AIBU to think that it is rare that a child

[helloclitty]

will have a career outside the level of their parents interests or expectations. Or indeed their parents own specific career paths.

AIBU to think that social mobility can never really exist even if all education was free. Ultimately we are all products of our own parents knowledge base and expectations except for a rare few?

And even those who say they really don't mind what their children do as a career actually do create an unspoken level of expectation which influences their children massively.

My dad was a translator.

My mum a secretary, then a SAHM, then a PA.

My sister is a teacher, I am a zoologist, our brother is a heroin addict (as close to a career as he has got for the past 15 years.

On which basis I disagree with the OP.

Actually I need to amend my last comment as it wasn't fair to my parents. My parents gave me the support to get a bloody good education at school level. An education they could only have ever dreamt of. They wanted me to progress beyond that but it was into completely unchartered waters and they were as lost as I was.

Not from my experience either, my Dad is a plumber my Mum a SAHM even when we were adults she'd has never worked, both have spent large chunks of their lives on benefits.

I was the first one either side of the family to stay on at school past 16 and go to
Uni.

I was never encouraged, in some ways it's been a curse being the "clever" one my mother has always resented me I think she would have preferred my brother to have been the clever one. It has always been held against me " my uni education" and that my poor brother isn't as clever as me. Think of it as the reverse of the black sheep in a professional family.

My DC will grow up thinking they can be anything they want to be if they work hard enough.

YABU.

My DH has a PhD and has a good job. His parents are a bus driver and machinist. It wasnt until he did his doctorate at Cambridge that they stopped offering to put a word in for him to get a job as a bus driver.

My dad is a tradesman and I am a self employed consultant. I was always encouraged to get an education.

But DH and I both benefited from going to university with a full grant in the days before fees (and nearly before student loans). Not sure whether we'd go in today's climate.

Another one who thinks that YABU in thinking that parents' professions dictate their children's. Working class parents produced a range from professor to supermarket worker. There were no expectations and definitely no help.

However, the key to social mobility is access to education and training. I think 3rd level ed should be free to all, regardless of social background, so as to allow true independence to pursue a career.

From my own experience I think I agree with you. My parents were both very much middle class aspiring types and we had an academic education, even though it was at a comprehensive. If we had turned around and said "I want to be a plumber", I don't think we would have had much support - there would have been cries of "Oh you could be so much more!" It was never countenanced that we wouldn't go to university.

I think it takes someone who really knows their own mind at 16/18 to break out and do something really different. Good luck to them.

Lolaflores, I dislike posters who come on threads and make objectionable, personal or abusive remarks rather than engaging in debate. It is bullying, and there is a lot of it on MN at the moment.

I don't see why it should go unchallenged.

I think the OP is nonsense. My mum was a secretary then a housewife. My dad had his own retail business. There was some expectation that I might take over the business but no pressure at all to do so. I became a barrister.

I know loads and loads of people with similar stories.

I disagree. Dh and I are both from very working class backgrounds. Neither of us were encouraged to strive for careers but we both ended up in professional jobs.

I find this a fascinating topic. I think parents/caregivers do have a huge influence but there are other influences that can be just as powerful. A one off remark by a friend's parent, teacher, anyone in our circle of influence when growing up can have a huge impact on our career choices. I'm sure my career decisions were influenced by the conflicting values of my parents. I've been looking into how we make our career decisions lately. I found the question prompts below interesting. Also find the idea of the career genogram fascinating---this is where you do a family tree of the jobs your ancestors have done and you see the ghosts of influences on you and your other family members.

Chope?s Family Protocol (2006)

1. What kind of career-related information did the family provide?
   A. Did the family help you generate different possibilities and new experiences?
   B. What alternatives did the family suggest regarding schools, training, or careers? How did these affect you?
   C. What was the family?s impression of gender roles? How did these affect you?
   D. What family traditions or legends existed?
   E. Was there any ?forced guidance,? a tendency to push you in a direction more reflective of the family?s interests than yours?

2. What tangible assistance was provided, and were there any strings attached?
   A. Were tuition, books, and supplies provided?
   B. Was transportation provided to attend school or to get a job?
   C. Was housing provided or made available?
   D. Were incidentals taken care of?

3. What type of emotional support did the family provide?
   A. How certain were you that emotional support would be available, no matter what?
   B. Did the family take a hands-off but supportive approach?
   C. Was there subtle emotional pressure to pursue a particular path?
   D. Were you told by the family to ?just be happy??
   E. Were you told that your plans wouldn?t amount to much?
   F. Who was supportive and who wasn?t?

4. Were you concerned about the impact of the career choice on the family?

5. What disruptive family events affected you or other members of the family?

6. What were the actions of family members who were asked to help and actions of those who were asked not to help?
   A. Of those who were involved, which were welcomed and which were not?
   B. Of those who were asked to help, who offered assistance and who did not?

I don't agree with you OP.

I grew up in a very poor household and the woman who raised me (my gran) was barely literate and loathed the fact that I did very well at school. I won a scholarship to a private school (entered by my primary school) and was not allowed to go. Was not allowed to do homework etc. She hated the thought of education and didn't want me to stay on for A Levels.

To cut a long story short, as soon as I escaped my childhood home, I was able to concentrate on getting educated - I have two degrees, am a qualified engineer and now work as a senior civil servant in central government.

I always thought (hoped) that dd would follow in my footsteps and love science/technical subjects, and I have always assumed that she would go to university. The opposite. She wants to be a cop or a soldier and has no desire to go to university.

The main body of research shows that parental attitudes can have an effect on educational atainment.

That is why we need schemes such as Surestart and good schools (as well as other services), for those children who are let down by their birth family.

feelthebeer

Very interesting thank you

hasnt been my experience at all. DH's parents were 'blue collar' immigrants. He went to a Russell Group university, had a very successful career in hisindustry and now runs his own successful business.

My dad was a manual labourer and mum a teacher. I run my own business/social enterprise, and was formerly a music journalist.

Yes, your social and financial background affect your future prospects. But I dnt think that means you necessarily follow in your parents footsteps career-wise. Changing times affect our careers and prospects in a far greater way, imo.

Don't think so. Clearly family can have a major influence on a child's choices but it is not a given.

Can't go into details, but my brother is a world famous inventer in a field nobody in our family was even remotely interested in.

Don't agree at all. Almost all my friends have careers 'outside the level of their parents interests or expectations'.

dikkert

How amazing!

In fact looking back I am the only one whose parents had absurdly optimistic expectations and who hasn't lived up to them.

hellocltty (love the name btw) What is it that you would have liked to do? Maybe you can?

YANBU. With some exceptions, there's not that much social mobility. I believe most of us have similar potential, so many young people could do so much more, with higher expectations and opportunities.

Relatively true, but not an absolute.

you do realise that half the jobs out avaiable now didn't exist 20 years ago. And the jobs my children will do probably don't exist now or are just on the cusp of being so. I mean who thouht any of us would grow up to be web designers or app inventors? Or even come up with a website so that thousands of mind could chat online 20 years ago?

Mum was in tailoring, then a dinner lady then a SAHM, Dad was a riveter for a train building company. Council house, no cars, very working class. Never went abroad, had no interests really outside of bingo, sport and gardening. No-one in my family had ever been to University.

My DSis is a bank manager and I'm a data analyst.

We are who we are today because they always encouraged us to read and to do well at school. They had (and still do have) high expectations of us.

I don't think it is possible, through "social mobility" to become Upper Class, even if I had married Lord Whatever I'd still be me, but I know plenty of working class people, who live a totally different life to their parents, have become "middle class" so to speak (though I hate that description).

My DH is Upper MC (a few distant land-owning titles in there) and I know that his Mum especially wasn't overly keen on my humble beginnings to start with. Now she knows I'm not a gold digger, we get on much better.

I think it is also a factor that between our generation and that of our parents, this country moved from having a fairly strong manufacturing base to being a service economy. So the chances of becoming e.g. a fitter at Ford because that is what your dad did are fairly slim. You were much more likely to get some A levels and work in an office.