to think this shouldn't be MY fight?

[girlynut]

DP's mum and step-dad have a barn conversion in La Rochelle, France. Bought as a dump a decade ago and have done up to a beautiful standard with 3 bedrooms, 3 receptions, patio, garden and swimming pool. My MIL put in most of the money (she's partner in a law firm) and her husband did most of the building decorating work as that's his trade.

We've been there several times before, with in-laws and without, both before and after having our 2 DSs. My parents have taken friends there. DP and I have taken my brother and his wife down. So far, so good.

BUT this year I asked MIL if we could use the house for a week in Aug and take my cousin, her husband and 2 children, as they haven't had a holiday since before children were born and money is tight for them. As the children are similar in age (7yo, 6yo, 3yo and 3yo) I envisaged them all playing in the pool while we got piddled drank wine on the patio.

MIL said yes so I merrily arranged dates with cousin and booked flights. MIL now tells me that her husband says we can't go! Reasons range from "it's for family only" (even though they rent to complete strangers), "I've put a lot of work into it and don't want things broken" (we've never damaged anything before and would obviously replace any breakages) to "it's my house and i say so!"

MIL is incensed and was very upset. She dotes on my DP (her only son), me and her grandkids and I think her husband is a little jealous, as he doesn't see much of his son and grandson who live in Germany. She told me we'd have to talk her husband around and that if he refused she'd divorce him because she's so fed up with him making her feel bad about her entire family. (She's from a large Indian family and has many siblings who he doesn't seem to like)

She's now cleared off to Egypt with her sister for a fortnight and told me I'd have to discuss it with her husband and get him to agree the trip. AIBU to think she should sort this out? She said yes, after all, and surely as the one who put all the money into the property she should be able to agree who visits? Don't see why I should have to deal with the mean-spirited arsehole.

Sorry for length of post...

Why cant your partner deal with his stepfather?

Why does she need his permission to let you use the house?

DP says I should sort it out because I booked the flights without confirming details with FIl - stupidly I assumed that MIL's go ahead would be sufficient!

I don't think she should need his permission - it belongs to both of them. But she's a bit of a wuss and takes the softly softly approach. I'm more likely to speak my mind and tell him what I think of his pettiness - that's why I don't think I should be the one to resolve the situation with him.

well if the flights are booked.. someone is going to have to take the bull by the horns and deal with it..

Given he put in the hard graft, I think he's entitled to feel proprietorial about the house, as clearly it's their joint effort (she put in the money, he put in the labour). In fact, whether he had or hadn't worked on it, if it's their joint house, it just is - it isn't anyone else's business who paid for it or who did the decorating/building. She just sounds totally fed up with other stuff she has to deal with from him, unrelated to this house. This may be the straw that is breaking the camel's back and she wants to wash her hands of it. Fair enough, I think. She's done her bit, it's your holiday with your family, what more could she reasonably do other than say "fine by me!"? Given it's their house and they're obliging you by letting your family (ie not their own immediate family) use it with you, the least I should think you could do is organise the use of it. All you need to do is secure his okay - I'd say that's fair cop for giving your own cousin and family a free holiday!

As for the refusal itself, actually, I can see where he may be coming from. My parents have had a holiday home for 30+ years. In the early years, when they went infrequently, they were totally open about letting people use it - often, it was people they didn't know (their kids' friends etc), when they weren't there, and they had no problem with it. However, as they started to go more often (and started to get on a bit), they just started to feel more proprietorial about it: they didn't want randoms they hadn't met sleeping in their beds, using their linen, poking about their kitchen cupboards etc. Fair do's I say - their home, they can do what they like.

You're in a bit of a bind now, though, as flights have been booked etc. Could you maybe approach the step-dad and explain that you understand his sensitivities about this place, appreciate that he doesn't want it to be used like a hostel, but kindly ask for an exception ('this one last time') given flights have been booked etc and there would be a huge financial cost (and the rest) to cancelling at this stage? Also agree with squeaky, you could get DP to do it for you.

Not a comfortable situation to be in, but I do think you may be at risk of looking a gift horse in the mouth a bit...

Sounds like you've had good use of it in the past. It is wrong that MIL has left you to it but I can understand SFIL wanting to be consulted.
If they rent it out to strangers, then perhaps he feels that he'd be missing out on rent for it? My parents have a place in France and the deal is that if we go in school holidays we pay 50% of the going rate for its use as it is effectively costing them money to let us stay there. Outside school summer holidays we pay nothing. Perhaps if you offered something towards the rent as you're taking people outside of their family?

If I were him and knew that you were talking about me like that, I'd make sure you never spent a day in it again!

She said yes without consulting him. She needs to sort out her mistake.

I hate having other peoples kids in my house because of the way some people allow their children to behave, there were some children who would be breaking everything in sight if I hadn't been running around after them, their parent always sit there looking oblivious. I never let them back when I have to do that. I would never allow a child (or adult that I didn't know very well) in my home without my presence.

Whether it's your children (and if it was I'm sure you would say they never did damage, children who do damage always have parents who don't see it) or your cousins children, he is entitled to protect the property as he has worked hard at it. Does he know your cousin? How can he know they won't wreck all his hard work? Why should he be obliged to open their home to strangers and their children that you choose to invite?

Get your own holiday home, then you can invite away.

ehmmm, you treat the place almost as if it is yours and I can see that that might grate a bit.

You or DP will have to sort it out with him.

I think you have been a little bit presumptious?

I think people's explanations of your FIL's potential reservations are fine and there could have been perfectly good reasons for your MIL and FIL to refuse.

I do agree with your view that it shouldn't be your fight though. Your MIL was very irresponsible to give you a definite answer, which it later transpires she was in no position to offer. You didn't know that she needed to talk the decision over with her husband before agreeing, until after she'd agreed. Presumably this is based on past experience of her agreeing and all being fine. Essentially she misled you and made you false promise. As a lawyer she'd know about contracts! (and is clearly feeling the moral obligation).

In reality though, she hasn't paid for the flights so it isn't her problem. She's clearly very embarassed and hadn't forseen the objection. In a way you and DP need to help dig her out of an awkward hole for the sake of her marriage. After all, her intentions towards you were kind. So in practice I think he or both of you need to talk to the FIL, telling him something about your guests, perhaps letting him meet them.

Just go - it's not like he will be there, blocking the doorway with his body is it? Just get a letter from your MiL, clearly stating (preferably in French too) that SHE owns/co-owns the property and has given permission for to stay in her property between and have her sign it. Then if SFiL gets completely arsey and phones the gendarmes, there will be nothing for them to do. If nobody says anything to him about it, he might just not even realise you've been. He can go his own sweet way thinking he's "won" and will be non the wiser.

nice approach pombear

how would you feel if someone did that to a house you owned and worked on for years and years?!

totally out of order.

Why are people so entitled?! I do despair!

Ah but I wouldn't be such an arse to my spouse's family in the first place so the situation wouldn't arise. If my DH had agreed something, even if I hated the idea and wanted to kill him for doing it, I would never shame him publicly like that. Disagreements between us would be sorted out privately. Given that the OPs MiL paid for the lion's share of the property, she should be able to say who goes there. It's not like they live there full time themselves. FiL is an arse and appears jealous of his wife's relationship with her son and his family. (now why haven't we got a nice childish tongue sticking out emoticon when I need one? )

I think you are taking advantage of their generosity, and personally would of asked fil in the first instance and not mil. My own mother often says yes to things but then on asking my dad rings me back with a no. (its their generation and way of doing things)

OP, you sound like a spoilt brat. How long after your MIL's say-so to booking the flight was there? Minutes?

My parents used to own a lovely quaint bungalow by the sea, for well over three decades and I think I only asked once to use it. Why? Because it was their sanctuary that they had paid for.

Get.over.yourself.

...and it makes me smile that you think your husband should be involved in sorting out this mess but your own SFIL should butt out??

Classic.

I would call up the fil and apologise for not asking him directly but could you use the house between xx and yy. If he has form for being difficult then you should have gone to him first but easy for me to say... You can reassure him yourself that place will be left spotless and damages would obviously be paid for. Hopefully his "wounded pride" will be appeased andhe'd say yes. Can you offer some money?

I agree that you didn't do anything wrong by assuming mil's permission was all that you needed but some couples run things by each other before saying yes. This year we had a New Year's Eve party with dh's best friends and dh checked with me before inviting then which is what O'd want.

Íf they rent to strangers, then what´s the problem with renting to your cousin?

I can see why FIL is miffed at not being asked.

I would phone him tbh.

I think this is a tricky situation, and you will probably get further if you put 'should' and 'shouldn't' to one side and be very, very diplomatic.

It sounds like what's underlying this really is some relationship difficulties between your MIL and SFIL. From what you've said, this could be conflict over the nature and extent of her family interactions. He could perhaps be feeling swamped by her extended family, and as if his wishes never count. In that case, I can see why he might see this refusal as him 'putting his foot down' about the fact that his needs/wishes keep being ignored by a strong family consensus on her side - as though she's always just assuming he'll go along with whatever her family wants to do. While he's being unreasonable, I can see why he might do it.

If I'm right, and this is about him feeling ignored, the best thing you can do is firstly not to see it as a fight, and secondly to swallow any feelings you have about who 'should' or 'shouldn't' be dealing with this and - either you or your DH, whoever seems best - go speak to your SFIL. If he's had a godawful row with your MIL he's probably feeling awful and will appreciate having someone to talk to. Tell him you're sorry that you assumed his consent, pat him on the back if he needs to have a moan about your MIL, explain the predicament you're now in re flights and everything and say that you'll respect his wishes if he still really thinks it's best if you don't go but this is where things are now and what does he think is the best solution?

I know it seems like a lot of soft-soaping, but in my experience of step-members of large and boisterous families it can be easy for the one 'marrying in' to feel very resentful and marginalised. However much it may stick in the craw, the best way forward is often to make a bit of an effort to ensure they feel acknowledged and given due consideration.

Workedoutforthebest - how sad for you and what does that say about your relationship with your parents? My folks are always delighted when we ask to use their holiday home as they know their DGC are the ones benefitting most! Families help each other out - yes some people are 'entitled' but you can take your 'unentitledness' too far....

it may not be YOUR fight but it is YOUR holiday so I wouldn't be grumbling about your mil or sfil or speculating too much on their relationship, but mending bridges and being as diplomatic as possible. It would be very hard to get another house in La Rochelle in August! Honestly, it sounds like you should talk to your sfil and offer to give some rent for the house for the time you're going. And maybe in future, wait until it is wholeheartedly offered...It all sounds a little close for comfort and disrespectful if you are actually assessing how much money your mil put into the house vs your sfil - you may not be privy to every detail of their lives or relationship, so maybe back off a little from the snidey comments

actually OTheHugeManatee said it all best!

Some very harsh comments here...You asked your MIL as one of the joint home-owners, she gave permission for you to use the house and now some people are saying your a spoilt, selfish cow.

I'd understand if you'd never bothered to ask either your MIL or sFIL but you had permission to use the house why should you pacify him. It's firmly your MIL's problem, she shouldn't have agreed if she knew her husbands feelings on the matter. Either she needs to get him to agree or refund your flights