Am I being the unreasonable friend, or is she?

[Hobs]

I don't know if I am being unreasonable or if she is, so I'd like your opinions

My friend has been off work for a few months now. She had an accident at work which has triggered some underlying conditions. She suffers with ME and is prone to the occasional flare-up, which she is currently experiencing. It does cause her to be exhausted a lot of the time, and often causes her to have aching muscles. I do know that she is suffering, but she is also able to do quite a lot - she still takes the dog for a short walk every day and she is able to drive short distances to the local shops, hairdressers and cafes when she wants / needs to. She gave me a huge pile of information about her condition a when it first started and demanded that I read it all, because there was no point in me seeing her so often and not understanding how she is affected.

I have spent a lot of time with this friend whilst she's been off work. We've met up at least once every week. It always seems to be on her terms. She will decide where we are meeting and when is convenient for her and will tell me, rather than ask, so texts will say things like "Tuesday is best for me. I'll see you at 11." I am expected to just agree. We used to meet out a lot, but she is no longer getting occupational sick leave, so does not want to spend money on eating/ having a cuppa out. Fair enough. I have no problem with accommodating that. However, she now insists that I go to visit her at her house, when she is available. Her husband runs his own business from home and is able to drive her out if needed. Her house is a 40 min walk from my house, I don't drive and it isn't on a bus route.

I had my DS 8.5 months ago. I had a difficult delivery. I have since been diagnosed with PTSD and postnatal depression. I also still suffer from pains in my various scarred places, and I am prone to days when I'd rather stick my head in the oven than leave the house. However, I have always made the effort to go to visit her because I know she needs the company, and I have only missed on a few occasions.

Recently, I've gotten more and more annoyed about it - the fact that everything is on her terms. If she cancels, then it's fine, but when I cancel, it's a different matter. I cancelled once a couple of weeks ago as DS hadn't slept all night, and neither had I, I was exhausted and in a lot of pain. I was having an awful day (one of my worst since starting on antidepressants) and I really wasn't fit for company. I was in full-on panic attack mode about leaving the house. I told her this and her response (in full) was "I'm disappointed about not seeing you, but I suppose you know best". On one occasion 2 or 3 weeks ago, I felt unable to take DS to her house as I didn't think I had the walk in me and he was ill, whiny and clingy. I asked if she could get her DH to bring her round, thinking DS would be better at home, and she replied "No. I don't want to go out today". She never asks how I am doing, or about DS, or anything really unless it suits her.

I was quite upset by this particular comment about her not wanting to go out, and after talking to HusbandHobs, decided to send her some information on PND and PTSD with and explanation that I hoped this information would be useful to her and help her understand where I was coming from etc. I thought it might highlight for her how I am feeling most of the time so that perhaps she would be more understanding when I don't feel up to visiting her.

So today, I have had a response saying she didn't think there was any point reading it as she "had enough on her plate with her own issues, thanks" and as it's all in my head anyway, the best way for her to help would be to carry on as normal so I would get over it quicker. I was a bit . I like to think I've been very accommodating of her and her issues over the last few months. I make more of an effort to pull myself out of my black hole of doom to go to see her than I do for most other people, but it seems that she doesn't appreciate it, and is unwilling to ever return the favour for me.

I know that I am prone to being negative about things at the minute which is why I am here asking AIBU here or is she? I'd ask HusbandHobs, but he is too scared to disagree with me in case I go batshit-crazy on him

Hobs, I think you sound lovely! Your friend is BVU for not taking better care of your friendship.

You are ill too and she has not shown any respect or understanding of that. I am also a bit that she could be so rudely dismissive of your illness when she expected you to read about her condition. I'm sorry about your PND and PTSD and hope you are yourself again soon.

I also think you need to step back and focus on yourself and your family for a while. If she is making you miserable, then you don't need her friendship right now. Make some polite excuses and don't see her for a while.

I know you don't want an emotional confrontation but if I were in your place, I would want to let her know that being that rude wasn't really on. Could you contact her and say that you were hurt and upset by her comments? This might give her the chance to apologise (If this won't work or is not what you want, just ignore me )

Yet another YANBU. Your 'friend' may be genuinely suffering with her condition but hat doesn't automatically make it all right for her to be a complete bitch. The 'all in your head' was the worst bit of that.

I can see why you don't want confrontation. I would just go quiet, and if she contacts you assuming you will come over suggesting a meet up, you can say 'Can't come over to you then, I'm afraid, but you're welcome to come to mine, just let me know'.

I had a friend like this. The problems were emotional (abuse) rather than physical. I didn't have to dump her. I just started expecting the same respect she expected. If she cancelled, I didn't reschedule at her convenience but mine. If one meet up at been at her time and place, I expected the next to be at mine. It took less than six months for me to lose her. I didn't dump her, she just didn't care enough about our friendship to treat me well. That was years ago and I don't miss her at all. She was selfish and self obsessed.

She is a self-obsessed arse

Leave the cow!

Seriously - why are you friends with her? She is so dismissive and all me, me, me. Do yourself a favour and bin her

Yanbu. She is a selfish idiot. Me me me, my arse.

Dump her.

I really hope you find the strength to back away from her as honestly - she is not a good friend to you. Be strong and do it. You deserve good friends not shit ones!

Hey Hobs, I think you need to ensure you put yourself first. You now know for sure that YANBU so hopefully that like you've said it would, will make you feel better about the situation.

My advice for you from here would be to follow your gut feeling on this. Follow your gut on what you think is best for you. So if that's going for a walk to her house because you want the fresh air and excersice and you'll benefit from it, then do it. But if your gut tells you that you'd be doing that more for your friend that particular day, that you just don't want to, then don't.

I don't think you need to put unessasary pressure on yourself to 'get rid' just ensure that you get out of the friendship what benefits you. It'll go one way or the other naturally that way I think.

Has it been suggested already that depression can make someone act very selfishly? Perhaps her illnesses are amplifying her worst points such as being selfish and saying things that are unthoughtful.

So to summarise ask yourself each time 'what's going to be best for me' then act on that. If your friendship gets through this bad patch for both of you, then it could be a very strong friendship for you in the future. Or it'll naturally come to an end which I think will be more likely.

All the best. X

To whichever poster it was who said that Hobs shouldn't ask for opinions if she isn't going to follow any of the advice given, I would say this. Hobs was asking us who was being unreasonable - her or her friend - not advice or suggestions, but reassurance. Having had PND (as part of clinical depression), I know that sometimes you doubt yourself, and can be unsure that you have the right perspective on things - so Hobs was asking the mumsnet massive for an outside perspective.

When I started to read I was feeling sorry for your 'friend' and thinking she wasn't being unreasonable by asking you to make a bit of extra effort. But the fact that she takes nothing of your conditions into account is shocking, when you have been making the effort for her.

I'd be seriously reconsidering this friendship. Are you getting anything from it at all?

Hobs in a way I think you should say something to her . there is allowed to be more than one person suffering and I think she has been extremely dismissive and rude to you. It won't do tour self esteem any good to keep it in and I don't think you will lose anything by telling her that friendship is a two way street and you are struggling and need support too sometimes, clearly she is opting out of this bit! I know you don't want confrontation but it might be a little empowering to give her a taste of her own medicine too, without being cruel. It's been said that depression is anger turned inward with no place to go. So this could Aid your recovery :-)

I've had fibromyalgia and am just coming of other side of pnd too. The fibromyalgia was a more slow burning sort of suppressed way of life but my Pnd was pure evil and vicious and makes you want to die or leave home and is extremely frightening, but lasted 18 months ish . Not nice either way and this has thrown up an incompatibility between you both in terms of friendship but there is no need for her to be ignorant and dismissive of you.

Good luck I hope you get better and stronger soon. Remember talkIng beats depression at it's own game

OP, what you need from a friend now is lots of love and cuddles, not this. The only thing to do with a "friend" like this (and I've had them too) is to drop her like a hot brick.

Its horrible when a friend doesn't support you. I had depression, an anxiety disorder etc after someone close to me died. Then i had a baby, it was all too much, i was in a terrible state!

A friend of mine came to see me a few times and then i didn't hear from her for ages. One day i got a letter saying that she didn't want to meet up because i was always crying and miserable. Apparently it wasn't much fun for her.

Yeah weird that. Was with the bereavement you think id be on top of the world!

I was really upset at the time.

YANBU I have posted about my (ex) friend on here before. She has ME and this all sounds very familiar. I agree with the 'me me me' thing as it definitely fits with her.

She was very self-absorbed, threw a tantrum before my wedding (which she was't able to come to) because I didn't ask her to be bridesmaid, told me I wasn't going to starve when i got made redundant from my dream job, got cross with me why my husband didn't want me to drive an hour to meet her when I was 41 weeks pregnant (and there are many, many more examples) and eventually wrote me a long detailed letter spelling out why I was such a terrible friend when my first son was six weeks old.

I cried for a whole day and haven't spoken to her since.

I think you should take a step back from your friend, surround yourself with supportive people who love you, and get better soon. Good luck! X

You're right, you have have to do this in a way you can manage. Good luck hopefully she will get the message x

Perhaps you should start treating her as she is treating you....

Seriously!

For too long she has been getting away with being a self centred, selfish madam...and hasn't cared a jot about how you have been coping.

Definitely time to reassess this so-called friendship....but for a start I would definitely turn the tables.

skybluepearl as it happens she doesn't want to see me next week, but I am also busy as have had offers of some other friends coming to visit and have my usual baby group as well, so I wouldn't be able to go! Thank you. I am seeing a CPN regularly and doing some CBT, which is slowly starting to help. I haven't done anything with chart scores though - that sounds interesting- did you do that with your CBT? I'd like to be able to see if I am improving with something like that!

mumtomoley Thanks. I have a lovely DH who takes care of me and other friends, so it's not all bad!! Just this one is very draining at the present time.

OAM2009 thank you. I could contact her and say that, but I can guess at her reaction and I know that if she caught me with that at a bad time it would really hurt me and wouldn't do me any good really. Plus I don't really think she'd take it on board. She'd probably just dismiss it as me being too emotional or something.

EightiesChick I think that's the worst bit of it too. I'd just about convinced myself it wasn't all in my head too.

MrsTerryPratchett How awful for you. I could start giving her a taste of her own medicine. I suspect it will end the same way.

ilikecandy I haven't really seen this side of her before - it's only over these last few months of her illness and my maternity leave that I've spent so much time with her really.

Hyperballad It does make me feel a bit better actually. Thank you for your advice! I will start doing what is best for me first and foremost. I do like the walk and I do like her company sometimes, but I guess I should stop going on the days I don't want to go, rather than feeling obliged to.

STDGisAnEvilWolefGenius Thank you. That's the point I was trying to make earlier without sounding like I didn't appreciate the advice, because I do. I'm sorry you have suffered PND too.

SydSaid Sometimes I do. I enjoy her company and we have interesting conversations, it's a day out by the time I've walked there and back and spent a couple of hours with her. It gives me something to do, but I'm not sure it's always something I want to do, or how it will be after this latest revelation.

Ellovera Thank you, that is an interesting point. I'm sorry to hear of your fibromyalgia and pnd.

PooPooInMyToes That is probably the
worst story I've heard about someone who is meant to be a friend. How awful for you.

Mrskbpw Another story of a terrible friend! I'm sorry you went through that.

sausagesandmarmelade I'm going to give that a try for a while. See what impact it has.

Thanks so much for the spoon story. Very thought provoking.
Hobs - I really hope things improve for you, and you manage to surround yourself with loving supportive people. Your family deserves nothing less :)

Hobs, thank you very much for taking the time to reply personally to all your posters . I appreciate it very much as I'm quite new to Mumsnet and have been having trouble with friendships recently, which has made me question how well I relate and communicate with people. I often feel ignored on threads so your response has made me feel valued and worthwhile. You sound like a lovely, very kind and thoughtful person and I wish you all the very best in your recovery.

Thank you Jix My family deserve better than they get from me, this I know. I also thought the spoon story was very good. It's a fantastic analogy and very thought-provoking.

OAM2009 What a lovely post. Thank you. I am very grateful to you for taking the time to respond to my OP, and for your thoughts and advice. I am sorry to hear you feel ignored on other threads, but I think you communicated very well in your post, so I don't think it is you personally iyswim. I am sorry to hear you are having trouble with friendships, they can be tricky things, can't they?! Thank you for your post and for your kind words.

I don't think I responded to everyone, so to those I didn't respond to directly, thank you and I am grateful for all your comments I just write personally to everyone who asks a question or whose post I could comment on with something different to say than I had already said.

YANBU at all, and it's good to read your replies where you're getting stronger by the post! This woman sounds terribly selfish, she clearly thinks she is faaaar more important than you. Not the behaviour of a friend, by any stretch of the definition.

Just out of curiosity, can you tell us her good points? Does she cheer you up, make you laugh, give nice hugs, does she provide stimulating intellectual debate, is she plentiful with the tea and biscuits, or generous with a listening ear? If she hasn't done anything 'friendly' in the last 6 months, then I would seriously suggest just phasing her out. Completely out.
You don't have a long back history with her like a childhood friendship, she doesn't live very nearby so you can easily avoid her, and she's upsetting you - and as someone else said upthread, was she even any nicer before she got ill and so self obsessed?

I had a friend for several years who was ill, and when I moved away I realised she wasn't my friend, I was hers. I was her sympathetic ear, her layman shrink, and her confidence booster. She never asked how I was, or showed interest in my life. I waited for her to get in touch, and she didn't. It was a relief. :)

Yanbu! Sorry to hear you are struggling and agree with the others. On a separate note I too have a lot of pain following difficult deliveries- please get yourself referred to the pain clinic- eventually I was diagnosed with nerve damage to my lady garden! (they thought it was in my head for a bit) but I now have nerve blocks in my pudendal nerve which is a godsend. Pm if you fancy lady garden chat! Hope you get a good outcome with your friend eventually xx

Tiddlyompompom Thanks! Her good points? Erm. She makes a good brew :) :) Seriously - we have a lot of shared interests, we have interesting conversations when she's on good form, she's very good with supplying cake and biscuits. She's always been a bit on the selfish side, to be honest, but not quite so self obsessed as this! I certainly give her more of a sympathetic ear than she gives me. She does ask me things about my appointments with the docs and counsellor, but it's always more of an interrogation than a conversation. I'm not sure she really gets the concept of people not wanting to talk about something!!

IWishIWasSheRa Thanks for your message. I will PM you when I get a few more minutes spare!

Do you think you would be able to be blunt with her, Hobs? Point out to her how selfish she is being in her behaviour, and that you have needs, problems and feelings too, and say that her attitude is going to destroy the friendship, if she's not careful.

If you do this, and she realises the truth of what you are saying, and changes her attitude, then she's a good friend, worth keeping. If not, then I suspect you are not going to be any the worse off for losing the friendship.

I doubt it SDTG I don't think I'm strong enough for that kind of confrontation at the moment, and I think she would take great offence at it. It would likely end in her thinking I am being even more selfish and "kicking her when she's down" for want of a better phrase.