Did schools used to be like this?

[spiderslegs]

DS started school FT in January & ever since it's been a constant stream of missives, announcements, edicts & raised brow questioning from his teacher.

The first week he was there I had a constant battle with his teacher because I was sending him to school with a padded body warmer on, not a coat, every day she asked me if he 'has a coat, because we play out every day, even when it's drizzling' & yes, you do, but not WHEN IT'S PISSING DOWN. In which case his arms will get slightly damp, as will his legs & face, how would you like me to mitigate against that, full dry suit & mask?

It was warmish & sunny, biblical floods were not on the horizon .

Consequently, EVERY CHUFFING DAY it's been something, last week was battle of the drinks, they have a school issued water bottle (irritating in itself) which I sometimes put in, he has milk at break & a drink for lunch, I was taken aside twice for not giving him a drink - I had he just didn't arsing drink it, maybe they should have asked him to look in his bag again?

Would you like me to pop in a few times a day to ensure he has fulfilled his government recommended level of fluid intake - WOULD YOU?

On Friday the lovely mum that drops him off sheepishly told me teacher asked her to mention she did NOT LIKE HIS SHOES, they are difficult to do up apparently - I'm sorry, I'll get him some M&S footgloves shall I?

Today's final straw was the letter from the eco-co-ordinator that asked me to reduce waste in his lunch box & that they would be speaking to the children about waste in their lunches THEN COLLECTING & COMPARING THAT WASTE - so you'd like to make my son feel like a miscreant & social pariah because he has a Baby-bel rather than a dried up hunk of cheddar planed from a block would you???

So AIBU to want to run through the school screaming - 'I AM A FREE BORN HUMAN BEING - MY CHILDREN ARE FREE BORN HUMAN BEINGS - I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TEACH THEM MATHS, & READING & SPELLING BUT LEAVE THE REST OF IT TO ME PLEASE'

Am I ?

The assumption that schools need to parent children shows a basic distrust of parents and an assumption that the state knows best. It is up to me to parent my child and like 99% of parents I am perfectly capable of doing so. Picking over the eco credentials of four year olds' lunchboxes is deeply patronising. The school system can start faffing about with eco co-ordinators when every child in the UK leaves school fully literate and numerate.

"Mould the fuckers - they're just future eco-bots anyway aren't they?

They're not people - they're just small eco-minded future consumers with bad grammar (& suitable shoes).

I JUST WANT YOU TO TEACH THEM HOW TO DO SUMS."

That actually made me laugh out loud. OP, YANBU, but you're going to have to get used to it: the government long ago latched onto state education as a prime delivery system for the latest stupid social engineering fad and we're a long way down the slippery slope.

You're going to have to home educate, go private, or else get used to the fact that your child is being indoctrinated into a system of pettifogging, micromanaging nanny-stateism that assumes a) you are a litigous cretin and b) your (probably soluble) child can hope at best to grow up standards-compliant.

I think she's got a fair point on some of it.

A few years ago DS2 started not flushing the toilet at home. Berated over it he said that at school they'd been told that after a wee they didn't need to as it wasted water. He now flushes again. I think the OP has more than a point on the Eco remarks.

We recycle, seperate, choose cars based on ecomy as well as other criterea, we grow veggies, and are pretty good on the Eco front. But we flush bloody toilets!

Blimey! So you want to take him out of the school for that??

As regards the lunch refuse - they are an Eco School, which you knew about, so they will be shit hot on all that malarkey.
The other things may be an irritant but my 11 year old has trouble tying his shoelaces even now and believe me it's a pain in the arse. Embrace the velcro i say!!

It is very early days. Stop seeing everything as a personal battle. It is a bit overwelming at first but it settles down. As time goes on it's best to pick your battles and these really aren't worth being stressed over.

ok, take that back about Autumn! I was getting so indignant cos I thought people hadn't read it properly. That'll show me.

OP, if he has only been in school what 3 or 4 weeks, I think you need to give it a bit of time!

And if your DS started in Jan, and most of them started in Sept, then surely the teacher is just making sure you are up to speed with the rules. Maybe she did it with all the other teachers in Sept?

Tell her you are working on tying the laces and maybe she could do a lesson on it, to help them all

Meh. I take it this is the first child you've sent to school?

Really, none of these things are a Big Deal. Send him in his body warmer if you want but buy a cag-in-a-bag thing to keep on his peg. They're not expensive, he has a shower-proof coat in school and it gets the teacher off your back.

The less waste in lunchbox thing is something our school is keen on. It works out cheaper in the end tbh!

If your child can't do up his own shoes he shouldn't be wearing them to school. Teachers have better things to do than tie 30 odd or whatever pairs of laces after PE.

And the drinks thing, well yes they have a duty to make sure kids in their care are well looked after, this includes ensuring they've drunk enough. And yep, I agree they should have asked him to check again before hassling you. Or made him have a drink from his water bottle with lunch, which is what happens at ds's school.

I dunno, I get the impression they'd 'pick on you' less if you did as they asked. I presume they gave you information re suitable clothing and footwear at enrolment like they do at other schools? Not their fault if you don't want to conform.

I don't understand why you find it so hard to put a coat with sleeves on him?? Perhaps he's complained that he's cold to his teacher.

When my DS started pre school in 2006 and they requested that we put velcro fastening shoes on them so that the children can do them up themselves, it saves time surely.

All schools are on about reducing waste so that is no shocker.
I actually think you've blown some things out of proportion and you're being a bit hard work. None of these things are major issues except you refusing to make things a little easier ie the shoes.

You are being hard work. All they want is a water bottle, a proper coat and shoes he can manage on his own. It's not a lot to ask.

The lunchbox police are an irritation, yes. There are loads of threads on here. Consensus is usually that although we all find it irritating, it is worthwhile as a tool to enable schools to minimise waste and obesity in society as a whole. In a school, rules have to be for all, not just those whose mums don't know it all.

The coat I agree with. 2 breaks and lunchtime they will get wet. Also kickers are a nightmare to put on. Even my 6 year olds have Velcro trainers.

The rest sounds petty (our schools sound very similar).

spiderlegs can your son do his own laces??? if not then you can't say have we become that useless because you clearly have if you buy shoes with laces for your DS and then don't teach him how to do them up!!

You are being a hard work parent.

Do you really think that teachers do this stuff just to annoy you and undermine your parenting decisions. They don't.

You many feel like you are being nagged by emails and newsletters reminding you to send your child in with a coat and a water bottle, but schools will often send out generic things like this for the benefit of one or two parents who consistently don't bother.

I know you said that the teacher pulled you up on it personally, but at least she is making sure you know the rules. Your child's water shouldn't be in his bag, and if it is, it's your responsibility to make sure he knows it's there so that when everyone else is getting a drink or he's thirsty he knows where to find it. Your child clearly didn't know. That's why most schools have snack trays, or a specific place to put their water.

You are spectacularly wrong about the shoe thing.

As an aside, It is ridiculous that teachers, TAs and parent helpers are having to teach children how to dress themselves in PE. So many children come into school without any idea of how to put skirts or trousers on by themselves, no idea how to begin to try and turn an inside out t shirt the right way round, no idea how to take a jumper off. These are jobs that parents should be doing, not school staff.

So you've decided to deprive your DS of the experience of going to school just because you can't cope with the same rules as everybody else? If your attitude towards your son's teachers has been as uncooperative, confrontational and self regarding as your posts on this thread, then it won't have gone unnoticed.

If you intend to take your child out of school you will have to write to them formally. Don't imagine it will be that easy. Your unwillingness to comply with the school's simple, straightforward requirements will have been noted, and they will no doubt trigger an informal enquiry by the Local Authority.

I'm afraid that if you go through life being antagonistic and spoiling for a fight, you will occasionally end up in a fight you cannot win.

I feel sorry for your son, having to suffer the consequences of your emotional immaturity, lack of perspective and poor judgement.

Solution to the shoe lace issue - elastic laces (£2 from Sports Direct)

tbh when I and my kids were young it was expected that one of the things theyw ould be able to do was put on their own shoes. i seem to remember getting a letter about things your child should be able to do before they start school. And it had on it tie their laces or if they couldn't have velcro or slip on shoes.

But I seem to remember most kids could tie their laces?

olgaga:
If you intend to take your child out of school you will have to write to them formally. Don't imagine it will be that easy. Your unwillingness to comply with the school's simple, straightforward requirements will have been noted, and they will no doubt trigger an informal enquiry by the Local Authority.

As a matter of fact, it is very easy and will trigger no enquiry from the LA. All the OP needs to do is to write to the school to say that she wants her DS removed from the register. The (mainstream) school must remove the child immediately and tell the LA within 10 days. The LA may (but will not necessarily) then contact the OP to ask about the arrangements she has made for the DS's education. If that happens, the sensible thing to do is to join a home-educating group (on email or in RL) or post on the home ed board.

That's it.

FWIW I agree with you OP, but I can see why the rules are there - it is the nature of large group, state sponsored education. They will work to the lowest common denominator and assume that you are a 'litigious cretin' (great quote up thread!) and that you need to have everything spelled out to you. With a class of 30, you do need to make sure your DS can do up his own shoes. If you can't, he can't be in a class of 30! We home ed, but most of my family are teachers and I can see how impossibly bound they are by time constraints, resources and class sizes.

It isn't complex at all to de-register. The LA aren't waiting to pounce on you. You just write to the school, find some other people doing the same for support and away you go!

Hmmm, I may be unhinged, if so I am joyously thus.

Blimey Olgaga, they've got you good & proper, do you really think me taking my son out of school would trigger a formal enquiry by the LA? Cripes, best not do that then, they might raid my house & discover me eating custard creams in bed rather than busily sorting my plastics out in the officially proscribed manner.

PS Ohthehuge, pettifogging - love that word, I will do my utmost to incorporate it into at least two sentences today.

SDeuchars That's in normal circumstances. If the school thinks there is a problem, they will can inform the Local Authority which may trigger an informal enquiry.

The LA may (but will not necessarily) then contact the OP to ask about the arrangements she has made for the DS's education.

That is an informal enquiry. Depending on what the school has said, it may be a tick-box check, it may be more rigorous.

Spiderslegs in your haste to argue you misread my post. I said informal enquiry. If you don't satisfy that, particularly against a background of you taking your child out of school for the absurd reasons you have given, it may lead to a school attendance order.

I'm sure the school will inform you of all the pettifogging rules which will apply to you.

All for the sake of a coat, a water bottle and velcros shoes!

& what form would a 'formal enquiry' take? Really? Are you actually telling me that people who have views that may not be acceptable to the administration are investigated, found wanting & justly punished?

Interesting, I always took Orwell to be a writer of fiction.

Olgaga you are right, I did misread & take my last two posts back (a little bit).

However, if you think it's for the sake of shoes & coats you completely & wantonly misconstrue my whole point.