to be upset with what my child is learning at school / WWYD?

[IteotYEARawki]

My older boy is 5 and in his 3rd term of school so far (year 1).

He has learned that Guy Fawkes was hung, drawn, quartered and then burned on a bonfire.

That hundreds of people had their heads chopped off with a guillotine.

And the latest - that Anne Franks hid from the SS behind a bookcase, that people were marched off to concentration camps and that thousands, including children, were killed by gassing. And that the children were told they were going to have a shower when they were taken to the gas chamber.

There has been a museum display on Anne Franks & her life in town which was advertised on the radio - DS1 overheard it and started telling us all that he'd learned about it at school. Apparently his teacher has visited a concentration camp and described it, including the rooms full of boxes of bones.

I don't deny that history needs to be taught and that the Holocaust is part of it. But this graphic detail, at 5?

We already had a chat with his teacher after the Guy Fawkes thing. I don't think I'm being precious in not wanting him exposed to this stuff so soon. It'll take about 3-4 months for him to process through it all and then we'll have inconsolable crying at night while the horror hits him.

AIBU? Should we talk to his teacher again, or chat with the principal?

Ds was 7 when they learned about Anne Frank - scared him shitless and didn't sleep properly for weeks, which I suppose is the whole point. I think a year later would've been more suitable.

I used to work as a school secretary. One day a parent barged into the office and stated "I don't wan't 'im learnin' about the Hollycaust 'cos some of 'is family is Jewish!"

Mine read every horrible history book he could get his hands on between the age of 6 and 7. He also told me all about guy fawkes at 5 years old. he hasn't mentioned the holocost yet though and hes 8 now.

I also think 5 is too young for such detail-although difficult if they are asking for it?

We went to Bergen Belson a few years before either of ours started 2ndry school (at 10) though & they were both really interested in it.

It does sound more like KS2 level history. DD is in Yr1. They have covered World Wars 1 and 2 in very brief detail to enable them to understand why we wear poppies for November 11th. DD didn't really understand (she's too young for it to make much impact on her yet) and I'm sure they will return to these subjects in more depth when the children are older and better able to understand.

I was taken to visit Dachau by my parents when I was at school, and that left a lasting memory. We'll probably do something similar for DD and DS when they're old enough too.

OP I agree with you completely.
My son has been told about Fawkes and WW1 but certainly without all the distressing details, he is in reception.

I really think your child's school is being unreasonable.

Op I think you are making more of this than your child is I took son to see horrible history's live I was on the edge of my seat and found it a bit much son loved it and was whooping and cheering when the scalping began

I think op this is a issue with your child and their sensitivity not a issue with the school

And why are we choosing to tell the story of Guy Fawkes to our children from as young as 4?

There are so many things we could be teaching them about our history. Seems rather Protestant and anti-Catholic to me. Is this really the most important thing for them to be learning about at 5 ? Can't we move on a bit ?
Fair enough at ten they could be learning about religious intolerance and political factions in a useful way, but at 5 I really feel there's huge potential for doing more harm than good. ( ie. The Catholics were the baddies who wanted to blow up parliament )

We did all that at primary school nearly 30 yrs ago. Hasn't damaged me too much...

I must admit to being quite surprised to go into our Yr1 classroom on parents enening in November to see that their topic for that half term was 'The Titanic' -how do you cover the death by drowning of hundreds of people in icy waters in an age appropriate way and what value does it have (other than making a lovely display of boat pictures)?

Juggling because of Bonfire Night!

IME, the religious element is left out of it.

The whole history of celebrating the 5th of November is hugely anti-catholic. Also I think it is confusing for children that we now call it Guy Fawkes Night.

When I was a nipper I thought the whole thing was a celebration of the attempt to blow up parliament (appealed to the revolutionary in me). I was most disappointed when I discovered it was really about maintaining the status quo, execution and burning effigies of catholics. Pretty complex and violent stuff for small children to compute.

"Hasn't damaged me too much ... "

Never did me any harm ...

(where have I heard that before ?)

Disagree completely maypole1 Just because your DS reacts a particular way to Horrible History doesn't mean that another person's 5yo has something wrong with them because they are sensitive to hearing details of children being killed in the Holocaust. Kids are different and develop at different speeds. As you said - you were on the edge of your seat feeling it was a bit much. This is because you have developed an adult sense of empathy. Some children develop that strong sense of empathy early, before they have the coping skills to deal with it. Whereas some kids develop the coping skill of keeping things at a distance earlier, before they've developed an adult's sense of empathy with others. Those kids don't struggle with graphic content, but they might struggle with understanding the suffering of the people involved until they are older. There isn't anything wrong with either pattern of development as far as I'm aware.

juggling damnit, I knew someone would say that! Not criticising, was just in my head as I was typing .

To be honest OP, all that matters is whether you think it's unreasonable, not what a gaggle of mners think. Talk directly to the teacher - they may be able to set your mind at rest, or at least give the rationale behind it.

YANBU, completely inappropriate to do this in school at that age.

It's not necessarily inappropriate for a child to be told about, but children vary very much in the effect it will have on them. My dd would be able to process it without it affecting her, my ds would be having nightmares and think it was going to happen to him.

Hiya cookingfat Glad you didn't take it too hard - I have a cheeky streak !

I think the reason that some people think this is a bit precious is that even if you limit the gory stuff for your first, the poor second -third fourth wherever you stop-- child gets to see all of this aged 2 upwards as their older sibling watches Horrible Histories programmes, plays 'killing people' in the playground or whatever.

Having said that, for some five year olds, the gruesome stuff is really not ok. I censored a book about Celtic sacrifices (it was a book on the Romans) when my dd1 was about 5/6 and wrote what an inappropriate reading book it was in her reading record. Two years later, and she can discuss the darker side of life with much more comprehension.

I was utterly terrified by a couple of images (of ghosts, things like that) when I was little and I can still see them in my mind's eye now...

"Op I think you are making more of this than your child is I took son to see horrible history's live I was on the edge of my seat and found it a bit much son loved it and was whooping and cheering when the scalping began "

Now that would worry me!

Interestingly, In Holland children only read Anne Frank's diary in secondary (12+) school.

They don't actually read it here in primary schools - they learn about it.

I think it's a bit young, I'm only now getting to discuss the wars and the holocaust with my 9 yr old. I remember when I first learned of the holocaust, saw the pictures etc, I was very upset about it.

Aren't there guidelines somewhere for what is taught when?

I remember being haunted by visions of William Wallace being hung drawn and quartered (fortunately it didn't mention the disembowelling whilst still alive bit) but I was old enough to read the story myself so older than DS.

Looks like you have just been landed with a freaky teacher who chooses to focus on these things.

Hopefully the next one will be nicer.

My Mum taught me about Anne Frank and the Holocaust when I was about 9, and the school told her I was too young! DS1 is 7, year 2, and has learnt about Guy Fawkes, but that's all.