AIBU to have one child, but not the other, baptised?

[trailingvine]

Perhaps more a WWYD...

When my daughter was baptised two years ago it was in our local village church (where we were married too), a lovely, friendly low-key place which we enjoyed attending now and again. She has four fantastic, CofE godparents and it was a wonderful day that we look back on fondly.

We now have a six month old son and would like to acknowledge his arrival in the same way however, we have since moved and our local church is (although friendly) huge and 'high' and we rarely attend as we don't feel especially comfortable there. It's not unwelcome, it's just that the services are very long, very 'smells and bells' and full to the brim. Also, the four special people (not sure if I can call them godparents) we want for our son include two atheists (neither of which 'does' double standards very well) and my daughter's godfather's wife, who is Jewish. The church would want to interview (by phone/questionnaire) the prospective godparents, so we could not chose these people for a formal baptism.

Under these circumstances, would it be unreasonable for us to have a 'faithless' welcoming party in our home instead of a baptism or should we just grit our teeth and get on with doing what we did for DD? We have spoken to a couple of interfaith ministers who can arrange a ceremony at home for us and the church warden thinks that they might still be able to do a little 'welcoming' at the church, if we decide against a formal baptism. But am I making a fuss (and potentially a fight, MIL is very evangelical) over nothing?

Any thoughts appreciated. Thanks.

I'm confused here, are you religious? Why would you want to entrust your childs moral upbringing to people who don't beleive in it?

Can you call your old church and ask if they will do it? You may be out of area, but they make exceptions for people who have ties to the church and area.

If you are a christian family and attend church, but don't have one child baptised, to be honest that is a bit unfair on your son, and might raise difficult questions for your son if he attends Sunday school or similar as to why he isn't but your sister is. If you're doing it for the pictures and the party, then a naming ceremony would be fine.

I'm just wondering firstly why you want a christening if you rarely attend church?

What is the reason you can't have the christening in your previous church?

I don't think it is a good idea to do anything that makes you feel like 'grit our teeth and get on with doing what we did for DD?'

MIL's opinion shouldn't come into it.

I like the idea of an interfaith ceremony with a little something at the church, but all this depends on your beliefs.

If having a baptism is important to you because of your faith, then that's what you should have. It also depends on what you want from 'Godparents', because what people expect from Godparents varies massively.

In your position, I would think about finding another church that you like going to if you have a faith. There is no reason you have to use your local church. However if your faith isn't particularly strong, I wouldn't bother having any sort of religious ceremony, and would just have a welcoming type party so that your dc is not affiliated to any religion and can easily choose for himself.

yes, you should give both same treatment, also what if sometime ion the future you want to attend faith school and only one child can? have a quicdkie maybe not part of a church service?

My first thought was - try a different Church if you are not comfortable with that one - both for regular worship and baptism?

I sort of get where you're coming from, but if you don't attend the / a church why are you getting them baptised? Can you not f ind another church you are happy in, you don't have to attend your local church.

I feel you've lost sight a little bit
of why you are getting your dc christened ....

You are not unreasonable to do exactly what you want.

Even if you are religious I totally understand why you'd choose good people who happen to have other faiths to be your childrens' godparents.

My eldest is Christened, because my MIL and Granny would both have been terrifically upset, propler heartbroken scared for his soul upset if he wasn't Christened... seeing as I'm not Religious and don't believe that water and a blessing will save a soul, I chose to humour them. To keep the greater peace. The service was lovely, the Vicar fantastic, and its 'nice' I suppose that my eldests gets a Christening Day card each year. He can choose whatever he wants to believe in whenever he believes in it.

My youngest isn't Christened because my lovely MIL and wonderful Granny are not of this earth anymore. They can rol their eyes and be angry from the pearly gates.

You don't have to justify yourself to anyone. If you believe, its important to you. If you don't, its not.

If you only went to church 'now and again', I don't even know why you got your first child Christened?

Was it because it was 'pretty' and you wanted to mark you child's birth?

If that's the case, you should have chosen a faithless welcoming party for that child too.

So YANBU, if you're not particularly religious it sounds like the best thing.

I meant the church was 'pretty'...I wasn't referring to your child as 'it'

Why would you want to entrust your childs moral upbringing to people who don't beleive in it?

Wincerooooonie!!!!!! Shudder!!!!

I can't speak for the OP of course but I would have not have any problem with the moral guidance of someone merely on the grounds that they did not share my faith (or in my case, lack of it) Surely, if you know a person well enough to be considering having them as a special player in your child's life you have already satisfied yourself on the 'moral' front. The church may see it differently of course but that's another matter.

Well, like others have said I am not sure why you got your first DC christened but yes YABU - you should treat them both the same.

I didnt get my DS christened/baptised or whatever....if he wants to make up his own mind and do it when he is older then fair enough but I personally wouldn't make that decision for him.

Aldi - suppose the vicar was ok with conducting the service to humour you older relatives?

I don't think some people realise that there are others involved in a baptism as well as the child, parents and godparents. There is the rest of the church congregation and the minister also.

TimeWasting I was Christened back when non-CofEs weren't allowed to be godparents. I can honestly say my would-have-been-godparent has done more for me, despite living in a different country, than any of my godparents save my cousin (who does it more out of familial love IYSWIM) and one lives down the road from my parents. I haven't seen her in years. I'd also like to point out that morals are not exclusively a Christian property and anyone who has grown up in a Western democracy will have some kind of Judeo-Christian moral background/input into their ethical code whether they believe or not.

OP, do whatever feels right for you. You can say to MIL that you know in your family, where you have faith, you can give a Christian upbringing and you have chosen the godparents who will love your DC the most. IMO that's the most important thing.

Why not have a civil welcoming ceremony instead?

Thanks for your messages, they have been really helpful.

In my first message, I probably focused too much on the church not being 'right' for us. We do sometimes attend services (about once a month) and they are very kind, it's just not the church we would necessarily choose. They are being very supportive in trying to find a solution to our little problem!

Some people asked why we would bother getting a child baptised if we are not religious. My dad is Jewish, my mum C of E, I attended Quaker meetings as a child (but was baptised) and still do sometimes (there is no equivilant ceremony for Quakers) and so I'm used to the idea of 'faith' as a complicated and individual choice. Just because I don't attend services every week, take communion or believe every aspect of the CofE doctrine (I hope) does not mean that I can't be part of that chuch. My husband was raised in the church He has lost some of his faith but still identifies himself as Cof E and so for him, some sort of acknowledgement of our child as part of that church matters. This is why our daughter was christened and why we would want a blessing forour son.

We have chosen our 'godparents' because they are interesting, good and kind people who we trust to guide and support our son through his life, not in the interests of introducing him to christan theology (MIL and my vicar BIL will do plenty of that). I just don't feel that we can ask them to lie and would feel sad to miss out on having them as godparents because of this.

I'm finding this a really hard thing to think through. I really don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, including MIL's and don't want to make anyone feel uncomfortable/hypocritical.

Thanks again for the comments.

only da1 was baptisted,none of his godparents bother with him,we felt forced into it by dhs family so we stood our ground and didnt have the others baptisted.

sorry ds1

Godparents role is to ensure you grow up god-fearing, not that any of mine tried too hard, thank goodness. It's a religious service.

Well said SarahDoctor

Have you asked the prospective godparents what they would like to do? They might be fine with it for the day.

Unless you have had a significant loss of faith in the last two years, then I would aim to find a way to have your DS christened.

Could you go back to your previous church? If it's as lovely as you say, the vicar would be welcoming. Or could you have a private christening in your current high church? It's not the preferred option from the Church's pov, but it does still exist.

Or could you seek a church which is not smells and bells? You don't have to attend your parish church, and you might find there is another nearby which fits your (or DH's) views much better and where you would feel welcome. I'm not suggesting a lurch towards a greater role for organised religion in your lives, but it does sound from your posts that you like it there in the background, and that made me wonder if a different church in your new location might provide that for you.

I feel that you should focus on you, dh, dd and ds would like as a family. Don't let MIL's wishes push you into something that's not right for your family.
It does sound like you have a complicated situation, but i think if your chosen godparents agree to their role, they should understand the commitment they are making. They are adults and can refuse if they are uncomfortable with what they are being asked to do. I don't think it is a godparent's role to introduce your son to christian theology but as you say to guide and support him through life.

The role of Godparents is to help the child grow in their faith. Whilst they may be good, kind, lovely people, if they are not of the same faith or have none at all then how can they possibly fulfil that role? Not to say they cannot be there to support the children in every other aspect of their lives.

I think you are confused though. You seem quite flexible with your beliefs which is great for you, but baptism does not work like that. If you are serious about baptising a child into the C of E then you have to accept the rules they have in place.

Perhaps the interfaith service at home would be more for you. A 'welcoming' service into the church also sounds nice but bear in mind this is not the same as a formal baptism so would not be counted if you wanted to go down the faith school route later on.

Can't you go back to your old church for it? I don't believe in infant baptism myself but I thought you could book it anywhere you liked as long as you knew the vicar and they trusted that you were doing it for the right reasons.

WRT having atheist 'godparents', I don't see why people find that problematic? Just because someone doesn't have faith in a particular religion doesn't mean they can't support someone else to have faith in it or to follow its' moral precepts. I trust (one of) my daughters dads to provide them with a moral example despite being an atheist. I also know lots of atheists who I believe to be better humans than most Christians. Most Christians these days are extremely un-christian in my experience (being opposed to charity, taxation for redistribution to the poor, involuntary single parents, all of which are strongly protected under gospel teachings). Luckily I have Christian friends who are not like that and who I can trust to teach genuine christian morality to my children should I die or become unable to care for them, but not everyone has. Also a lovely church which is more tolerant due to being in a poor area and having a lovely vicar (though apparently they are called just ministers up here, I can't keep up with the differences between c of e/methodism (my 'home' religion) and c of s). I don't see why people can't understand that Christianity is not homogenous?