to want to take my pushchair into my doctors surgery?

[gillquil]

my g.p surgery has just banned pushchairs, I've them a letter that follows, is this the norm? or should I just change our G.P.?

Hello,

I would like to make a complaint about the forthcoming ban on pushchairs in the surgery from the first of April. I am a mother of three, my eldest child has just turned four and we have a double pushchair which we normally use for our two youngest. My youngest child has just turned one, and as is typical for his age, he wants to crawl and climb all the time, he definitely doesn?t want to sit on my lap while I wait, he will however normally wait happily in his pushchair, or sleep in it while we wait or during our appointments. My two year old daughter just wants to run around.

If I am unable to bring my pushchair into the surgery I am going to have to let my son crawl over the floor in the surgery which I can?t imagine being the most hygienic thing to do. Or when he is asleep I will have to wake him, and what if both he and his sister are sleeping? do I really want to wait for my appointment struggling with a sobbing two year old daughter and a crying one year old son, my handbag, and changing bag on the floor or on the seat next to me. All of which, toddler, and baby and baggage have to then be carried into the appointment. I would also like to know what is suggested for mothers who need for example to have their young child with them during say a smear test? Should I leave him to crawl around the floor in the surgery during this?

Parents that I know often rely on being able to entertain a young child or children in a pushchair so that they can speak to their G.P. or nurse for a few minutes uninterrupted. Or the child sleeps on through their appointment and waiting time, and the parent can have a proper conversation or treatment.
I don?t have the option of arranging childcare for the times when I need to come to the surgery, especially as we normally ring at 8 a.m to see what appointment we can get if any for that morning.

I asked about the security of the area that has been designated for pushchairs to be left. As far as the lady I spoke to knew, there is none, it seems that the surgery is relying on the area being ?out of sight.? I disagree anyone walking past will be able to see a row of unsecured pushchairs. Pushchairs cost as I am sure you know an enormous amount of money. We live close by and two of my neighbours have had pushchairs stolen from outside their own front doors in the last six months, and we had a child?s scooter taken ourselves. It was suggested also that I buy a bicycle style lock for our chair, but I can?t see what I would secure it to.

While I can see the need for some sort solution to the congestion in the waiting room, as a result of parents and children who are patients at XXX Surgery using pushchairs, I don?t feel that just telling people their only option is to leave their pushchairs outside, in an unsecured area, and carry in their child or children and changing bags, handbags and who knows even their shopping, is acceptable. In fact I think it?s discriminatory. I have spoken to several mothers today who are patients at XXX, as are their children, and they all agree, and have said they will be putting forward their comments also.

I look forward to your reply and hope that XXX can be a bit more creative in finding a solution that doesn?t leave patients feeling unwelcome.

Oops! No it didn't, sorry! Don't where I got that from. However the principle still applies.

Thinking about it - I can't take double buggy into gp either - it's a village one and too small. I carry car seats in instead. 2 car seats + babies is heavy but good for my arms. I have to drive to gp now as I moved house so not an issue for me, but we walk to children's centre.

Buggies getting bigger? Well my mum's old Silvercross pram was pretty big and she used that in 1982 for me! Perhaps if the gp's had a baby area with mats and bumbos or similar it would balance it out.

Miss CoffeeNWine. Your toddler obviously doesn't GO OFF anywhere and obviously does as he/s she is told. Mine is a 2yo overactive monkey that weighs two stone and has ants in his pants.

Just accept that not everybody IS you or is LIKE you or can DO the same as you. Every child is different. It was your total lack of broad mindedness towards others that really pissed me off.

Mine needs supervision to keep him safe. Expecting him to sit quietly and not climb on stuff/pick things up/get stuck whilst Mummy has a breast examination is the stuff of fantasy. And there are others like me. You come across as wincingly smug.

but not everyone wants to or can use a sling!!

i love them, use them all the time for all 5, but there were times when iether my skin was too sore, and a sling made me more hot and itchy, or whne my spd was too bad that i simply couldnt use a sling.

not only that when going ot the gps FOR my eczema i have to strip off and so would have to take the baby out of the sling and take the sling off as well! MUCH easier to just have the baby in a pushchair for these appointments so they can sleep happily (hopefully) whilst i am examined.

as i said i am BIG sling fan, ask my sister about my collection, which she is fortunate enough to have inherited for her new baby! but they are just not always practical or even possible for some people.

Believe me, it really doesn't take much room for a toddler to wreak havoc. Not everyone has such placid children as MissCoffee. There is no way I could have lay down to be examined when either of mine were 2, if I hadn't been able to put them in a buggy.

Our children's centre (where you now take babies for weighing) have banned buggies (have to leave them in buggy park outside) and car seats..

Is the buggy park secured? I think it would make so much difference to a lot of parents (obviously not you with 7mo twins) if they knew they were leaving the buggy somewhere safe. I've already said this but the lack of security is a massive deal if you can't easily afford to replace the damn thing if someone walks off with it.

My little sister's buggy was stolen from a school fete when I was little. It had been parked with all the others and just wasn't there when we came back for it. Because of this, I've always been paranoid about leaving DS's buggy anywhere out of sight as I know that this stuff does happen. Maybe the posters who are dismissive of the risks all live in the sorts of areas where everyone's comfortably off, so they don't need to worry about theft. Actually, that would probably also account for the blithe "just take them in in their car seat - simples" type responses too

Please tell me exactly how

'I know that's not the norm but it worked for us'
'of course not for everyone, I understand that for some they are necessary' (plus examples, please note the ETC I didn't give an exhaustive list )
'I'm not saying pushchairs are unnecessary for everyone'
'I understand it will be difficult with more than one child and yes there will always be exceptions'
'if you have additional access needs there should be provision'

plus putting forward ideas to get round the problem

translates as narrow minded, sanctimonious, or having a total lack of understanding?

I think it shows narrow mindedness and a lack of understanding when people are told that some buildings simply cannot safely cope with numerous pushchairs yet they think they should all be allowed to take them in anyway.

it's not secure no but fairly low crime round here. Last time I went i had to take dtds in in their pushchair then put them on the floor and was asked to take buggy outside while hv watched babies. I said they could put it outside but I wasn't leaving dtds with hv - I don't care that she's a hv, I don't know her.

MissCoffeeNWine the two following statements read as rather smug and judgmental. Perhaps you didn't intend them that way but it's how they came across.

I don't understand the attachment to pushchairs really or the idea that you can't manage without one

I understand that for some they are necessary (multiple children close in age, disability, etc), but for many they really are not.

princessscrumpy, my ob gyn fully endorsed me getting up and about after birth of first (5lb early baby) and carrying her in a wrap. i was happy taking his advice.

carrying in a wrap properly tied and avoiding the wound is fine and puts less pressure on the section than carrying away from the body.

i am not smug, don't care what others do really, but just wanted to say not everyone use prams or wants to.

I think that a huge issue is that so many people are inconsiderate. If there was a sign requesting people to leave their buggies in the hall to make space for people who do need them, it would be ignored. People are selfish to the needs of those who do need to keep their buggies with them. Not every single person needs their buggy.

I think it shows narrow mindedness and a lack of understanding when people are told that some buildings simply cannot safely cope with numerous pushchairs yet they think they should all be allowed to take them in anyway.

Oh for fucks sake

Go on then. How's it narrow minded? assuming that you're not just trolling now

GeriatricBabyMama
I didn't suggest that parents and children going to a surgery was out of the ordinary. Of couse it's not.
Just people who cannot manage to get someone to look after their children or have someone come with them to look after their children while they attend an appointment for themselves OR an appointment for one of their children who is unwell. That is, in my opinion, out of the ordinary, and not the fault of the surgery when they thought of banning pushchairs from the waiting room. Or the fault of the person who has absolutely no-one they can call on.
I do not think there is an easy answer.
It's the same with "why can't there be surgeries at the weekend?", because that's when I can get there with no problems. I find it difficult to get to appointments that I have to ring up at 8am or 12;30pm ,due to work. But,somehow, I manage. I am lucky that my children are now 19,15 and 11,so I don't need to have them with me if I go for myself (although, luckily for me, that hasn't ever really been an issue)...but I still have to make time for my two younger ones if they need to go to the doctors. Plus dentist, orthodontist etc... I can hear you saying why does't the DH take them? Because he doesn't drive, and it is easier for me to do it and wangle the time off work than it is for him.
Everbody has difficulties....why should one person's difficulties be more important than another's? And how do you suggest that surgeries address everybody's differing needs?

I wouldn't have worded it so harshly or like that at all actually but there is a point somewhere in the snark. If there is limited space, what can you do? There is limited space. It's not like you can stack pushchairs on top of each other. < think rush hour on the underground in London >

I did not mean them to come across in a negative way. I just come from the general viewpoint that the majority of people in the world and in history have never been in a pushchair, and that a baby and a pushchair are seperate entities, so making somewhere inaccessible to pushchairs is not making it inaccessible to babies or parents. Does that make more sense? As I've said many times there will clearly be exceptions to this.

Can anyone comment on the idea of asking surgeries to implement policies of requesting increased accessibility for pushchairs etc when the appointment is booked? It seems a sensible solution to me. I imagine there are a fair few occasions on which ringing up to ask about accessibility is necessary if you are planning on taking wheeled transportation of whichever kind?

Jeez, WhatmeWorry, you really are the milkman of human kindness aren't you

Rot. You want surgeries to be open to all pushchairs at all times, I don't think its feasible in this case. It's a perfectly rational attitude given the limitations of space, regulations and human nature, and is a rational response by the surgery based on the needs and safety of the greater majority of surgery users, so get off the moral high ground.

I think that a huge issue is that so many people are inconsiderate. If there was a sign requesting people to leave their buggies in the hall to make space for people who do need them, it would be ignored.

Bingo.

Add to that the H&S/fire advice they have to adhere to (it probably also impacts insurance) and the impossibility of expanding/moving/extending yer average surgery, and you get a pushchair ban.

Just howling "lack of compassion" to anyone pointing this obvious stuff out isn't a solution.

It's narrow minded because it doesn't take into account any other needs except those of people with pushchairs.

When people are basically saying that pushchairs should be allowed and that should be the end of it, they are failing to take into account other surgery users and H&S guidelines. They are only considering one issue, instead of considering all the issues. That is what makes it narrow minded.

The majority of people in history have not had access to medical care either. That we have access to it today, in this country, and also have the opportunity to use buggies so that we can travel with small children, is what I would call progress.

Actually , I don't think it is at all out of the ordinary that people may have to bring their children to the doctors as they have no one to look after them at a particular time when they have an appointment. If everyone did have childcare on tap, then few people would feel a need to bring buggies in, and there would have been no need to ban them.

'You want surgeries to be open to all pushchairs at all times'

I didn't say this at all, our surgery requests that people leave their buggies in porch, but try to work ways around it if is necessary - I think this is a good solution, and it works well in our surgery.

My comment was actually in response to your 2 posts talking about people's 'sob stories' and the comment,

'This thread has turned into a plethora of competitive small violins.'

when people had just been talking about the difficulties they had had at a very hard time in their life.

Point taken halcyondays.
But some people don't seem prepared to consider that you can't always have it your own way.

I personally think not allowing buggys into a docs surgery is almost old fashioned and ridiculous.
For all these people banging on about babysitters-try arranging someone to look after FOUR young children with only half hours notice lol-my friends have their own kids and to add my four into the mix short notice would not be fair!
Most surgerys operate on phone on the day at 8am procedure and so does mine but thank god i dont have this problem as my surgery allows buggys and guess what it is a SMALL surgery so most of these new rules put in place are probably made by jobsworth morons as if my TINY surgey can manage why cant others?
It is hard work not having a pram, children thrown awful tantrums, throw things, run off and if they are ill want to nap in their BUGGY and why shouldnt they be allowed to do this.
Has anyone actually given one thought on the BABY being ILL and being sick etc.
I would rather someones baby is in their pram if ill not sitting on their mum being sick or sitting on floor being sick as mum attends to other child of simular age? Or what if mum and all her babies ill and need to be seen are they supposed to carry all their kids that dont walk unaided whilst feeling very ill themselves.
Have some sympathy people because one day god forbid you have twins, triplets or two kids very close together without no car- oh well i rest my case as of course you are so perfect lol.
Taking the piss out a lady that has pnd ffs some of you are rude beyond belief and i wonder why some of you come on here just to slag people off and ridicule them-its called mumsnet a place to disagree, help and advise not be bitchy.
Some of you have agreed and disagreed and been polite and took into account peoples feelings but on the other hand some of you are just plain bitchy and i hope to never encounter people like you in RL as in my area ive yet to encounter any mothers like some of you and i am glad.
We all need help sometimes and a buggy provides that

if someone was talking about cars, and said you don't (special mobility needs, etc etc, nothwithstanding) actually need one always, i wouldn't take that as a judgement on my ownership of one. i don't need my car, in the way some others clearly do. but i like ti have it and do use it once in a blue moon and to visit in laws in the hard-to-reach countryside.

but i can listen to an argument that i don't need a car and agree in principle and not feel hectored or judged.

i've lived in russia, egypt and china -- places where ameneties are far less accessible and getting about is far rougher and tougher, so maybe that's coloured my thinking, but a read a thread like this and come to the conclusion that either everyone has serious mobility problems or else they get seriously aggrieved by a small inconvenience once in a while.