to ask all the skint and struggling people: what would help you the most?

[dreamingbohemian]

I think it's clear that a lot of people are struggling right now. I'm on the thread about parents going without food and it's terrible what some people are going through.

It's also clear that there are a lot of judgmental attitudes, and that the government is not all that interested in tackling the problem.

But you can also see a lot of people are sympathetic and want to help, and are horrified that we are returning to a situation where people have to go without food.

There have been a number of good ideas on that thread, but I thought it might be good to start a new thread to not just talk about the problem, but about how we can all try to do something about it -- whether it's signing petitions, putting pressure on the government, or volunteering or donating in our local communities.

So AIBU to start by asking people who are struggling right now to talk about the top one or two things that would help them out the most? So that we are not focusing our attention on things that might not be the most helpful?

Or, on the flip side, is anyone engaged in anything right now that seems to be helping a lot of people?

I don't want to just be horrified, I want to do something...

Tax evasion makes me really angry. I know people with offshore bank accounts, living in huge houses that they didn't pay stamp duty on paying private school fees and yet they aren't even going to lose their CB because they are only declaring salaries of £30k. The sad thing is they don't even see how what they are doing is wrong.

Does MN still have a 'For Free Or Postage' thread?

I often have things that my DC are finished with and could list them. Most things I tend to sell on ebay and put the proceeds towards whatever the DC need next but often there are things that will only sell for 99p and I'd rather give it to someone who really needs it, especially once you have paid PayPal fees!

It's fucking appalling, is what it is! I just don't understand it. I don't understand how we are in this situation, I don't understand how we can be living through such dreadful times without even the merest acknowledgement of what real normal responsible people are having to do to make ends meet and most of all I don't understand why we are in a situation where normal ordinary people on 'minimum' wage can be so badly off. Minimum wage is a bloody joke. Housing costs and childcare make it ridiculous. How on earth can people even afford to work if they have children on what is supposed to be a living wage? I am lucky enough to be part of a family where we earn between us nearly three times the minimum wage and we are still not rich (in the sense of not having to worry about money; obviously we are well off compared to the majority of people but we are still counting our pennies). It is absolutely ridiculous. And I am RICH! In terms of having more money coming in that the vast majority of the UK. What the hell is the rest of the country doing and why can't we do something about it? Food banks, while admirable, are not the answer. It is absolutely awful that they are needed at all when you consider how rich our country is in comparison to the rest of the world. There is something seriously fucked up about the whole system.

Sorry. I just, really, my heart genuinely hurts for how things are for people in this country at the moment and I feel so angry about it all. Also, that is totally not me bragging about being rich, just honestly I don't get how people are meant to be able to cope when the world is set up in such a way that everything is conspiring against them.

I think we need a revolution!

Also the watersure scheme, do a search on your water boards site. They will cap water bills

I think your posts are lovely Haberdashery - and completely to the point of this thread.

You made me feel better anyway to see someone who cares, who thinks something is wrong with the way things are, and who is angry about it.

& - not a combination of emoticons you often see together ?

haberdashery you've got me all pumped up now

I'm right behind you sista, wavin me virtual banner and everyfink!

I have tried several times to give things away via freecycle and can never get on their website. I've just tried again after reading this thread and it keeps timing out again.

We live in a reasonably nice area but very close to a very deprived town yet there seems to be no food bank. There are, I'm sure, a lot of people like me who would like to help if it was more obvious how to do it.

I do think it's awful that we even have to have this conversation though. This government is playing the "divide and rule" thing very craftily and too many people are falling for it. As long as we squabble between public sector and private sector, etc we are all drifting towards the bottom while only the rich prosper.

Heh, thanks, Juggling and MyDog. I just read stuff like this every single day on MN and elsewhere and the whole thing just makes me simultaneously incredibly angry and moved to the point of tears. I do not see how the world/country can carry on like this. I think we are somehow doing everything so badly that we are basically setting an entire cohort of families up for failure. How on earth can this be? We, collectively, as a nation, are rich beyond the wildest dreams of the vast majority of the planet and there are still good people having to make the choice between feeding their children and feeding themselves.

It's just saddening and horrifying beyond measure. And frankly, I don't blame the families who think 'fuck it, we'll have fish and chips' when they could have lentils and rice and pay half the amount or less. If you're cold and hungry and miserable, nobody wants a carrot and a slice of bread. You want a big fatty salty tasty something that you didn't have to cook. We are all the way back to the Depression and George Orwell writing about how poor families didn't want to eat healthy things. Can't remember the quote offhand, but really, has nothing moved on since 1930 or whenever it was? I don't think it has, and that is dreadful.

Thanks for sharing the link to Landshare! I've just been reading there and it looks great!

I live in a tiny flat with nowhere even to put a window box and I desparately miss my old garden - fruit trees, vegetable patch etc (although not the abusive xh I shared it with) :(

I'd seriously been considering setting up a non-profit association just like this, in my city, but I really don't have time to do all the setting up etc. I'm going to ask around and see if I can find people interested in getting it off the ground, though! So many people could benefit from such a scheme!

Tranquilade. You are so right about "divide and rule". It's a shame that not everyone can see it,

while only the rich prosper

The thing is, it's worse than that! Only the insanely, crazily, never in a million years would we have to worry about money are prospering. The rest of us (and I do count myself among the rich, with our £60K+ income) are still counting the pennies and worrying about mortgages and childcare costs and the ever-rising fuel/food bills and all the rest of it. If someone like me, who is genuinely incredibly fortunate is in a situation where I have to worry about money, then the 88% or whatever (more?) of the UK who earn less than we do must be even worse off and that is awful. Yes, I am rich compared to most people. But if the rich are worrying about money and having trouble making ends meet then something is seriously badly wrong with the entire system!

So true H

I am worried quite a lot of the time - always thinking about what jobs to go for (and/or applying for them) And we are more fortunate than many/most too

Sorry, meant to say, obviously I am well aware that my struggles with money pale into insignificance when compared with people who have the 'shall I pay the rent or buy food' dilemma (have been there, it is shit). With me, it's just a case of thinking that I can't buy the food I'd like or I can't afford to have a holiday and obviously those are luxuries. But I do think it's a valid point. Surely a family with as much money coming in as we have (compared to minimum wage) ought to be able to NOT worry about buying two chickens rather than one in the weekly shop in order that we don't go overdrawn. Surely if we are worrying about buying two chickens then other people are making much harsher choices? And if a family earning as much as we do is worrying about two chickens then what the fuck is going on? It's nuts.

Shall we storm Westminster and shoot the lot of them?

^^

I think everybody on this thread (and the other one) should e-mail a copy of both to their MP!

Yes, I think I might just do that! We all should.

I just wish the media were as interested in printing some of the stories shared on here rather than the ones about the scroungers.

If everyone accepted that everyone is just one set of circumstances away from this it would help remove a lot of the stigma.

With the jobs market the way it is and redundancies on the rise not one person is safe.

Also, as said so many times, even if you are lucky enough to get one of the illusive jobs advertised (beaeting litterally hundreds of other applicants) the average wage won't support the average living costs.

People wanting to help is absolutely vital but it isn't sustainable. We need real change. "Educating people out of poverty" is the biggest gimmick going.

Yes of course there are families who have perpetuated a why-work ethic and yes they do need educating but they are not the only ones struggling.

Perfectly intelligent people who are highly educated can also be made redundant/become disabled/have relationships end. Shit Happens!!!!

Yes! Let's storm Westminster!

I'm going to make a banner with two chickens on it

Preach it!

I think there should be a silent protest. Huge, nationwide, with children and elderly and everyone. Bizarrely, there doesn't seem to be any central point of communication and you would probably need some kind of licence to do it anyway. Things have gone very tits-up, haven't they?

I think there's a lot in the most recent posts and Habbers is really onto something. We're pretty well off as a household on paper, by any measure imaginable, but I'm currently rationing dental treatment, car servicing, school lunches, over the counter medicines, trips out of the home and all sorts of fairly routine and necessary other things.

Now I absolutely don't think I have a divine right to things other people can't afford (as I am sure you all know - I wouldn't offer up my blog if I did), but it really shocks me that I am having trouble paying the dentist, indeed have bills sitting on my credit card from previous dental treatment still (for example), and I am someone who has really played the citizenship game, and been the kind of person various governments have wanted me to be. I am married with kids. I have maximised my education, and have about as many qualifications as it's possible to get. I have always worked, predominantly in a socially aware industry (education) with top up employment in journalism and consultancy as I try to pay my way. I live a settled, organised life, eat sensibly, don't smoke, don't drink much, cycle around when I can, recycle, bring my kids up properly, do a fair bit of charitable and voluntary work every single week, etc etc etc. In other words, I am probably a poster girl for what governments say they want women to be.

(If I put my research hat on, sociologists would describe me as a 'prospective citizen' - forward looking, compliant, stable - as opposed to a 'retrospective citizen' which would be someone who is out of step with government policy).

So here I am at the age of 44, considerable worse off in relative terms than I was at 24, and recovering from a nervous breakdown because actually, if I think about it, if I really think about it, I am all used up and have nothing left to give. This feeling predates the credit crunch as I think women like me were being short changed and taken advantage of, in citizenship terms, long before the banking crisis. I have a real sense of the Coalition (and New Labour before them) slowly killing the goose that laid the golden egg, and there doesn't seem to be much any of us can do about it.

It occurs to me that Ruth Kelly stands out for having had a really good go at improving things, but it was too much even for her, and I note she now earns £200k working for a management consultancy, money she undoubtedly needs as the state was clearly unable to education her SEN kid(s) properly, despite their protestations.

The only option available to us is a completely reformed and restructured version of feminism, if you ask me. And/or maybe we should all be joining the Fawcett Society as well, and protesting through them. Something like that.

Foodbanks that didn't require 3hrs of form filling and processing before you were allowed any food.

And helping out neighbours and friends. We all go through patches of hardship and if we all help out whenever we can, everyone is better off. I have lovely neighbours with one doing everyone's lawns and hedges, another gives out fresh vegetables, I help with babysits etc etc. And just knowing I have such lovely people round is a very nice feeling.

I also had a notice from a local church offering to do any gardening/window cleaning etc for free, couldn't believe it. Thank you lovely people. The impact of kindness lasts way beyond the actual goods/service.

Tranquilade
If you're having problems with freecycle give freegle a go

Great post, Boffin.

Is part of the problem that there doesn't seem to be an alternative to the current political system? There is nothing that people can sort of hang their anger onto.

As I said, I used to run around with a lot of anarchists. I think their approach to social justice and poverty issues is great, but let's face it, most people are not going to become anarchists.

Trade unions seem to be too controversial these days. Too many people don't belong to one, and you can see whenever there is a big strike that society is very split about it.

Feminism -- well obviously men can be feminists, but too many people don't see feminism as an inclusive movement. I totally agree that feminism should be a force for change but I'm not sure its appeal can be universal enough (sadly).

So what else is there?

I'm sorry I don't know more about UK history, but could we bring back something like the Progressive movement from the early 20th century US?

We need something that is accessible and appealing to your average person.

I see so much desire for change, but it is too diffuse to make an impact.