to want to take my pushchair into my doctors surgery?

[gillquil]

my g.p surgery has just banned pushchairs, I've them a letter that follows, is this the norm? or should I just change our G.P.?

Hello,

I would like to make a complaint about the forthcoming ban on pushchairs in the surgery from the first of April. I am a mother of three, my eldest child has just turned four and we have a double pushchair which we normally use for our two youngest. My youngest child has just turned one, and as is typical for his age, he wants to crawl and climb all the time, he definitely doesn?t want to sit on my lap while I wait, he will however normally wait happily in his pushchair, or sleep in it while we wait or during our appointments. My two year old daughter just wants to run around.

If I am unable to bring my pushchair into the surgery I am going to have to let my son crawl over the floor in the surgery which I can?t imagine being the most hygienic thing to do. Or when he is asleep I will have to wake him, and what if both he and his sister are sleeping? do I really want to wait for my appointment struggling with a sobbing two year old daughter and a crying one year old son, my handbag, and changing bag on the floor or on the seat next to me. All of which, toddler, and baby and baggage have to then be carried into the appointment. I would also like to know what is suggested for mothers who need for example to have their young child with them during say a smear test? Should I leave him to crawl around the floor in the surgery during this?

Parents that I know often rely on being able to entertain a young child or children in a pushchair so that they can speak to their G.P. or nurse for a few minutes uninterrupted. Or the child sleeps on through their appointment and waiting time, and the parent can have a proper conversation or treatment.
I don?t have the option of arranging childcare for the times when I need to come to the surgery, especially as we normally ring at 8 a.m to see what appointment we can get if any for that morning.

I asked about the security of the area that has been designated for pushchairs to be left. As far as the lady I spoke to knew, there is none, it seems that the surgery is relying on the area being ?out of sight.? I disagree anyone walking past will be able to see a row of unsecured pushchairs. Pushchairs cost as I am sure you know an enormous amount of money. We live close by and two of my neighbours have had pushchairs stolen from outside their own front doors in the last six months, and we had a child?s scooter taken ourselves. It was suggested also that I buy a bicycle style lock for our chair, but I can?t see what I would secure it to.

While I can see the need for some sort solution to the congestion in the waiting room, as a result of parents and children who are patients at XXX Surgery using pushchairs, I don?t feel that just telling people their only option is to leave their pushchairs outside, in an unsecured area, and carry in their child or children and changing bags, handbags and who knows even their shopping, is acceptable. In fact I think it?s discriminatory. I have spoken to several mothers today who are patients at XXX, as are their children, and they all agree, and have said they will be putting forward their comments also.

I look forward to your reply and hope that XXX can be a bit more creative in finding a solution that doesn?t leave patients feeling unwelcome.

I think that people who have not had to think about the logistics of this, being of sound mind and body, haven't actually thought about the, ah, logistics.

Oh come off it.

The suggestion has been made that one of the babies be left in reception on the floor while the other one is transported to the consultation room with the mother. She then puts that one on the floor and goes back for another.

I can't believe people think this is a reasonable solution.

And as for in the event of fire "oh it'll be fine" strange how that doesn't apply to all the people who are apparently panicking so much they veer of in completely the wrong direction and manage to trip over the pushchair parked quietly in the corner.

The point I was trying to make is that if women have to do things like leaving babies unattended on the floor in order to see the GP, they are not going to sodding well go and see the GP, are they.

This simple fact appears to be terribly hard to grasp. I'm not sure why.

Sardine, some of your points are good ones, I think you are taking it to the extreme, but they are good points. However, you seem to be completely missing the point that risk assesors also have to take things to the extreme, and they have to do that while considering all their service users, not just mothers with multiple small children.

As they can't just magic up afew hundred thousand to redesign and build entirely new surgeries, some have no choice but to impose buggy bans for the sake of all the people in there if there was an emergency.

Yes it will cause a few people difficulty, but what would you rather they do if they simply don't have the space to accommodate lots of pushchairs?

A pushchair takes the same amount of space as a baby laying on the floor so i cant see why they don't have the space tbh.
At our docs the most buggys bought in at one time is about 4 and we have a v small surgery so i cannot see why other surgerys have banned them

My surgery has had a no-pushchair policy for over 20 years (ie my PFB is 20 and the policy was in place then), and the patient satisfaction for almost every element of care and use of the practice is over 95%.

This survey went out to a representative sample of registered patients, so would have caught the non-attenders too.

I think that it is up to every individual practice to make its own risk assessments for their individual building and come to a way of minimising the risks in each category for all of their staff, patients and companions. I don't think there will be many practices overwhelmed with the needs of triplet families, but those that do will know who they are and will be mindful of their needs.

Risk assessors are very good at looking for solutions to problems, rather than being bogged down with the doom and gloom of this thread.

Of course it is extreme, but then so are the comments the other way.

I think that surgeries should be aware of these accessibility issues and advise parents that if they need assistance with access then to speak to X and they will find a solution.

The current situation which leaves people (often vulnerable) either feeling that they have no access, or actually having no access is not good enough.

But only a small percentage of pushchair users would need to leave their baby on the floor, if any do at all. The majority would be able to carry their baby.

companions? What does that mean, in the context of this thread?

So as long as it's not many people, it's not a problem, is that it Freddo?

There are women on this thread who have said that they have stopped going to their GP because of access issues since they had children, and are not having tests that they are called for or treatment they need etc.

Why is this OK.

Of course it's a problem, but if they allowed everyone to take pushchairs in there would still be a problem, and that has to be solved somehow.

I just had a look at my surgerys website and there is nothing on there at all about this.but we don't have abandon, just a request to leave pushchairs in the big entrance. You are right that it could say that people should contact them if they're going to need help with access. But I woudo have thought women, especially women who are literate enough to be on the Internet,woudo be able to phone up and ask without being told.

Well you may think it's a problem, freddos, but many on the thread have stated that it is not, and women must simply find a way.

My practice is a purpose built 1970s design. The waiting room is a large square room, with about 8 chairs in the middle of the room (four facing one way and four the other), and chairs around the edge of the room, with space for 4 doorways, a play corner, and a magazine table.

There are basically two passageways - one on either side of the middle bank of chairs.

You could physically fit two buggies in each passageway, but then no one else would be able to move without shimmying, especially those who use zimmer frames and other types of walkers.

There is no way to tuck a buggy into a corner as each passageway leads from the main door to the doors leading to the consulting room. The 'dead' corner is a children's play area and patient information area.

This problem in this thread is not brought about by people with particular mobility needs or a surprising number of non-ambulant children. It is a problem caused by selfishness and lack of consideration for the needs and comforts of others. The problem is caused by the 90% of self-obsessed parents who don't give a damn about other people. Without a buggy ban, very few parents would leave theirs outside if there was the physical space inside (regardless of manoeuvring space around their monstrous pram). A ban takes care of all but the most arrogant.

People with special needs should always be outside of policies aimed at the general public who do not have special needs.

The thread started, IIRC, with an OP whinging about having to control here, presumably able bodied, 2 year old. My answer was basically to discipline him and act like the grown up. This is a very different proposition from disabled mothers with triplets etc.

I would also say that those of us with a 'deal with it' attitude, have dealt with it and successfully come out of the other side. We don't need to be told that we don't know what we are talking about. We do, and we found ways of coping with difficult situations (some which seemed insurmountable at the time) and we are simply passing on this hard-earned wisdom. Isn't that what Mumsnet is about.

I personally have five children and have had to do quite a bit of problem-solving and realigning of attitudes over the years. I can honestly say that I never once thought that I had special treatment because I was a mum of young children, so I do have a problem identifying with attitude.

I don;t need to phone up and ask, I know they are banned.

I also know that you are not allowed to leave a baby on the floor (even on a mat) while you have a smear.

I also know that there are not people available to provide assistance with opening and closing doors and stuff, if you are carrying one and have a toddler on the other, and let alone if you have an upstairs appt.

I further know that when a person is suffering with undiagnosed post-natal depression and anxiety, the idea of asking further how on earth it's supposed to be done is not on the cards.

I said oh well I can't get my smear then and they said fine and cancelled it.

Mmmm, I am sure I am going to get flamed....

If you have too many children to be able to care for them while going to the GP, or unable to leave them with somebody, maybe you simply have too many children?

Why on Gods green earth should it be necessary to take 3 kids to the gp if you are unwell, or if one of the kids are unwell?

Double buggies, and any buggy littering the floors of waiting rooms are a nuisance.

There is a surgery in Wokingham in a Tudor Building - tiny original doors and no parking at all apart from nearby pay & display! It has no shortage of Patients though.

Our surgery recently spent a small fortune having automatic wider doors fitted just because a lot of our surveys showed that people wanted to get their buggies in. Not all surgeries have this money available though.

Companions: non-patients. So it could be the spouse of a patient, who may of course have their own mobility/sensory issues, especially if elderly. It may be children of a patient (if babies/toddlers then particular mobility and communication issues), or parents of a patient (who may or may not be healthy themselves).

I would describe children as dependents rather than companions.

What an odd turn of phrase.

QS you don't think I should have had my children?

I suspect that is what some of the people on here were hinting at TBH with me and the others who have difficulties.

Why does that not surprise me?

I don't really care what you describe them as. To me, anyone accompanying a patient to the doctors, for whatever reason, is a companion. An attending dependent is simply a subset of this group.

A companion implies someone who is along to keep you company. Companion - company - see?

Many people don't have any choice but to bring their children.

It does seem a little surprising that there are so many parents who cannot cope with the number of singleton children they have below nursery age.

QS please elaborate.

There are women on this thread who feel unable to attend the GP with a toddler and a baby because of various issues including post-natal mental health issues. You have just said that these women should not have had children if they were not going to be able to manage. Is that what you mean.

SQ, not if you are unable to cope doing everyday things such as visiting your GP, either with your children with you, or placed elsewhere.

But, saying that is like locking the door after the horse has escaped, right?