In wanting to tell my friend her children are rude

[misspedantic]

I've just found this site and I'm loving the feedback I've had from other post. This problem is ongoing and I'm hoping for some advice...

About 2 months ago a friend called me to say she was upset that one of her friends has call her 6yr old ds and her 8yr old dd rude.

At first I was on her side, saying that her friend was rude for saying that. But over the past few weeks I have notice how rude they actually are and that she says nothing to them when they are being rude. The don't talk to adults, even if you ask them a question and she never pulls them up about this but instead answers for them.

examples:

1. we were out and her dd turned to her mother and asked when are they (meaning me and my dd) going home. I said that was a very nice thing to say but my friend said nothing to her dd.

2. we were on the train and her children didn't want to sit next to my dd which made her cry. When I finally had enough I told them to stop making a fuss and sit down, my friend said nothing. When they had sat down her dd kept on moving away from my dd saying "her coat is touching me".

3. the other day her dd whispered something into her mother ear. I heard my name and asked what she had said. My friend said "oh nothing". I then turned to her dd and told her that it was rude to whisper about people. Again my friend said nothing.

The problem is, my friend has mentioned that she doesn't think her children are rude. Other people have mentioned it to me, even without me saying anything to them. The next time she brings it up WIBU in saying "well yeah they are".

I couldn't/wouldn't spend time with children like that and a parent that didn't discipline them or pull them up for rude behaviour.

If I were you OP I would just start to keep a distance from them

Don't bother with her or her kids. Your child doesn't enjoy their company, you find it stressful and rude. Let the friendship go and concentrate on other less annoying people.

I told mine from a young age that even if you feel shy, it's only polite to say 'hello' and 'thank you' to the lollypop lady or whoever.... shyness is all too easily developed into actual absence of social skills, and we do our children no favours by letting this happen.

Anyway, they can't be that shy if they went on and on about OP's daughter's coat touching theirs all the way.

The Christmas thing was more about her dc making my daughter cry and her not saying anything. I didn't shout, I just got angry and walked off and didn't say anything for most of the day. It was a couple of months ago this all started and I notice that her children were becoming increasingly rude. There have been other things that they have done but I ignore them. The "when are they going home" thing was when we went to Westminster Abbey. We were walking around and her dd just turned to her mum and said that. I was so upset.

I'm not the scary cross lady as I've known them most of their lives. Once we went to a coffee shop and I bought her dd a hot chocolate. When I asked if it tasted good she just looked at me and then "shhhh" me when I gave up waiting for an answer and asked my dd if hers was nice... because I was interrupting her reading her book. AND then grunted everytime anyone spoke.

I would never put up with that from my own daughter.

That all sounds like normal child behaviour - except that the mother should have said something at each occassion.

Perhaps rather than saying that they are rude, say to her when the situation presents itself (which it sounds like it will) that you were upset that she didn't say anything to chastise her child/ren.

Although this may be harder to say than the fact her children are rude!

I think I'd be looking for new friends by now.

My best friend was exactly like this with her kids. Her philosophy was if the insult etc. wasn't directed at her but someone else they were entitled to chastise her kids and leave her out of it. Which is fair game I suppose. Plus her kids were rude little shites very trying.

I ended up quite enjoying it to be honest

hahaha

I think that's a cop-out philosophy, MissF. Most people's good manners will mean that they would hesitate to intervene. And also, why should they? It has the potential to cause confrontation with the child, and to cause ill-feeling between the adults - why should the other adult bear that responsibility?

Altho OP, it sounds as though you arent' backwards in coming forwards in that respect ;)

I think it's time to leave this friendship alone. If you want to see the mum alone (if she means that much to you) then see her without the DCs.

I had to do this recently with a wonderful friend and her 'rude' outspoken daughter. The daughter would say things like '(My DD) keeps following me' (on a walk in a park - what else could my DD do!) or not allowing my DD to play with anything other than the most unappealing toys in the house. She'd whisper constantly to the mum while we were around. All the things your friends kids are doing really. Weirdly, my friend tells me she really likes us. It's definitely not obvious to me.

After a bit I realised that if her DD seemed to despise my DD so much I was being abusive to my DD making her play with someone who thought so little of her.
I used to come away from the playdates feeling a little unhappy. I'd much rather see friends who make me feel good about myself.
I'd gently avoid her. If she wants to know why I'd say 'I get the feeling your DCs aren't too keen on mine. Perhaps it's best to give them a little time apart."

HTH

ooh I have a friend with kids like this rudelittlebuggers
totally totally with you on this one!
though I also am not sure what to do. tbh, last few times I've just spoken my mind (tho I am a teacher, so can use the old 'oh I hope you're not like this at school young lady' line!)

Parenting is obviously an art, not a science - what's acceptable to one, is unacceptable to another. Just be pleased it's not you who will have to deal with the crap that comes when they're teenagers!!!! Rude little so and sos at 5....cute? Hmm..not so cute when they're 15!

I can't believe people think it's ok for their children not to speak to when spoken to by an adult. I see mine as people in their own right, not little extensions of me, why would I speak for them? If someone asks them 'do you like school?' or 'what's your favourite toy?' they need to answer politely (unless really shy and under 6). Similarly, they need to ask for what they want in shops and restaurants politely and looking at the person. To me, this is socialization, and the fact some people think it's odd for children to speak to adults (but fine to whisper/mumble/say rude things) explains why there are so many rude children around!

Some of this reminds me of exerpts I have read from that "French Children Don't Throw Food" book. The author claims that when a french family visit all the children are expected to say Bonjour, they are not allowed to slide in under the radar and expect their parents to do all the pleasantries on their behalf.

BTW I thought OP's earlier examples of their behaviour could just be classed mainly as childishness or shyness but the scene in the coffee shop was extremely rude and there is no way a child of 8 should have been allowed to get away with that.

I'm surprised at all the posters saying this is normal, childish behaviour. IMO it is incredibly rude.

MissFaversham we had friends like that. They would say things like "She knows the rules at home but different houses have different rules and it's not our place to discipline her in your home, it's yours."

Then they would watch the worst behaviour with calm and indulgent smiles, safe in the knowledge that most people felt too uncomfortable to do much about it.

Until the point their daughter put a biscuit on the floor for our dog to eat and then kicked her in the face when she went to get it. I told her off and they were very offended. I don't remember exactly what they said but it was along the lines of "It's just a dog, X is a CHILD, what's wrong with you?"

You should have a problem with your friend not pulling her kids up on their manners not the kids, as you said.

She'll only get the hump if you say something as she is obviously blind to the fact they are behaving badly.

The trouble is you'll need the tact of a Nobel Peace Prize winner to tell your friend her parenting skills are rubbish.
I have a dear friend who shares custody of his children, his parenting style is fairly close to my own but his ex-wife's is more like that of your friend, and it's beginning to show on the elder child, who used to be very close to mine in primary days. We now don't meet unless it's at a time when the children aren't around, my dds simply don't want to spend an hour of their life they'll never get back being ignored and insulted, the little madam's dad doesn't want to spend the time telling his daughter off and apologising for her, and I just find it embarrassing.

being shy = being SELF conscious

dc need to be taught to be conscious of OTHERS

ie you overcome your own discomfort to acknowledge other person (otherwise you are putting your comfort before theirs)

May take a while but it can be taught through practice/role-play/showing good example

Tis one of my bugbears this...!!!

Oh yes - to get back to original question ...

You could tell your friend about her about her dc's rudeness but I doubt your friendship will recover. It's a shame but there you are.

Yes, your friends children are rude. Some parents are blind to their DC's unpleasant manners. If my DDs acted in such a way when they were small, there would have been words.

yanbu, but she doesn't sound like she'd take it well :o

I know a few parents like this and it's frustrating. I kind of see it as part of my role as parent to guide my children in the how they treat others, and pull them up on it if they are being rude/mean etc.
Most children (including my own little darlings ) have the potential to be rude if they aren't told otherwise. Perhaps even most people..

If I were you, and I liked the friend, I would probably not want to offend her so would just keep visits short and infrequent until her children improve with time (which happens :)). If her children are consistently mean to yours, you might consider seeing her without the kids.

I agree except, like another poster, I have an extremely shy DS who will not generally speak to other adults (unless he has a lot of time to warm up). He finds it hard to speak to children his own age. I find it very embarrassing and difficult when meddling adults try to force him to speak as it pushes him into his shell, and I have to apologise or explain in front of him, which doesn't help the situation. So I generally breezily pretend I haven't noticed, as I'd rather not add to his pain.

I have a friend like this. There have been a few occasions where her elder DD has been really rude to my DD and the mum hasn't told her off. I've felt quite upset about it because I would always tell my DD off if she said something nasty to another child. We've more or less stopped seeing them - I see my friend occasionally but my DD has stopped mixing with her kids.

My bils children are like that. It drives me nuts. I make a big deal of my dd's saying please and thank you and responding to adults appropriately. No one else in dh's family seems to bother. I'm sick of talking to the children and being ignored and never hearing thank you for gifts. Rude!

I'd ditch this 'friend' OP, your dd shouldn't have to put up with them!