to pick up after their dogs years ago... I hope it'll get better as the years pass...

If having better legislation and a more coherent policy in local authorities were in place then it might work. Just trying to do something with the aim of punishing all because of some crap on the pavement is stupid and offensive.

So an enforceable licensing system which made sure illegal breeders/dog fighters/people convicted of animal cruelty were unable to own dogs thereafter I would theoretically support.

But shouting that the problems you listed are just because dogs are dogs ergo remove dogs and you won't have any problems is just dumb. Sorry but it is.

I haven't read all the comments but I agree with a lot of what you're saying. I've only felt strongly about them and bloody smokers since having DS so it's possible I'm being a little PFB but I don't care!

When I was in New York most of the parks had sectioned off areas for dogs to run around off their leads and in the rest of the park they had to remain on a lead. I was never bothered by one and I have never seen even remnants of any mess on their pavements.

I think rather than an all out ban this would be the way to go. There's too many people who are PFB about their dogs for a ban to work, it would be about as successful as a ban on children IMO.

I agree with you about people saying "he's only being friendly" though - when DS was a few weeks old DHs aunty told me her Staffordshire terrior "only wants to give him a kiss" - I told her I didn't want dog saliva all over my baby and (as I've seen it rip a soft toy apart in seconds) have resolved to keep him away from the dog until he's old enough to fight it off. Hopefully it'll have popped it's clogs well before that day comes!

Moan, bloody moan and utterly stupid generalisations. Are you generally considered to be a stupid person?

Sheepdogs

Seeing dogs

Hearing dogs

Search dogs

Drug sniffing dogs

Police dogs

Guard dogs

Therapy dogs that visit old people in care homes.

Dogs that can preempt an epileptic fit

Dogs that bring you brandy when you're stuck up a mountain fgs!

All of these are working dogs and oh yes domestic dogs too.

The thing is, only a couple of people have come up with alternative solutions and they have been shot down as unworkable. If there is no workable way to encourage/compel all dog owners to behave as responsibly as f-arama and people like her then the alternatives are the status quo, which is unacceptable, or no domestic dogs at all. I don't think that's stupid.

There are dogs that bring you Brandy?

I must learn how to train this. It would be much more useful than bringing me tug ropes every 30 seconds.

I don't think I have made any personal attacks on people disagreeing with me (the majority) and I actually take exception to being called a t*, stupid etc.

St Bernards carry brandy in the mountains don't they...

As a dog owner I hate dog poo on the pavement because a.) it reflects badly on all dog owners because people like the OP are a bit simple and b.) my dog stops for ages to sniff it which makes me feel queasy.

In the park, I am less bothered especially as it is very often fox poo. What can you do? Ban foxes. Mind you, the OP probably would!

From reading the OP, she is clearly narked that her PFB has to deal with anything less than perfection. I say to you; welcome to the real world!

Humans have been keeping domesticated dogs for 30,000 years but I?d say your Mumsnet campaign could change all this.

GO FOR IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dooin you made me larf.

Round here, it's mainly the old folk who don't bother cleaning up. I use my best passive aggressive Do You Need A Bag speech when I see them and they will always tidy up then.

My mum will try and drag me away when my dog has a crap because 'No one's looking!' She doesn't compute that that isn't the point.

Even the most swaggering of local young men will pick up their dog's crap round here.

Totally on your side AKMD.

What do I want? Well, I did say I wouldn't bore you and that I have a huge list - the comment wrt dog wardens was only supplementary to that - but if you really want to know HeartsJandJ has summed it up far better and more succinctly than I ever could. Action needs to be taken at grass roots level, upon the person who breeds without thought just because they happen to have an unspayed bitch (aka backyard breeders), breeders should all be licensed at significant personal cost, they should all be overseen by an independent body/bodies, they should all have to abide by a list of legally enforcable best practices when selling their pups (including ensuring that the owner is fit to have a dog in the first place - it should be the breeder's job, to be carried out at their expense and it might just make some think twice about breeding in the first place).

That is far more sensible imo than banning all pet dogs because you step in some dogshit.

Nothing to do with the debate, but just wanted to say to PhyllisDoris - what a fantastic name - it's not often these days that you come across someone who remembers Ryan and Ronnie and Our House. I've come over all nostalgic.

Right, as you were.

Get over it.

bloody hell! your pissing me off, can we ban you?

How about dog owners that have to put up with irresponsible parents? parents who should teach their children to ask before touching. teach them to stop bloody screaching and screaming and crying and generally annoying everyone.

hey folks...... is it not possible at all to have a reasonable discussion without reverting to causing others stupid . I think AKMD has very valid points even if I do not agree with her solution .... but even if I thought her post totally unreasonable I would still see no reason to name call.

I would love there to be a workable solution, I really would, but I think that it would be unfair to ban all dogs because of the actions of some.

One of the problems with trying to differentiate between a domestic dog and say a therapy dog... is not all dogs that have a theraputic effect on people are registered as such. There are many people ( especially elderly / lonely) who are kept off antidepressants by the prescence of their dog.